Ex-Manager watch: Antonio Conte

[olithfc]

I think frustration (and to a point his personal circumstances) got the better of him.

Frustration at the apparent ceiling of the squad (compared to previous jobs) and also a ceiling on the clubs commitment to spend. Both should have been understood prior to taking the job.

I also think his illness probably made the situation seem far worse than the reality.

In the end he tried to distance himself from the failure, which let's be honest was a little cowardly. The players, coaches and club all played a part (just like the relative success of the prior season).

Plus

I always thought he felt we were a "modern club" (his words at some point) and it was an element he didn't like - new stadium and training ground, and he missed the traditional side to a club. I might be wrong but that's an impression he gave

 

[Whazam]

In the same way Ange improved Dier?

Come on, these are not children in a playschool, at some point it has to be recognised that they contributed to the problem, it wasn't all on Conte.

Accepting one's responsibility and actually succeeding are two different things. Ange feeling that he couldn't make Dier work in his team, while being honest about it and NOT throwing him under the bus, is a very great example of how his is different (in the best of ways) to Conte.

These players are not children, but they are human beings, and how they are treated will affect them psychologically. So when your coach complains about you constantly in public (much like a child, ironically) for months, of course it will have negative consequences.

Also, I don't think anyone feels most of the players couldn't have done better, but that's a discussion about their shortcomings, not Conte's.

 

[newbie]

Plus

I always thought he felt we were a "modern club" (his words at some point) and it was an element he didn't like - new stadium and training ground, and he missed the traditional side to a club. I might be wrong but that's an impression he gave

i think he wanted the modern money and old ways of him ruling the roost.

 

[Rout-Ledge]

He asked for time and patience but is wasn't really forthcoming from the fans who were turning on him becuase they didn't like the style of football, even though we were 4th.

He asked for time and patience but didn’t sign a new contract at a time when his existing contract had under a year left to run and the fans were singing his name every match…the ‘time and patience’ line was always bullshit.

 

[Frozen_Waffles]

I never minded Conte, thought he was passionate but very rigid (his downfall). We all knew when he was signed that it would be his way or end in doom, and it was the later.

Looking back at the whole time, the half season and the first half of last season were decently enjoyable. Then it went about as bad as it possibly could after the WC break lol and the football was awful. Glad we made a change, but to be honest, would we have reacted with Ange if we didn't have Conte... not sure!

In terms of the interview, I saw a quote that said he felt weird celebrating fourth place and he told his staff not to get used to that. IMO that's no different than what we say on here!

We got the results for the first half of the season, but the performances were never there. To be fair to Conte you could argue he didn't have the squad he needed.

My overall opinion came down to the Milan game where we were losing and his subs were less than attacking.

His general attitude was too defensive for our club, if we went ahead in a game I almost wanted to turn it off as we switched to all out defence. We were waiting to concede.

After we were so good in the second half of the previous season I thought we'd kick on, we didn't.

Injuries to Bentancur and even Bissouma really destroyed us. He did well given his resources but he was never a Spurs manager.

Pochs last season and a half, the final season of José and Conte were not enjoyable, not just the results but the negative way we played. There were points where I didn't want to watch us.

Night and day with Ange, where no matter who we have available we go for the win, and that is all I ask for. The fact we have a better squad and some exciting young talents is a bonus.

I think the one thing I would say about Conte, José and Poch is I always felt it was more about them than the club.

With Ange it feels like he puts the club first, he is only a cog in the machine.

 

[Styopa]

Imagine Conte’s response if we had we sold Kane a few days before the 22/23 season. It often gets pointed out that Ange has a better squad to work with, but he also lost our most important player of the last ten years a few days before the start of the season. I think either Conte would have seriously imploded or it could have been another Ramos type situation.

 

[Styopa]

The way Conte spoke about Milan when we played them in the CL (a team we were arguably actually superior to in quality) was like we were coming up against 2011 Barcelona. No wonder the players were relieved to see him fuck off - he clearly had no confidence in them.

I agree, although I also took this to be an emotional thing. Like he obviously held Milan in this reverential way as an Italian giant, whereas a club like us could never compare to that for him. At least that’s the way it came across to me. I think it was yet another thing that fed into the disconnect between Conte and the club.

 

[Rout-Ledge]

I agree, although I also took this to be an emotional thing. Like he obviously held Milan in this reverential way as an Italian giant, whereas a club like us could never compare to that for him. At least that’s the way it came across to me. I think it was yet another thing that fed into the disconnect between Conte and the club.

I agree, but he also spoke about Chelsea in a similar way. He always seemed keen to emphasise just how far away we were from any big name outfit, and equally keen to express his amazement when we did anything remotely decent (a ‘miracle’ to finish top four…something we had achieved in 6/12 seasons before he joined).

 

[PaulM]

The way Conte spoke about Milan when we played them in the CL (a team we were arguably actually superior to in quality) was like we were coming up against 2011 Barcelona. No wonder the players were relieved to see him fuck off - he clearly had no confidence in them.

I'm not a Conte hater but the second leg tactics were mind bogglingly negative given we were a goal down. You could see Deki and Sonny had been told under no circumstances to cross halfway if Milan had the ball.

There was one passage of play just before half time and Son and Deki got to halfway and pulled back while 2 or 3 Milan players passed the ball between them and Kane made a token effort to chase the ball down. You could see the Milan players wondering when they would come under some pressure. It was almost like a game of FIFA where a glitch has put the game on some endless loop.

 

[jurgen11]

Imagine Conte’s response if we had we sold Kane a few days before the 22/23 season. It often gets pointed out that Ange has a better squad to work with, but he also lost our most important player of the last ten years a few days before the start of the season. I think either Conte would have seriously imploded or it could have been another Ramos type situation.

Conte Cam would have been glorious

 

[Rout-Ledge]

I'm not a Conte hater but the second leg tactics were mind bogglingly negative given we were a goal down. You could see Deki and Sonny had been told under no circumstances to cross halfway if Milan had the ball.

There was one passage of play just before half time and Son and Deki got to halfway and pulled back while 2 or 3 Milan players passed the ball between them and Kane made a token effort to chase the ball down. You could see the Milan players wondering when they would come under some pressure. It was almost like a game of FIFA where a glitch has put the game on some endless loop.

This match is what I think of when his name is mentioned. This match was effectively the reward for having worked so hard to achieve the top 4 ‘miracle’ the season before. He seemed like he’d accepted defeat before the game even started. This is a CL knockout home second leg with only one goal between the sides, and a manager with everything to prove in that competition. It genuinely boggles my mind how little he was up for that game. It doesn’t help that I’d spent a small fortune on tickets, it was raining like hell and the tube was down after the match….a truly pitiful night and it really does colour my view of the man.

 

[TOLBINY]

You know Ange dropped Dier? Conte wasn't forced to keep playing him. Just as he wasn't forced to keep playing Son through injury when he was performing badly. Besides the last couple months has shown that with all the injuries Ange had he still had us playing better than Conte did with his squad (which compared to our depleted one was still better).

The trouble is Conte knew the squad he inherited and he even said time and again it would take a few windows. Yet he didn't even last a full season before he imploded. I don't know how anyone can defend that. All I'm reading are excuses when in reality the buck stops with him and he failed big time. He quit on us at the end of the day. Ange signed a 4 year contract which tells all you need to know about the 2 of them. Yes we needed to improve the squad and we did so in the summer and again in January but the manager actually needs to buy in for it to come to fruition.

Yes I do know Ange dropped Dier, if you look at my post it was a reply to your comment about it being Contes responsibility to improve the players. So why did Ange buy VDV? Why not just improve Dier if that is the coaches job? The answer is becuase it isn't that easy, every player has a ceiling.

Conte got and kept us 4th, if you think that is failing big time - so be it - I assume Ange needs to finish 3rd or higher not to be a failiure in your eyes?

 

[mil1lion]

Yes I do know Ange dropped Dier, if you look at my post it was a reply to your comment about it being Contes responsibility to improve the players. So why did Ange buy VDV? Why not just improve Dier if that is the coaches job? The answer is becuase it isn't that easy, every player has a ceiling.

Conte got and kept us 4th, if you think that is failing big time - so be it - I assume Ange needs to finish 3rd or higher not to be a failiure in your eyes?

Of course every player has a ceiling but who did Conte improve? You look at how Bissouma and Sarr have been doing this season. You look at the overall cohesian for the team now compared to last season. My comment about him failing big time is not to do with 4th place but the lack of progress last season after that 4th place finish. Even with that said he simply didn't stay long enough to change things around and that's why he failed big time. Had he actually signed a contract and committed to the task at hand he could have succeeded. You can't progress if you're not prepared to spend a couple years at least. We need a few windows but my contract runs out in 2. Fuck off then.

 

[parj]

He didn't blame the players to begin with and would also take blame as well. The players also need to take some responsibility as well, football isn't chess where the manager just moves pieces around.

I agree players need to take responsibility, but you also have to think about why we're we attacking more in his first season and then stopped attacking in the second? At what point did Conte look at the squad and think "they aren't attacking players. No goals there"!

 

[mil1lion]

This match is what I think of when his name is mentioned. This match was effectively the reward for having worked so hard to achieve the top 4 ‘miracle’ the season before. He seemed like he’d accepted defeat before the game even started. This is a CL knockout home second leg with only one goal between the sides, and a manager with everything to prove in that competition. It genuinely boggles my mind how little he was up for that game. It doesn’t help that I’d spent a small fortune on tickets, it was raining like hell and the tube was down after the match….a truly pitiful night and it really does colour my view of the man.

I will defend him a bit here because he was very sick and should not have been at the game. I think the issue though was always going to be that his defensive game was embedded into the team. We just had this drop off approach where we didn't know how to press high in search of goals. It was like we needed the opponent to agree to come out and attack so we could counter them. That doesn't work when they have a lead to defend though. This is what I love about Ange and how he plays because any scenario you find yourselves in attacking football will get what you need if done right. Where defensive football done right doesn't always result in goals the other end. If you're winning attack and win by more, if you're losing attack and turn it around.

 

[newbie]

Conte Cam would have been glorious

that would have been a show

 

[cabinfever]

Why are we still talking about him?

 

[carmeldevil]

Why are we still talking about him?

the thread title says ex-manager Antonio Conte

 

[cabinfever]

the thread title says ex-manager Antonio Conte

I know!!!

still wonder why??

 

[Nayim60yards]

I know!!!

still wonder why??

Ask yourself then! You are keeping the thread going by asking that question.

The rest of us in here are talking about Conte because of the contrast in so many ways between him and Ange in approach, playing style and everything else. We needed to be removed from it and have time to absorb what Postecoglou has brought to the table over a good period of time to be able to have this kind of perspective, so it was impossible to have these discussions while Conte was still here.