Douglas Costa

[jasswolf]

I disagree, I thought he was one of their best players, even when the others were holding their head in their hands he kept trying to carve chances and get some respect. My opinion of him only increased at the WC unlike most of the Brazilian team

Fair point re: Bernard but blaming the Brazil XI for having 8-9 attacking players on the field is a bit rubbish.

Without Neymar, they couldn't retain enough possession to prevent being scored heavily against.

 

[ItsBoris]

Actually the Brazilian at Shakhtar that looks like he's developing into a really good player imo is Alex Teixeira. A bit like Willian in his early days there, a bit hit and miss he now seems to be finding consistency more at his better levels

Wouldn't mind us getting him, always stood out for me when I've seen Shakhtar play in the CL/EL.

 

[nipponyid]

Yes please..we need more strikers...Don't we?

 

[Sweech]

I'd sooner see what we have in our attacking group with Eriksen, Lamela, Holtby, Chadli, Falque, Ceballos, Townsend, Lennon (Levy please sell), and potentially Dembele or Paulinho up top who are all question marks aside from Eriksen. Rather than go out and spend money to add another question mark to that group.

We need to establish the group and core first, then go out and add the pieces to it. I think defense is clearly a positional issue that we need to shore up immediately everything else is filled with unknowns. I'd rather figure those out before we throw any kind of sizeable money around (unless it's an almost 99% sure class player).

 

[arunspurs]

I would definitively look at taking Srna - one of the best right backs in the world. I know he is 32 now, but he is a definite upgrade IMO on both Naughton & Walker.

He would also add a bit of experience in back line.
Its difficult to get him from Donetsk though, being the captain. IMO, he will be a better acquisition for us than Bernard.

 

[SandroClegane]

I would definitively look at taking Srna - one of the best right backs in the world. I know he is 32 now, but he is a definite upgrade IMO on both Naughton & Walker.

He would also add a bit of experience in back line.
Its difficult to get him from Donetsk though, being the captain. IMO, he will be a better acquisition for us than Bernard.

I would much rather have Kyle Walker. Not sure how you can say a 32 year old playing in Ukraine is a definite upgrade on England's top RB when healthy.

 

[Barry Mead]

I'd sooner see what we have in our attacking group with Eriksen, Lamela, Holtby, Chadli, Falque, Ceballos, Townsend, Lennon (Levy please sell), and potentially Dembele or Paulinho up top who are all question marks aside from Eriksen. Rather than go out and spend money to add another question mark to that group.

We need to establish the group and core first, then go out and add the pieces to it. I think defense is clearly a positional issue that we need to shore up immediately everything else is filled with unknowns. I'd rather figure those out before we throw any kind of sizeable money around (unless it's an almost 99% sure class player).

Surely we should know what we have in the likes of Lennon, Townsend, Dembele, Ceballos and Falque by now, as they have been at the club long enough. The others maybe the club might want to give a bit more time to assess particularly given last seasons disruptions and injuries, but even then they we should have a pretty good feel for them even if they haven't really shone in the matches
If we have question marks over so many it begs the question does anyone ever monitor these players progress, even Holtby joined a season and a half back we should have a pretty good idea of the players strengths and weaknesses by now
If you think we can see what we need in defence I fail to see why you don't think we can see what we are lacking in attack.
For sure at any given time there will be a few maybe's along with a few certainties either you feel sure you want to keep or sell, but if you have opportunity to add what you see as "certainties" (granted that even certainties don't always work out as that) for certain roles where you have only want to sells or maybe's you add them.If you don't find those players then you gamble on the maybe's

 

[Barry Mead]

I would much rather have Kyle Walker. Not sure how you can say a 32 year old playing in Ukraine is a definite upgrade on England's top RB when healthy.

To be fair "England's top RB" as a description only highlights how poor the choice of RB is in England right now rather than makes Walker a good right back.
I have to say I agree with the sentiments to a point and always felt Srna would have been a great RB for us in recent years. Now maybe he is starting to decline and it's arguably a bit late to bring a player of that age to a new league after so long in another and expect him to adapt, but as right backs go Walker is nowhere near the level of Srna imo

 

[arunspurs]

I would much rather have Kyle Walker. Not sure how you can say a 32 year old playing in Ukraine is a definite upgrade on England's top RB when healthy.

Go to the stats & look at the number of goals we conceded due to individual mistakes last season - thats 18.
No team in PL is near us. I wont be surprised if we top that stat in Europe too.

We need experience IMO.
If City can have Zabelata & Sagna, if Chelsea can have a Ivanovic & Terry, we can have Srna.
He is one of the best right backs in the world and a real leader in back line. And he is a right back, who knows how to cross.

Even if Srna is aged, he is way better than Walker.

 

[yido_number1]

Some talented players that want out of Shaktar at the moment because of the situation in Eastern Ukraine.

Akhmetov doesn't want a fire sale....but i think i saw that Kia Joorabchian (everyone's favourite player agent) is going to try and get the contracts voided by UEFA because they are foreign players in a conflict zone which would make all of them available on free transfers.

Guessing if we actually chased some of these guys and made a half decent offer that Shaktar would take the deal rather than run the risk (even if it is a small chance) of losing some o these players for nothing.

If Joorabchian is involved I wouldn't want anything to do with any of them. The guy is a cancer in football and makes a mockery of everything he is involved with...

 

[yido_number1]

Go to the stats & look at the number of goals we conceded due to individual mistakes last season - thats 18.
No team in PL is near us. I wont be surprised if we top that stat in Europe too.

We need experience IMO.
If City can have Zabelata & Sagna, if Chelsea can have a Ivanovic & Terry, we can have Srna.
He is one of the best right backs in the world and a real leader in back line. And he is a right back, who knows how to cross.

Even if Srna is aged, he is way better than Walker.

The upgrade needed is for Naughton not Walker. Walker is still a really good right back and was playing through injury in an unsettled team last year. Naughton made a lot of those mistakes in one game vs Southampton.

 

[Sweech]

Surely we should know what we have in the likes of Lennon, Townsend, Dembele, Ceballos and Falque by now, as they have been at the club long enough. The others maybe the club might want to give a bit more time to assess particularly given last seasons disruptions and injuries, but even then they we should have a pretty good feel for them even if they haven't really shone in the matches
If we have question marks over so many it begs the question does anyone ever monitor these players progress, even Holtby joined a season and a half back we should have a pretty good idea of the players strengths and weaknesses by now
If you think we can see what we need in defence I fail to see why you don't think we can see what we are lacking in attack.
For sure at any given time there will be a few maybe's along with a few certainties either you feel sure you want to keep or sell, but if you have opportunity to add what you see as "certainties" (granted that even certainties don't always work out as that) for certain roles where you have only want to sells or maybe's you add them.If you don't find those players then you gamble on the maybe's

Townsend, Ceballos, and Falque haven't been with the 1st team at this club for very long so we know them about as well as we know Bentaleb or Chadli. Some are also still decently young so it will be up to Poch to see what he could possibly do with them. Plus that's really what it comes down to. How does Poch view them, we need to give him the chance to evaluate the players rather than going of what Tim freaking Sherwood thought of half of them (any coming through the youth side and even what he thought of the 1st teamers).

Dembele is an interesting case individually. He has a unique skill set and he can hypothetically play at multiple spots in Poch's system. That or he could completely fit in nowhere. We've also seen him have an excellent season with us and then an incredibly poor one. So which is it? What's the real player there? What's the standard we hold him to? How's his injury as well? What kind of recovery and time frame can we expect for him to get back to proper form?

The major problem with defense is the lack of players. Attack/midfield has an absolute plethora of options to choose from and as is we need to send some off before anything else. On defense we could still make additions without having to make an obvious subtractions.

 

[arunspurs]

The upgrade needed is for Naughton not Walker. Walker is still a really good right back and was playing through injury in an unsettled team last year. Naughton made a lot of those mistakes in one game vs Southampton.

We need competition for Walker & not look for a back up option. Lets not forget our fortune took a down turn after that terrible back pass from Walker at Anfield when we lost the game from 0-2 up and 3-2 down in 2012/13 ; Eventually that game triggered the rise of Liverpool.

He has improved but he has his moments when he loses his brains.

 

[Barry Mead]

Townsend, Ceballos, and Falque haven't been with the 1st team at this club for very long so we know them about as well as we know Bentaleb or Chadli. Some are also still decently young so it will be up to Poch to see what he could possibly do with them. Plus that's really what it comes down to. How does Poch view them, we need to give him the chance to evaluate the players rather than going of what Tim freaking Sherwood thought of half of them (any coming through the youth side and even what he thought of the 1st teamers).

Dembele is an interesting case individually. He has a unique skill set and he can hypothetically play at multiple spots in Poch's system. That or he could completely fit in nowhere. We've also seen him have an excellent season with us and then an incredibly poor one. So which is it? What's the real player there? What's the standard we hold him to? How's his injury as well? What kind of recovery and time frame can we expect for him to get back to proper form?

The major problem with defense is the lack of players. Attack/midfield has an absolute plethora of options to choose from and as is we need to send some off before anything else. On defense we could still make additions without having to make an obvious subtractions.

Yeah but all these players are monitored for progress, the whole point of sending players out on loan surely has to be with the intention of seeing if they are developing well enough to make the step up to the first team.
If you are suggesting that we don't know the players qualities because they are on loan rather than at the club it would beg the question why we are sending players out on loan.
We have defenders, we were comfortable selling Smith, the likes of Fredericks and Veljkovic, given we also have Benny, Naughton, Walker, Fryers, Daws, Verts, Eunice and Vlad, not quite sure if Khumalo is still technically ours, but it's not as if we don't have defensive options simply that we accept we need to improve it, I think the same can be said for attack and though we have a lot of midfield options we can still strengthen there
As for Dembele personally I don't recall him having a good season, I recall he started off OK with the benefit of Sandro at his best pre injury and then when Sandro got injured he for the most part looked poor so much so that many were suggesting he was carrying an injury

 

[Barry Mead]

The upgrade needed is for Naughton not Walker. Walker is still a really good right back and was playing through injury in an unsettled team last year. Naughton made a lot of those mistakes in one game vs Southampton.

Walker is an awful defender and really lacks brains generally in his play. Great pace and energy but that's it, the sooner we get a quality rb who can be first choice the happier I'll be and that isn't going to be Naughton

 

[Sweech]

Yeah but all these players are monitored for progress, the whole point of sending players out on loan surely has to be with the intention of seeing if they are developing well enough to make the step up to the first team.
If you are suggesting that we don't know the players qualities because they are on loan rather than at the club it would beg the question why we are sending players out on loan.

We can monitor loaned players about as well as we can scout other players, it's still somewhat of a shot in the dark really. All you can do is bring them back after their loan and see if they've improved in some way.

We are sending the players out on loan to get more football and better competition than we would be able to offer them. It doesn't mean we can have some kind of chart that shows their statistical progression like in a video game. I don't think it's that hard to understand.

We have defenders, we were comfortable selling Smith, the likes of Fredericks and Veljkovic, given we also have Benny, Naughton, Walker, Fryers, Daws, Verts, Eunice and Vlad, not quite sure if Khumalo is still technically ours, but it's not as if we don't have defensive options simply that we accept we need to improve it,

A lot of those defenders still have the option of playing in our youth side or have yet to ever be out on loan. Not to mention Veljkovic is possibly not even a defender, but a defensive midfielder instead. Then there's others like Benny and Naughton who have been around the team and 1st club football that we really do know what they bring to the side, there's really not any mystery what their skills are and how they could be utilized.

I think the same can be said for attack and though we have a lot of midfield options we can still strengthen there
As for Dembele personally I don't recall him having a good season, I recall he started off OK with the benefit of Sandro at his best pre injury and then when Sandro got injured he for the most part looked poor so much so that many were suggesting he was carrying an injury

I thought Dembele and Sandro both played extremely well and it was not at all a case of one carrying the other, I thought they both complimented each other extremely well. Dembele's possibly hip issues are definitely worrisome, but as I have no idea what the medical staff thinks of the issue I cannot comment on it.

It seems rather black and white to me. We have 8 defensive players vying for 4 spots. I'm not counting Khumalo or BAE as it seems rather obvious they won't be squad players at all. I'm also not counting Fredericks as it seems rather obvious that he won't be in the side unless Naughton gets moved on, otherwise he'll probably go out on loan. I'm counting Dawson, but he's already shown his inability to play well in a tactical system that employs a high line, so that's likely someone who needs replacing.

In midfield we have 6 players vying for 2 spots. I'm counting Dembele and Paulinho in here as that's where they've primarily been played. Tom Carroll could be loaned out, but is hitting somewhat of a make or break point in his career. Bentaleb is still very young and can be loaned out, but I think he has the quality and would benefit more from a squad team role, but that can't really happen unless others are moved on.

For attacking mids we essentially have 7 players for 3 positions. I'm not counting Siggy as I expect him to be sold or Ryan Mason as he has yet to distinguish himself at any level in order to merit consideration. Again Paulinho or Dembele could theoretically fit in here, but it's a crowded group as is (although so is the midfield two).

Then at forward we have 3 players for 1 position.

To me it looks like we have x2 the required starters for defense. x3 the required starters for midfield and then x2+1 for both attacking mid and forward positions. Typically I think common belief is to have one backup for each position, so we're theoretically overstocked at forward, attacking mid, and mid. Then when you take into account how I believe Dawson should be moved on we have an opening for another defender. Davies will likely be coming in and I still think we 100% need another CB, so that likely puts the crunch on either Fryers or Rose.

Overall the way I feel is that we have much more ability in the back midfield two, the front midfield 3, and the strikers than we do one defensive if you looked at each unit collectively as a group. That's why I think we need to improve defense first and foremost.

 

[Barry Mead]

We can monitor loaned players about as well as we can scout other players, it's still somewhat of a shot in the dark really. All you can do is bring them back after their loan and see if they've improved in some way.

We are sending the players out on loan to get more football and better competition than we would be able to offer them. It doesn't mean we can have some kind of chart that shows their statistical progression like in a video game. I don't think it's that hard to understand.



A lot of those defenders still have the option of playing in our youth side or have yet to ever be out on loan. Not to mention Veljkovic is possibly not even a defender, but a defensive midfielder instead. Then there's others like Benny and Naughton who have been around the team and 1st club football that we really do know what they bring to the side, there's really not any mystery what their skills are and how they could be utilized.


I thought Dembele and Sandro both played extremely well and it was not at all a case of one carrying the other, I thought they both complimented each other extremely well. Dembele's possibly hip issues are definitely worrisome, but as I have no idea what the medical staff thinks of the issue I cannot comment on it.

It seems rather black and white to me. We have 8 defensive players vying for 4 spots. I'm not counting Khumalo or BAE as it seems rather obvious they won't be squad players at all. I'm also not counting Fredericks as it seems rather obvious that he won't be in the side unless Naughton gets moved on, otherwise he'll probably go out on loan. I'm counting Dawson, but he's already shown his inability to play well in a tactical system that employs a high line, so that's likely someone who needs replacing.

In midfield we have 6 players vying for 2 spots. I'm counting Dembele and Paulinho in here as that's where they've primarily been played. Tom Carroll could be loaned out, but is hitting somewhat of a make or break point in his career. Bentaleb is still very young and can be loaned out, but I think he has the quality and would benefit more from a squad team role, but that can't really happen unless others are moved on.

For attacking mids we essentially have 7 players for 3 positions. I'm not counting Siggy as I expect him to be sold or Ryan Mason as he has yet to distinguish himself at any level in order to merit consideration. Again Paulinho or Dembele could theoretically fit in here, but it's a crowded group as is (although so is the midfield two).

Then at forward we have 3 players for 1 position.

To me it looks like we have x2 the required starters for defense. x3 the required starters for midfield and then x2+1 for both attacking mid and forward positions. Typically I think common belief is to have one backup for each position, so we're theoretically overstocked at forward, attacking mid, and mid. Then when you take into account how I believe Dawson should be moved on we have an opening for another defender. Davies will likely be coming in and I still think we 100% need another CB, so that likely puts the crunch on either Fryers or Rose.

Overall the way I feel is that we have much more ability in the back midfield two, the front midfield 3, and the strikers than we do one defensive if you looked at each unit collectively as a group. That's why I think we need to improve defense first and foremost.

We seem to be able to decide to get rid of a number of players that have been on loan, so I'm not sure I really get that argument. If players don't look like progressing you offload them, if you think there's something there you either find a better loan situation or put them in the squad. We should know enough to decide

I think we have some stronger areas than others, but that doesn't mean we should only address one part of the team, there are weaknesses in attack and midfield and if we can find the right players we should fill all rather than ignoring weaknesses in a given role simply because we have more weaknesses in other areas

 

[LiamJM10]

Go to the stats & look at the number of goals we conceded due to individual mistakes last season - thats 18.
No team in PL is near us. I wont be surprised if we top that stat in Europe too.

We need experience IMO.
If City can have Zabelata & Sagna, if Chelsea can have a Ivanovic & Terry, we can have Srna.
He is one of the best right backs in the world and a real leader in back line. And he is a right back, who knows how to cross.

Even if Srna is aged, he is way better than Walker.

Srna is not better than Walker. Nowhere near.

 

[yido_number1]

We need competition for Walker & not look for a back up option. Lets not forget our fortune took a down turn after that terrible back pass from Walker at Anfield when we lost the game from 0-2 up and 3-2 down in 2012/13 ; Eventually that game triggered the rise of Liverpool.

He has improved but he has his moments when he loses his brains.

Triggered the rise of Liverpool to their astounding 7th place finish that season... you can credit Walker with a lot of things but not the rise of Liverpool... Every player makes a mistake. Gerrard has made a few over his career ? Was he crap? Terry scored the own goal at Palace is he crap?

Agree competition will be good for Walker but he is far from our weakest link...

 

[arunspurs]

Triggered the rise of Liverpool to their astounding 7th place finish that season... you can credit Walker with a lot of things but not the rise of Liverpool... Every player makes a mistake. Gerrard has made a few over his career ? Was he crap? Terry scored the own goal at Palace is he crap?

Agree competition will be good for Walker but he is far from our weakest link...

Believe me, I said the comment that this will be turning point for Liverpool after that game.
The way they won & we lost, triggered the downward spiral for us (famously our AVB said the opposite before that game).

I am just saying Walker 's & subsequent Lloris mistake triggered everything.