Ex-Manager watch: Antonio Conte

[mkkid]

We know ENIC are a huge, massive part of the problem. We all do. The issue is that ENIC aren't going anywhere. Unless and until they receive several billion pounds they will continue to own this club and operate it in whichever way they choose. There is no 'Sack' ENIC option. Anyone who thinks a man like Daniel Levy is going to allow himself to be hounded out of the club is living on another planet. Levy is a cold, cold businessman. You're definitely not going to be hounding Joe Lewis out of the club because he's never here anyway. He's sunning himself in the Caribbean. If the only hope is ENIC selling to a benevolent, human rights observing billionaire then we might as well all give up and find something else to do. ENIC cannot be voted out, booed out, hounded out, protested out or legislated out. They sell the club for the value they deem right or they stay. On past behaviour Daniel Levy will not sell the club for anything less than top dollar. The reality is that ENIC are here to stay for the foreseeable future and there's nothing we can do to change that. Another reality we need to come to terms with is that Daniel Levy is not going to change his modus operandi at this point. He's been doing the same thing for twenty years and cannot and will not change. We can debate the reasons for his intransigeance, it could be that he's just a nitwit and despite his deep desire to bring us success he's just his own worst enemy OR he is performing his role perfectly as it is primarily to increase the value of the club through infrastructure investment and corporate sponsorship. His secondary role is to maintain an image of the club as elite and ambitious. This keeps sponsors, 'customers' and potential player and staff recruits interested. Personally, I subscribe to the second hypothesis.

Given these assumed realities we have to adjust our expectations. We can't change the ownership. We can demand entertainment and a more realistic strategy because the current strategy of employing an elite coach and giving him a bang average squad is not going well.

For that reason I think its perfectly reasonable to be Conte Out. He is not the right man for the job. Persevering with this is only going to lead to more frustration and anger. Conte is not going to get the £500m splurge of players that he wants and needs. Its not going to happen. Its better all round to bring in a younger, more modern coach who can work with the players that we have, raise morale, get the fans going, get the players enjoying their football and send Harry Kane off with a bit of a fanfare. We can get back to bringing players through from the academy, we can get back to bringing in exciting youngsters from the football league like Kyle Walker, Dele Alli, Aaron Lennon, Danny Rose. etc

Conte has to go for the good of the club.

Great post, we could of got them out before the stadium was built, now they will be here for another 20 years. No one is buying spurs in there right mind, it doesn't make business sense!
But as a fanbase we can effect their bottom line ,boycott merchandise and food.

They will now always look to bring a big name as manger , because they can push a weak squad towards a CL place. We now have Newcastle as a threat, along with the new Man utd, Put in Arsenal ,Chlesea , Liverpool and Cty in the mix, you are even struggling for a European place. Those corporate ticket want Cl or at a minimum EL football.
Conte thinks he doing us a favour and its time for him to go...

 

[Dakes]

We did, but the difference is below. In the last six years we've downgraded in basically every single position on the pitch and now both Son and Lloris need replacing too, plus who knows if Kane will even be here next season. We essentially have an entire team to replace and that's just to get us to the point this team was at, which was very good but still fell short, so it needs even more than 11 players. This idea that Poch will come back and everything will be sunshine and rainbows and butterflies all over again is detached from reality. He was a great manager but he - like every good manager out there - needed great players.

View attachment 121193

Ah, felt good seeing that picture. Thanks for posting it.

 

[Mark_147]

No top clubs play a back 3. Only one team has ever won the PL with a back 3 and that was Conte at Chelsea and that was mainly down to them not having European Football getting in the way. A back 3 is ok for certain games but it has an awful track record of success. Utterly baffles me why anyone plays it.

Tuchel played 3 at the back at chelsea and won the champions league in the process.

 

[Yantino]

We know ENIC are a huge, massive part of the problem. We all do. The issue is that ENIC aren't going anywhere. Unless and until they receive several billion pounds they will continue to own this club and operate it in whichever way they choose. There is no 'Sack' ENIC option. Anyone who thinks a man like Daniel Levy is going to allow himself to be hounded out of the club is living on another planet. Levy is a cold, cold businessman. You're definitely not going to be hounding Joe Lewis out of the club because he's never here anyway. He's sunning himself in the Caribbean. If the only hope is ENIC selling to a benevolent, human rights observing billionaire then we might as well all give up and find something else to do. ENIC cannot be voted out, booed out, hounded out, protested out or legislated out. They sell the club for the value they deem right or they stay. On past behaviour Daniel Levy will not sell the club for anything less than top dollar. The reality is that ENIC are here to stay for the foreseeable future and there's nothing we can do to change that. Another reality we need to come to terms with is that Daniel Levy is not going to change his modus operandi at this point. He's been doing the same thing for twenty years and cannot and will not change. We can debate the reasons for his intransigeance, it could be that he's just a nitwit and despite his deep desire to bring us success he's just his own worst enemy OR he is performing his role perfectly as it is primarily to increase the value of the club through infrastructure investment and corporate sponsorship. His secondary role is to maintain an image of the club as elite and ambitious. This keeps sponsors, 'customers' and potential player and staff recruits interested. Personally, I subscribe to the second hypothesis.

Given these assumed realities we have to adjust our expectations. We can't change the ownership. We can demand entertainment and a more realistic strategy because the current strategy of employing an elite coach and giving him a bang average squad is not going well.

For that reason I think its perfectly reasonable to be Conte Out. He is not the right man for the job. Persevering with this is only going to lead to more frustration and anger. Conte is not going to get the £500m splurge of players that he wants and needs. Its not going to happen. Its better all round to bring in a younger, more modern coach who can work with the players that we have, raise morale, get the fans going, get the players enjoying their football and send Harry Kane off with a bit of a fanfare. We can get back to bringing players through from the academy, we can get back to bringing in exciting youngsters from the football league like Kyle Walker, Dele Alli, Aaron Lennon, Danny Rose. etc

Conte has to go for the good of the club.

Great post. I'm really disappointed as i feel i need to agree with this. I'm disappointed that my club is not willing to match the ambition/strategy of (and let's make no mistake about this) an elite coach in Conte. IF ENIC backed him properly he would be winning with us. But you are right, that isn't going to happen.

As you say, if we are stuck with ENIC and their way of doing things then i think Conte has to go. ?

 

[chelmyid]

I said it before and i genuinely think that this will be a long process. We've wasted a once in a lifetime talent like Kane, that depresses me. Hes probably only got another 3 seasons at the top.

Assuming Levy and ENIC remain. At this stage we need a motivator, we dont have the players to implement world class tactics sadly. We need a motivator, someone who will let the players express themselves and give their all and someone who encourages youngsters and new energy. Like when Martin Jol was here, someone to get the team spirit back and the desire.

Thats why i think Thomas Franck would be worth a shot, let him bring his team with him. Seems like a really likeable genuine guy, someone you'd want to play for. If we can nick a few Brentford players (Im thinking Raya for starters) even better.

I very much doubt we'd win the league with him but it could be the catalyst for a new cycle and some young blood.

These world class managers dont work without the backing. Surely that is crystal clear now.

Don’t disagree with much of what you have said

the realism is - whoever we employ right now we’re not winning the league with this group of players - they’re not good enough. Period.

so we all need to lower expectation and at least be entertained

 

[Stamford]

One thing is for sure, Conte hasn't brought the best out in anyone since he's been here.

Mate this is repeated after every loss but it's nonsense. No one said this last season. He had the best version of son we had ever seen, Kane put in arguably his best Spurs performance ever, kulu and Bentancur were laughed out of juve and were playing well. Doherty was in great form before his injury at villa. Dier was back in the England squad after a great run of form. He even had bloody Ben Davies playing well.

if people want to criticise conte then fine but the above is just not true

 

[chrisd2k]

Great post, we could of got them out before the stadium was built, now they will be here for another 20 years. No one is buying spurs in there right mind, it doesn't make business sense!
But as a fanbase we can effect their bottom line ,boycott merchandise and food.

They will now always look to bring a big name as manger , because they can push a weak squad towards a CL place. We now have Newcastle as a threat, along with the new Man utd, Put in Arsenal ,Chlesea , Liverpool and Cty in the mix, you are even struggling for a European place. Those corporate ticket want Cl or at a minimum EL football.
Conte thinks he doing us a favour and its time for him to go...

It makes complete sense as infrastructure is far more money than fixing the actual team. We're priced too high though

 

[spursfan77]

Agreed.

For all Arsenals dominance yesterday I don't think they really created that much imo.

In the first half they had a big chance through lloris big mistake, then they had the goal which isn't really a chance as we have it well covered and it was straight at lloris, they had the Partey strike which isn't really a big chance then the odegaard goal. They didn't have many shots and didn't create a whole lot.

But they didn't need to.

 

[Rout-Ledge]

That Summer is the only window Levy gets a pass on for me.

Wasn’t that the window where Levy fucked about on Grealish?

 

[Spunkmonkey]

Mate this is repeated after every loss but it's nonsense. No one said this last season. He had the best version of son we had ever seen, Kane put in arguably his best Spurs performance ever, kulu and Bentancur were laughed out of juve and were playing well. Doherty was in great form before his injury at villa. Dier was back in the England squad after a great run of form. He even had bloody Ben Davies playing well.

if people want to criticise conte then fine but the above is just not true

That is a very fair appraisal.
However what has happened this season is that opposition coaches have worked out how we play and realised that’s our only plan.
We only fight back in second half’s due to the quality of our front players.
This inflexibility is baffling from a top coach and will ultimately lead to him leaving the club.

 

[spurs9]

Sorry, are you actually advocating a back 4 with Emerson, Langlet, Davies included as a way to get us out of this?

You think swapping Davies for Sess and adding Dier improves it?

 

[Tucker]

Mate this is repeated after every loss but it's nonsense. No one said this last season. He had the best version of son we had ever seen, Kane put in arguably his best Spurs performance ever, kulu and Bentancur were laughed out of juve and were playing well. Doherty was in great form before his injury at villa. Dier was back in the England squad after a great run of form. He even had bloody Ben Davies playing well.

if people want to criticise conte then fine but the above is just not true

So what’s happened to them all? With the possible exception of Kane every single one of those players has gone further and further backwards the longer they’ve had to work with the guy.

He was given oodles of money in the summer, backed like no other manager we’ve had in the last thirty or forty years. Yet the team has gotten significantly worse.

Not progressing is one thing. Going backwards is unacceptable though, and our form has been appalling since September.

 

[HildoSpur]

You think swapping Davies for Sess and adding Dier improves it?

I think the fact we are now debating whether we should use Dier, Davies, Sessegnon, Emerson, Sanchez, etc. in a different way sums up the state of our squad - none of those players would look out of place for Nottingham Forest or Everton.

 

[Mark_147]

You think swapping Davies for Sess and adding Dier improves it?

Sessegnon isn't a full back and Dier makes even more mistakes in a back 4

 

[Stamford]

We know ENIC are a huge, massive part of the problem. We all do. The issue is that ENIC aren't going anywhere. Unless and until they receive several billion pounds they will continue to own this club and operate it in whichever way they choose. There is no 'Sack' ENIC option. Anyone who thinks a man like Daniel Levy is going to allow himself to be hounded out of the club is living on another planet. Levy is a cold, cold businessman. You're definitely not going to be hounding Joe Lewis out of the club because he's never here anyway. He's sunning himself in the Caribbean. If the only hope is ENIC selling to a benevolent, human rights observing billionaire then we might as well all give up and find something else to do. ENIC cannot be voted out, booed out, hounded out, protested out or legislated out. They sell the club for the value they deem right or they stay. On past behaviour Daniel Levy will not sell the club for anything less than top dollar. The reality is that ENIC are here to stay for the foreseeable future and there's nothing we can do to change that. Another reality we need to come to terms with is that Daniel Levy is not going to change his modus operandi at this point. He's been doing the same thing for twenty years and cannot and will not change. We can debate the reasons for his intransigeance, it could be that he's just a nitwit and despite his deep desire to bring us success he's just his own worst enemy OR he is performing his role perfectly as it is primarily to increase the value of the club through infrastructure investment and corporate sponsorship. His secondary role is to maintain an image of the club as elite and ambitious. This keeps sponsors, 'customers' and potential player and staff recruits interested. Personally, I subscribe to the second hypothesis.

Given these assumed realities we have to adjust our expectations. We can't change the ownership. We can demand entertainment and a more realistic strategy because the current strategy of employing an elite coach and giving him a bang average squad is not going well.

For that reason I think its perfectly reasonable to be Conte Out. He is not the right man for the job. Persevering with this is only going to lead to more frustration and anger. Conte is not going to get the £500m splurge of players that he wants and needs. Its not going to happen. Its better all round to bring in a younger, more modern coach who can work with the players that we have, raise morale, get the fans going, get the players enjoying their football and send Harry Kane off with a bit of a fanfare. We can get back to bringing players through from the academy, we can get back to bringing in exciting youngsters from the football league like Kyle Walker, Dele Alli, Aaron Lennon, Danny Rose. etc

Conte has to go for the good of the club.

Good points made but this is basically an acceptance of a return to mid table because the other members of the top six plus newcastle don't operate like this. ENIC have destroyed all they've built

 

[spursfan77]

Surely playing a side like this with the players currently at our disposal would be so much better?

lloris
Spence Romero Lenglet Davies
Bissouma Bentancur Sarr
Kulusevski Kane Richarlison

Width at full back, stronger in the centre and more pressing up front from kulusevski and Richy

We have the players to actually play a decent strong formation and tactics but the manager is wedded to three at the back and refuses.

Now you cant tell me Poch wouldn't get that team firing, if we bought him someone like Maddison to slot into that midfield three instead of Hojbjerg and a better left back than Davies???

 

[Rout-Ledge]

I think he needs to go now, but if he does stay then he needs to sign a new deal and show some commitment. He can’t expect the players to show commitment if he won’t. If we carry on like this, then we’re on a crash course for another wasted season.

When he arrived he seemed to care a bit and was trying to get the crowd going. Those days are over, and his comments after the game yesterday suggested he doesn’t give much of a fuck anymore.

 

[Spurzinho]

This is spot on from Danny Murphy on the BBC.

Spurs players 'aren't enjoying' Conte's tactics - Murphy

Match of the Day 2 pundit Danny Murphy says he "doesn't think Tottenham Hotspur players are enjoying" the way the team is tactically set up following their 2-0 defeat by Arsenal.

www.bbc.co.uk

We're set up to be so negative. Our midfield never stood a chance and our defence are sitting ducks.

 

[HildoSpur]

Surely playing a side like this with the players currently at our disposal would be so much better?

lloris
Spence Romero Lenglet Davies
Bissouma Bentancur Sarr
Kulusevski Kane Richarlison

Width at full back, stronger in the centre and more pressing up front from kulusevski and Richy

We have the players to actually play a decent strong formation and tactics but the manager is wedded to three at the back and refuses.

Now you cant tell me Poch wouldn't get that team firing, if we bought him someone like Maddison to slot into that midfield three instead of Hojbjerg and a better left back than Davies???

Wondering how you can possibly have Spence in there and Davies at left back urgh. Defence still needs a total rebuild and nowhere near good enough, no creativity in midfield at all. I'd have Kulu as the attacking midfielder in the 3 personally with Bissouma, Hojberg and Sarr rotating. Moving players around in different formations just proves to me how utterly shite our squad is because none of these teams look good to me.

 

[spurs9]

Sessegnon isn't a full back and Dier makes even more mistakes in a back 4

I was referring to our current back 5 not being any better than the back 4 that I mentioned.