Hoddle on Lamela

[SteveH]

He's not crap just unsuitable.

 

[wiggo24]

He'll thrive with the increased space in front of him if we sign Berahino to stretch defences.

He's also our most suited player to Poch's system imo, so have high hopes for him this season.

It's his last chance, but personally I think we'll all be pleasantly surprised come next May.

 

[sloth]

And the things that you are commenting on are entirely anecdotal and as such, subject to your own bias. They are not incontrovertible facts, they are your opinion and that does not make them true. The stats are completely objective and give a far better illustration of Lamela's abilities and so-called shortcomings than any fans story about how he 'loses the ball regularly.' So many of the arguments people make against Lamela are entirely subjective, ignoring what the actual facts are.

Arguments against Lamela - The actual truth

He doesn't score enough - Absolutely, he ended up with, what, 5 or 6 in all competitions? It's not enough, he needs to score more in the league.

He gives the ball away all the time - Entirely subjective based on what they've 'seen.' Statistics are a good, objective measurement and they indicate that he has a pass percentage above 80, on the same level as Eriksen. I also find it incredibly amusing how they complain about him giving the ball away but make no mention of his chances created, which is high relative to other, supposedly 'better' players, and his assists. Would they prefer him to just pass the ball backwards and not try these things? He almost embodies 'to dare is to do' in a footballing sense with his attempts to regularly play the creative, defence splitting, match winning ball. Yet some people howl about him daring at all.

He's too lightweight or not quick enough - compared to or for what? He doesn't play as a natural winger so he doesn't need to be lightning and sure he can get muscled off the ball but this completely ignores how he wins the ball back through athleticism and strength ON A REGULAR BASIS. But no, he gets knocked off the ball less regularly than he wins it back to he's 'lightweight.'

My favourite: he's not a 30m player - What even is a 30m player? Player costs are dependent on so many varying things that it is far too simple to say that a player doesn't play as a 30m player. Hell, Andy Carroll cost 35m, Torres 50m and our own Bob cost 26m yet Coutinho cost 8m, Eriksen 11m and so on. It's just a nonsensical argument used to fill their own bias or agenda.

OBJECTIVELY speaking, he's a good not yet great player but has shown signs of absolute brilliance whilst being a solid contributor over the course of a Premier League season. Not bad at all for a 23 year old. He's 23! The amount of criticism he cops from some quarters anyone would think he's in his prime. He's has got that much scope for improvement from an already good level it's ridiculous.

I think you didn't get what I was saying, read my clarification later in this thread.

 

[TheGreenLily]

He'll thrive with the increased space in front of him if we sign Berahino to stretch defences.

He's also our most suited player to Poch's system imo, so have high hopes for him this season.

It's his last chance, but personally I think we'll all be pleasantly surprised come next May.

I don't have hopes for him.

Not because I won't think he will make it, but because we will constantly play him out of position in a formation that still doesn't suit us, with a very week CM pairing. And we will ignore that and blame him for all his wows.

 

[littlemandefoe]

@davidmatzdorf Whats your opinion on him?

 

[jezz]

And the things that you are commenting on are entirely anecdotal and as such, subject to your own bias. They are not incontrovertible facts, they are your opinion and that does not make them true. The stats are completely objective and give a far better illustration of Lamela's abilities and so-called shortcomings than any fans story about how he 'loses the ball regularly.' So many of the arguments people make against Lamela are entirely subjective, ignoring what the actual facts are.

Arguments against Lamela - The actual truth

He doesn't score enough - Absolutely, he ended up with, what, 5 or 6 in all competitions? It's not enough, he needs to score more in the league.

He gives the ball away all the time - Entirely subjective based on what they've 'seen.' Statistics are a good, objective measurement and they indicate that he has a pass percentage above 80, on the same level as Eriksen. I also find it incredibly amusing how they complain about him giving the ball away but make no mention of his chances created, which is high relative to other, supposedly 'better' players, and his assists. Would they prefer him to just pass the ball backwards and not try these things? He almost embodies 'to dare is to do' in a footballing sense with his attempts to regularly play the creative, defence splitting, match winning ball. Yet some people howl about him daring at all.

He's too lightweight or not quick enough - compared to or for what? He doesn't play as a natural winger so he doesn't need to be lightning and sure he can get muscled off the ball but this completely ignores how he wins the ball back through athleticism and strength ON A REGULAR BASIS. But no, he gets knocked off the ball less regularly than he wins it back to he's 'lightweight.'

My favourite: he's not a 30m player - What even is a 30m player? Player costs are dependent on so many varying things that it is far too simple to say that a player doesn't play as a 30m player. Hell, Andy Carroll cost 35m, Torres 50m and our own Bob cost 26m yet Coutinho cost 8m, Eriksen 11m and so on. It's just a nonsensical argument used to fill their own bias or agenda.

OBJECTIVELY speaking, he's a good not yet great player but has shown signs of absolute brilliance whilst being a solid contributor over the course of a Premier League season. Not bad at all for a 23 year old. He's 23! The amount of criticism he cops from some quarters anyone would think he's in his prime. He's has got that much scope for improvement from an already good level it's ridiculous.

Well put mate.
Yes I rate Lamela, but if the naysers could put up a post like yours and acknowledge his strengths as well as his weaknesses then I would more inclined accept there arguments.

 

[Sevens]

I don't have hopes for him.

Not because I won't think he will make it, but because we will constantly play him out of position in a formation that still doesn't suit us, with a very week CM pairing. And we will ignore that and blame him for all his wows.

I love this kind of argument. I've had it with so many players before, with Rebrov being the most notable one. It's not the players fault. It's everyone else's fault.

I'm sorry but the cream rises to the top. In fact when you have an ultra talented player among a team of dross they stand out even more. If they are any good they drag the team up with them, not have the team drag them down.

 

[Sevens]

I forgot the only way to tell if a player is good or not is going to watch him live. Because, you know, you get all the technology of multiple camera angles, zoom and what not by watching the game live instead of on television

True. On TV he looks worse than when you watch him live.

 

[dontsalebale]

Well put mate.
Yes I rate Lamela, but if the naysers could put up a post like yours and acknowledge his strengths as well as his weaknesses then I would more inclined accept there arguments.

eric has got something in common with the great eric morcambe. He plays all the right notes just not nesecerily in the right order

 

[jezz]

eric has got something in common with the great eric morcambe. He plays all the right notes just not nesecerily in the right order

Another nayser with a really insightful counter argument.
You couldn't make this up..
But thanks for actually backing up the point I made.

 

[davidmatzdorf]

@davidmatzdorf Whats your opinion on him?

http://www.spurscommunity.co.uk/index.php?threads/hoddle-on-lamela.120864/page-2#post-4714289

http://www.spurscommunity.co.uk/index.php?threads/hoddle-on-lamela.120864/page-3#post-4715221

 

[littlemandefoe]

http://www.spurscommunity.co.uk/index.php?threads/hoddle-on-lamela.120864/page-2#post-4714289

http://www.spurscommunity.co.uk/index.php?threads/hoddle-on-lamela.120864/page-3#post-4715221

Thank you.

 

[SugarRay]

I would have to say that honour goes to Soldado. Similar price tag to Lamela but even more disappointing.

Soldado was cheaper and has been more impressive during games than Lamela, who looks utterly inept whenever in possession of the ball 90% of the time unfortunately.

 

[Mr-T]

Soldado was cheaper and has been more impressive during games than Lamela, who looks utterly inept whenever in possession of the ball 90% of the time unfortunately.

See that's where I'd have to disagree, firstly their transfers were apparently both £26m - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013–14_Tottenham_Hotspur_F.C._season

Lamela, when played has been pretty average at best. A few small glimpses of quality and generally works hard but usually gets out muscled and looks a bit lightweight. It should be remembered though that he has had almost a season less playing with us than Soldado due to his back injury. However, if he were to leave tomorrow the one moment he would be remembered for would be a moment of genius.

Soldado on the other hand has missed numerous sitters and open goals and the overriding memory of him, for me, is squandering that 2 on 1 situation vs Fiorentina.

 

[SugarRay]

See that's where I'd have to disagree, firstly their transfers were apparently both £26m - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013–14_Tottenham_Hotspur_F.C._season

Lamela, when played has been pretty average at best. A few small glimpses of quality and generally works hard but usually gets out muscled and looks a bit lightweight. It should be remembered though that he has had almost a season less playing with us than Soldado due to his back injury. However, if he were to leave tomorrow the one moment he would be remembered for would be a moment of genius.

Soldado on the other hand has missed numerous sitters and open goals and the overriding memory of him, for me, is squandering that 2 on 1 situation vs Fiorentina.

Soldado showed more in his first 10 games than Lamela has showed since. Great movement, brilliant technique. Not a single player on his wavelength, he vrtually gave up making these intelligent runs not long into his SPurs career because not one player had the vision or ability to find him. He became a passenger and things went fro bad to worse.

Lamela's moment of genius came against one of the worst teams you will see at White Hart Lane, and in a complete nothing game. In real football he has looked utterly awful, one footed, no pace, no guile, not even a hint of strength and some woeful decisions. Biggest flop I've seen for the club. His good moments can be condensed into a 5 second clip. It's a shame and I would like nothing more than for him to come good but how long do we waste our time with him? Seemingly not much longer, he can't even make our current side which is lacking in the very department he apparently specialises in

 

[0-Tibsy-0]

How have people got so much to moan about in regards to one player, 15 minutes in to his season...?

Jesus.

 

[Shadydan]

Comparing Soldado to Lamela? Jesus don't people get bored of this shit?!

 

[Mr-T]

Soldado showed more in his first 10 games than Lamela has showed since. Great movement, brilliant technique. Not a single player on his wavelength, he vrtually gave up making these intelligent runs not long into his SPurs career because not one player had the vision or ability to find him. He became a passenger and things went fro bad to worse.

Lamela's moment of genius came against one of the worst teams you will see at White Hart Lane, and in a complete nothing game. In real football he has looked utterly awful, one footed, no pace, no guile, not even a hint of strength and some woeful decisions. Biggest flop I've seen for the club. His good moments can be condensed into a 5 second clip. It's a shame and I would like nothing more than for him to come good but how long do we waste our time with him? Seemingly not much longer, he can't even make our current side which is lacking in the very department he apparently specialises in

Yet Soldado can't even get on the bench when we're even shorter of strikers than midfielders...

As I remember from Soldados early Spurs career he scored a few penalties and perhaps the team didn't play to him as he would have liked - but likewise he also failed to adapt to the team.

Lamelas rabona may have come against a very poor team and a lot of his better performances were in the Europa, but he also got MOTM against QPR and Liverpool last season. I don't recall Soldado getting that once...

 

[Mr-T]

Comparing Soldado to Lamela? Jesus don't people get bored of this shit?!

To be fair I've been comparing them with a view to who's the biggest flop - they are of course completely different players who play in different positions.

 

[UncleBuck]

Let's cut the crap, they are both as bad as each other, big money signings who we expected a whole lot more from.