Defoe and Pav

[yusrisafri]

I dont know whether this has been pointed out or not, but of the 5 games that Defoe and Pav have started as the 2 strikers, we have won every single match!(Bolton, Everton, Blackburn, Arsenal and Chelsea )

And the only other time where they have both been on the field at the same time was against Leeds, where Pav came on for Crouch and partnered Defoe upfront, and scored within minutes after coming on.

Now that is by no means a coincidence isnt it? They definitely have to be the best partneship we have at the moment. Even though Pav seems to be short of confidence in front of goal lately, he does create opportunities with his eye for passes and diverting runs. I hope HArry is aware of this stat and continue to start both of them for the remaining matches.

 

[defoe18]

Intresting....

Right thats the strikeforce sorted til the end of the season

 

[Booney]

They do always look like the two players most likely to score in the team. Call me old-fashioned, but I've always considered this an important attribute for a striker.

Having said that, still haven't seen much evidence of them developing a real understanding between each other. Guess that will only come with a consistent run of games in the team together.

 

[BringBack_leGin]

I think they've set up quite a few chances for eachother. Despite neither being known as a creator, Defoe seems to drop deep when Pav pushes up and vice versa. I actually think their similarities in mentality is what makes them work, because Defoe knows what pass he would want should he be in Pavs position, so plays that pass, and vice versa. They are both guilty of the occasional bit of selfishness and playing with their head down, but the fact that they are both working extremely hard as well means that our midfield isn't being left exposed by having two out and out forwards in front of them.

Definitely our plan A in my mind, and I'm glad Pavlyuchenko no longer wants to leave.

 

[Krafty]

Having said that, still haven't seen much evidence of them developing a real understanding between each other. Guess that will only come with a consistent run of games in the team together.

I kind of think the opposite. I've been increasingly impressed by their link up play, especially Pav (not just with Defoe but in general)

Pav set up Bale on saturday, and also sprung JD free in the second half when he was one on one with Cech. JD assited for Pav's goal against Everton. There was also a glorious link up last season, I think it was against Stoke, where Pav played a blind ball round the corner for JD to spank in.

They wont have a relationship like Berbatov and Keane, but I think they fit much better with the rest of the team. They ask/require the midfield and full backs to create more and concentrate on getting the goals.

If Pav and JD had played in the games when we lost to Stoke and Wolves, while having plenty of chances, we might have won as they will always look to get on the end of things.

With the way I want us to play, and the way I think we play to our best, Pav and JD start together. Pav is also showing some great team work and work rate. While I dont deny Crouch tries his hardest, I dont think he presses and defends from the front hard enough. In the last two games Pav has shown this.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Pav's certainly improved his link up play since getting back into the team. He gets into some good positions by pulling wide and that creates space for everyone else. If he continues in this vein then the two of them should probably start in the next couple of games at least.

 

[Garm]

Both also played v Stoke (3-1) last year, and I remember a lot of us posting how good they looked together. Pav had one really nice assist to one of JD's goals. Unfortunately Defoe got injured and Pav lost his place in the starting line-up after that, but it was a sign of things to come. I'd like them both to start on OT.

 

[Bobishism]

Last season, we won 80%+ of the games Pav scored in. I can't find the exact stat, but it makes sense if you count our cup runs.

 

[Teemu]

Last season, we won 80%+ of the games Pav scored in. I can't find the exact stat, but it makes sense if you count our cup runs.

We've also won 100% of the games Bassong and BAE have scored in. Cheeky 4-3-3 on Saturday?

 

[Hoowl]

Last season, we won 80%+ of the games Pav scored in. I can't find the exact stat, but it makes sense if you count our cup runs.

We've won 100% of the games Keanes scored in the season.

 

[talkshowhost86]

We've also won 100% of the games Bassong and BAE have scored in. Cheeky 4-3-3 on Saturday?

We've also won 100% of the games that I've been to in which we've not lost or drawn.

Hurrah!

Useless stats FTW!

 

[Kendall]

We've not lost this season when Kendall has been in the crowd.

 

[Adam]

I think it works so well because of fairly simple tactics to be honest.

When Defoe and Crouch play together, they both play high up on the opposition's defence-Crouch so he can get the long balls and Defoe so he can try and get in behind. This has a two-way effect:-

a) The opposing defence can sit really deep and stay in a rigid line of four, knowing that their centre halves will be able to pick up our strikers without moving out of position.

b) We leave a massive gap between the strikers and midfielders-our set up looks almost like a 4-4-2 would have done on FIFA 96, with three very rigid lines of players.

As a result, we dont dominate the midfield as well as we can and our wingers can never get in behind the opposing defence.

However, when Pav and Defoe play together, we almost go to a 4-4-1-1, with the strikers rotating constantly-this means that we are always pulling defenders out of position, which brings the opposing defence line up and allows space in behind them-this was patently obvious on Saturday; Chelsea had to push up to close the space around the dropped off striker which gave us space in behind Ferreira-Bale's goal is a great example of this.

I dont think this is Crouch's fault neccessarily, but unfortunately when he plays, we always go long, which suits neither us or him as he could definitely do that job in the hole as Pav does, although i guess Pav is slightly moe useful as he is more dangerous on the shoulder of the last man than Crouchy is.

The proof again is how well we played with Keane and Defoe up top at the start of the season when we could get Ekotto and Lennon in behind the opponents defence on a regular basis-sadly it all went wrong when Keane's form dipped, and if you look at this season's results, we've only had one top result with Crouch and Defoe in the side and that was against City, a game which was won largely because Sylvinho couldnt handle Lennon.

Ultimately therefore, until we start using Crouch as a proper striker and playing football with him as opposed to treating him like a freak of nature, we will always play better with Pav and Defoe, as the results have shown.

 

[Bobishism]

I meant to say started.

 

[ward1848]

We've also won 100% of the games we've scored in when the opposition havent

But for the record I like the two of them starting, for sure. Crouch leaves us playing with ten without the ball and isnt mobile enough with it. Gudj shows glimpses of touch and vision in sub spells but I am not sure he has the legs anymore for a full game (I would prefer we keep him over keane though)

 

[Spurs_Bear]

I think it works so well because of fairly simple tactics to be honest.

When Defoe and Crouch play together, they both play high up on the opposition's defence-Crouch so he can get the long balls and Defoe so he can try and get in behind. This has a two-way effect:-

a) The opposing defence can sit really deep and stay in a rigid line of four, knowing that their centre halves will be able to pick up our strikers without moving out of position.

b) We leave a massive gap between the strikers and midfielders-our set up looks almost like a 4-4-2 would have done on FIFA 96, with three very rigid lines of players.

As a result, we dont dominate the midfield as well as we can and our wingers can never get in behind the opposing defence.

However, when Pav and Defoe play together, we almost go to a 4-4-1-1, with the strikers rotating constantly-this means that we are always pulling defenders out of position, which brings the opposing defence line up and allows space in behind them-this was patently obvious on Saturday; Chelsea had to push up to close the space around the dropped off striker which gave us space in behind Ferreira-Bale's goal is a great example of this.

I dont think this is Crouch's fault neccessarily, but unfortunately when he plays, we always go long, which suits neither us or him as he could definitely do that job in the hole as Pav does, although i guess Pav is slightly moe useful as he is more dangerous on the shoulder of the last man than Crouchy is.

The proof again is how well we played with Keane and Defoe up top at the start of the season when we could get Ekotto and Lennon in behind the opponents defence on a regular basis-sadly it all went wrong when Keane's form dipped, and if you look at this season's results, we've only had one top result with Crouch and Defoe in the side and that was against City, a game which was won largely because Sylvinho couldnt handle Lennon.

Ultimately therefore, until we start using Crouch as a proper striker and playing football with him as opposed to treating him like a freak of nature, we will always play better with Pav and Defoe, as the results have shown.

This is only true when Lennon isn't playing. When Lennon has played with Crouch and Defoe we have seen things like Wigan 9-1, Man City 3-0 and West Ham 2-0. When Lennon, Defoe and Crouch play, defenders cant drop deep as that leaves Lennon too much space, and they cant push up for the fear of Crouch flicking on to Defoe. I don't think it is the factor of Crouch that (allegedly) makes us go more direct, I refuse to use the term 'long' as it's bollocks, it is actually the lack of Lennon.

Personally I think our most 'effective' strike force is Defoe, Crouch and Lennon, as it works both at home and away. As much as I've been impressed with the Defoe and Pav partnership at home and though Pav played his greatest game for us so far against Chelsea, I am yet to be convinced by them away from home, and when I say that I mean as a pair, not as having a pop at Pav which I have been guilty of in the past.

 

[Stoof]

I think both of them have unintentionally miscued shots that have ended up as assists. Hehehe.

Pav's Everton goal, for example. :wink: