It is Now or Never

Chimbo!

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Jan 7, 2007
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Thread starter #1
Our aspirations for next season differ from fan to fan but what is becoming increasingly clear is that whatever happens we must finish in the top 4 if we are to realize our ambitions.

With Arsenal withering and uncertain for the first time since Wenger took over, it at last appears reasonable to say that we are capable of qualifying for the Champions League. However, whilst we rejoice at Henry’s exit it presses further the concern for us to break the big 4 stranglehold. This is partially due to the development of Arsenal’s youngsters as undoubtedly Champions League experience helps them mature into top class players such as Fabregas. However, if we succeed in denying them this experience, we not only stifle their development as players but also cause their better players to flee to leave. This may seem obvious but the sense of urgency is not.
<o:p></o:p>
Platini intends to cut the maximum number of clubs eligible to qualify for the prestigious competition to 3, making the premiership further elitist. If we harbour any ambitions of winning the title in the next 10 years we must ensure the acquisition of players capable of mounting a title challenge by the start of the 2009/10 season, which is only possible through Champions league qualification.

If we fail in this then Liverpool, Chelsea, Manchester United and possibly Arsenal will dominate the league and leave us with no chance of silverware or success in the short-term or medium future, not to mention Berbatov’s impending exit should this happen.
<o:p></o:p>
This urgency is then furthered by the potential for football clubs instead of the Premier League selling their TV rights individually to companies*. This would mean the bigger clubs i.e. those in the top 3 or 4 will get significantly more TV money then the rest, increasing the distance between themselves and the others; this is why Juventus and AC Milan have been so utterly dominant of the Italian league.

In-turn this has caused a sudden influx of foreign investors desperate to cash in on the TV goldmine. The desperation of clubs to avoid being on the receiving end of such an alteration to TV payments is demonstrated by the mass spending spree all the clubs seem to be promising, the excessive inflation of player values is testament to this.

West Ham, <st1:place><st1:placename>Man</st1:placename> <st1:placetype>City</st1:placetype></st1:place>, <st1:city><st1:place>Newcastle</st1:place></st1:city>, Aston Villa and <st1:city><st1:place>Portsmouth</st1:place></st1:city> all realise this and along with us are in a scrap to secure the best TV deals and the rewarding 3<sup>rd</sup> place in years to come. We, however, have the head start with 3 years of rebuilding already done.

Therefore Tottenham Hotspur must ensure that it forms a part of the premiership elite soon if it is to be able to compete for honours.

And with changes to both the number of Champions League qualification places and potentially TV deals in the next decade, time is running out for Martin Jol and Daniel Levy.

We need to stop saying 5<sup>th</sup> is acceptable next season because after millions spent and so much promised only substantial improvement will do. No excuses, no second chance, we need 4<sup>th</sup> and we need it now!
<o:p></o:p>
Next season will shape the destiny of this Club.
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
*If the Glazers ever wanted to make a lot of money quickly, all they have to do is refuse to have their TV rights represented by the Premier League and sell them themselves to Sky for example. As Manchester United play in the majority of games televised they will therefore get most of the original TV package’s money.

Sky will then bid significantly less for the rest of the games then they would otherwise, forcing other clubs to follow Manchester United’s lead in order to gain more money and not share the payment evenly.
<o:p></o:p>
 
Joined
Jan 29, 2006
Messages
77
#2
I think that's all a bit sensationalist!

I think if we can go far in all the cups again, maybe win one of them, and genuinely challenge for the champions league spots (as in 2005/6) then that's a good season.

I doubt the big clubs would let Platini reduce the Champo league places to 3 anyway.
 

jenko

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Joined
Mar 18, 2004
Messages
4,637
#3
We do need fourth but only to keep our best players and pay off the investment that has been made. It will not mean we are part of the elite all of a sudden, that will take more time. That will take CL qualification for at least 3 years and then it will probably require a bigger stadium and then who knows?

In short, we just gotta stay ahead of the Arseh*les!!!
 

stemark44

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Joined
Mar 17, 2005
Messages
6,598
#4
In any other league in Europe we would already be playing in the Champions league for the last two seasons.
This is the Premiership and we are competing against four of the best teams in Europe, never mind England.
It will not be easy to break the stranglehold these teams have on the league and we will have to strengthen our midfield options by at least 2 more players to give us any kind of chance.
 

alamo

Don't worry be happy
Joined
Jun 10, 2004
Messages
4,605
#5
Hmmm. This article is very reflective of the inflated expectations commonly expressed by many a spurs fans in the last season or two. Maybe i'm just a ol' miserable 30+ sceptic who has been subjected to too many years of mediocrity but sentences such as "We need to stop saying 5th is acceptable next season" have me shaking my head in utter disbelief. Ok that was quoted out of context but come on.....
 
Joined
May 3, 2007
Messages
350
#6
I tend to agree. It's a nervous year. The most important thing we can do is KEEP our best players - we have such a fantastic squad now that next summer will be about KEEPING our players.

I can't imagine a player like Berbatov will stay with us if we don't make the Champions League. He deserves to play the best football and he isn't 20 years old any more - he is in his prime. There are always more players that we can buy, there will forever be top class finds around europe but we are here now with an amazing squad of players, on the verge (on paper) of doing it.

I don't want to give our players ANY EXCUSE at all to leave next summer.


Our time is now, and if King manages to have an (almost) injury free season, then I believe in my heart that we could make 4th place.
 

yiddopaul

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2005
Messages
1,871
#7
Our aspirations for next season differ from fan to fan but what is becoming increasingly clear is that whatever happens we must finish in the top 4 if we are to realize our ambitions.

With Arsenal withering and uncertain for the first time since Wenger took over, it at last appears reasonable to say that we are capable of qualifying for the Champions League. However, whilst we rejoice at Henry’s exit it presses further the concern for us to break the big 4 stranglehold. This is partially due to the development of Arsenal’s youngsters as undoubtedly Champions League experience helps them mature into top class players such as Fabregas. However, if we succeed in denying them this experience, we not only stifle their development as players but also cause their better players to flee to leave. This may seem obvious but the sense of urgency is not.
<o:p></o:p>
Platini intends to cut the maximum number of clubs eligible to qualify for the prestigious competition to 3, making the premiership further elitist. If we harbour any ambitions of winning the title in the next 10 years we must ensure the acquisition of players capable of mounting a title challenge by the start of the 2009/10 season, which is only possible through Champions league qualification.

If we fail in this then Liverpool, Chelsea, Manchester United and possibly Arsenal will dominate the league and leave us with no chance of silverware or success in the short-term or medium future, not to mention Berbatov’s impending exit should this happen.
<o:p></o:p>
This urgency is then furthered by the potential for football clubs instead of the Premier League selling their TV rights individually to companies*. This would mean the bigger clubs i.e. those in the top 3 or 4 will get significantly more TV money then the rest, increasing the distance between themselves and the others; this is why Juventus and AC Milan have been so utterly dominant of the Italian league.

In-turn this has caused a sudden influx of foreign investors desperate to cash in on the TV goldmine. The desperation of clubs to avoid being on the receiving end of such an alteration to TV payments is demonstrated by the mass spending spree all the clubs seem to be promising, the excessive inflation of player values is testament to this.

West Ham, <st1:place><st1:placename>Man</st1:placename> <st1:placetype>City</st1:placetype></st1:place>, <st1:city><st1:place>Newcastle</st1:place></st1:city>, Aston Villa and <st1:city><st1:place>Portsmouth</st1:place></st1:city> all realise this and along with us are in a scrap to secure the best TV deals and the rewarding 3<sup>rd</sup> place in years to come. We, however, have the head start with 3 years of rebuilding already done.

Therefore Tottenham Hotspur must ensure that it forms a part of the premiership elite soon if it is to be able to compete for honours.

And with changes to both the number of Champions League qualification places and potentially TV deals in the next decade, time is running out for Martin Jol and Daniel Levy.

We need to stop saying 5<sup>th</sup> is acceptable next season because after millions spent and so much promised only substantial improvement will do. No excuses, no second chance, we need 4<sup>th</sup> and we need it now!
<o:p></o:p>
Next season will shape the destiny of this Club.
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
*If the Glazers ever wanted to make a lot of money quickly, all they have to do is refuse to have their TV rights represented by the Premier League and sell them themselves to Sky for example. As Manchester United play in the majority of games televised they will therefore get most of the original TV package’s money.

Sky will then bid significantly less for the rest of the games then they would otherwise, forcing other clubs to follow Manchester United’s lead in order to gain more money and not share the payment evenly.<o:p></o:p>
blimey, you make it sound as though Jol and Levy are letting us down and this is there last chance! basically your implying that this is a make or break season for the club - pressure which i do not think is helpful from the fans (especially fickle spurs fans)

the past 2 seasons have been brilliant, we have and will continue to make huge strides and are probably advancing at a more rapid pace than pool and arse.
 
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
948
#8
And what some people need to realise that we cant do in two/three years what man u under fergie has been doing for all the years he has been there. Fergie won nothing for five years at man u now look at them.
 

Chimbo!

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Joined
Jan 7, 2007
Messages
2,251
Thread starter #9
blimey, you make it sound as though Jol and Levy are letting us down and this is there last chance! basically your implying that this is a make or break season for the club - pressure which i do not think is helpful from the fans (especially fickle spurs fans)

the past 2 seasons have been brilliant, we have and will continue to make huge strides and are probably advancing at a more rapid pace than pool and arse.
I am not suggesting that we r being let down, its just that if we want to achieve something we need to make a significant leap this season i.e. 4th because if we dont we will lose berbatov and that could be the catalyst for our undoing. We have spent over 30million so far this preseason, Levy is doing this to help spurs get champions league football in 08/09 season not mediocre 5th. The urgency is increased by clubs below us also spending big and if we finished 5th nxt season and lost berbatov they could catch up and we would be under enormous pressure the following season to deliver, when it may no longer be possible. We have to abandon our cynicism and scepticism and belive that our squad is made of winners. All i will say is "It is better to fail aiming high than to succeed aiming low. And we of Spurs have
set our sights very high, so high in fact that even failure will have in it an echo of glory."
 
Joined
Mar 2, 2005
Messages
174
#10
interesting post, if from a quite extreme viewpoint. obviously it is essential that we keep improving (as we have every year under jol). this means getting into the champs league, winning cups and eventually challenging and winning the league (and euro cup). if we're not aiming for that then we might as well go home. i personally wouldn't say that it's now or never, but the improvement needs to continue and we need to start beating the top for regularly. i think that this has a lot to do with the belief in the team. hopefully after two 5th place finishes our players will believe that they can do it. whether platini can restrict the money leagues from europe in favour of slavakia and lithuania remains to be seen. finally, i think that milan and juve may have dominated the italian league by bribing every official they could!!!
 
Joined
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Messages
174
#11
and i've just been called jason cundy which seems a bit harsh for a sunday morning. what do you have to do to get to ginger pele status?!
 
Joined
Aug 19, 2003
Messages
725
#12
How would people feel if the title turned into a 5 way battle, with the difference in the top 5 (us, chelsea, liverpool, man u and arse) only a few points with the rest of the league way behind? If we finished 5th in this position but were in the consideration for the title within the last few weeks with just other teams results going against us would people still feel that 5th wasn't acceptable?

I for one would be immensly proud of that achievment, even if we didn't qualify for the champions league. Stemark44 made the good point of saying that we are competing against 4 of the best teams in europe - 3 have won the league 14 out of the 15 years the premiership has been in existence and liverpool won the champions league a few years ago and only lost in the final last year.
 

N10toN17

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#13
I am not suggesting that we r being let down, its just that if we want to achieve something we need to make a significant leap this season i.e. 4th because if we dont we will lose berbatov and that could be the catalyst for our undoing. We have spent over 30million so far this preseason, Levy is doing this to help spurs get champions league football in 08/09 season not mediocre 5th. The urgency is increased by clubs below us also spending big and if we finished 5th nxt season and lost berbatov they could catch up and we would be under enormous pressure the following season to deliver, when it may no longer be possible. We have to abandon our cynicism and scepticism and belive that our squad is made of winners. All i will say is "It is better to fail aiming high than to succeed aiming low. And we of Spurs have
set our sights very high, so high in fact that even failure will have in it an echo of glory."
5th mediocre? I'd say your thread and subsequent post are mediocre. You have this crazy ill thought out now or never scenario rolling around in your head, you've wrote a piece as silly and sensationalist as any crappy tabloid could produce, you should have had a headline, "Spurs for fourth or amageddon is nigh".
 

Chimbo!

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Joined
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Messages
2,251
Thread starter #14
5th mediocre? I'd say your thread and subsequent post are mediocre. You have this crazy ill thought out now or never scenario rolling around in your head, you've wrote a piece as silly and sensationalist as any crappy tabloid could produce, you should have had a headline, "Spurs for fourth or amageddon is nigh".
There's no need 2 get aggressive but people seem to always postpone our need to finish in a champions league place to in 2 seasons time. I remember people saying 2 years ago we should by now have closed the gap on the elite. In the last 2 seasons we have had chances to get to the promised land and failed to seize the oppurtunity, theres only so many chances we will get. We have spent more then Arsenal for the last 3 years, yet we (based on last season) are 8 points behind them. At some point we will have to break the elite if we want success and it is only going to get harder, not easier and imo this coming season will represent the best chance of us achieving 4th, afterwards it will be harder. If Arsenal stay in the champions league they will get better and increase the gap between us and the top 4. Our need to finish 4th is as much to do with us getting there as it is in denying Arsenal. If we fail to do it this season i fear we will not be able to do it for a while after. What i will say, however, is if we gain say 70 points next season and still fail to finish in the top 4 then fair enough we did a great job but it wasnt good enough. However, if u want 2 win u have to beat the opposition and in the last 15 years we have seen our side be a bunch of losers, accepting 2nd best, well i am fed up of it and so are our players; only victory will do and we need to stop saying 5th is alright because quite frankly no improvement 2 seasons on from our 1st 5th after major investment is unacceptable. For heavens sake spurs fans be ambitious and be bold. Too often we have been unrealistic in our goals but finally when our team can achieve something we go cynical!!??
 

N10toN17

New Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2007
Messages
1,288
#15
There's no need 2 get aggressive but people seem to always postpone our need to finish in a champions league place to in 2 seasons time. I remember people saying 2 years ago we should by now have closed the gap on the elite. In the last 2 seasons we have had chances to get to the promised land and failed to seize the oppurtunity, theres only so many chances we will get. We have spent more then Arsenal for the last 3 years, yet we (based on last season) are 8 points behind them. At some point we will have to break the elite if we want success and it is only going to get harder, not easier and imo this coming season will represent the best chance of us achieving 4th, afterwards it will be harder. If Arsenal stay in the champions league they will get better and increase the gap between us and the top 4. Our need to finish 4th is as much to do with us getting there as it is in denying Arsenal. If we fail to do it this season i fear we will not be able to do it for a while after. What i will say, however, is if we gain say 70 points next season and still fail to finish in the top 4 then fair enough we did a great job but it wasnt good enough. However, if u want 2 win u have to beat the opposition and in the last 15 years we have seen our side be a bunch of losers, accepting 2nd best, well i am fed up of it and so are our players; only victory will do and we need to stop saying 5th is alright because quite frankly no improvement 2 seasons on from our 1st 5th after major investment is unacceptable. For heavens sake spurs fans be ambitious and be bold. Too often we have been unrealistic in our goals but finally when our team can achieve something we go cynical!!??
Cynical? How about some patience Chimbo. In the mid eighties we could hold our head high against the scum, but since then we've fallen way behind, "twenty" plus years and I've stood and sat and watched through it all.

We've only got our act together, under Levy's excellent stewardship the last couple of seasons, how do you expect a bridge like that to be crossed so quickly, the improvement in our team from four or five years ago has been astounding and your not happy because we're not quite there yet.

Just enjoy that we've got our Spurs back and that we are really competing once again, if you and the rest of our support don't spiv out and stay calm and objective, give the players some time, we can make it.
 

Chimbo!

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Joined
Jan 7, 2007
Messages
2,251
Thread starter #16
I would love to be patient and i appreciate the excellent work of our board and manager and players, but i feel because of circumstances beyond their control we r not going to get a better chance to get into the top 4 then next season. Fair enough what ive said is sensationalist but im concerned that if we dont get 4th our best players will leave and that inturn will make it even harder to attract players of a calibre to even maintain our level when they see our best players leaving whilst at the same time clubs like Newcastle get better and better. We currently have an advantage over clubs like that but another 5th placed finsih may see the gap between us and the teams below us close rather than that between us and the top 4.
 
Joined
Mar 2, 2005
Messages
174
#17
there is not an elite four. the last two seasons there has been an elite two, then a nearly there next two, followed by us and a few others, then the also rans. the top four is not the promised land and aiming for it is not being bold, just as finishing fifth is not settling for second best. being bold is aiming to win the league and then the european cup. it is aiming to be the best and to do this consistently. it is setting up a regime and infrastructure capable of doing this. i believe that this is precisely what levy, jol and comoli are doing. we are doing a constantly improving first 11, backed by a squad with strength in depth, whilst developing and attracting the cream of young players. this is a model you will see at arsenal, man u and liverpool (all to various degrees with differing emphasise.) "it's now or never" shows a lack of nerve and a lack of faith. the important thing is to be CONSISTENTLY IMPROVING IN ALL ASPECTS OF THE CLUB. better coaching, better scouting, better youth better squad, better team. if 5 years ago someone had said we would have berbs, keane, bent and defoe up front with pekahart and dixon coming through i would have laughed at their insanity. we are a well run, well managed business and club. people need to grow up and realise how competetive our league is and enjoy how much we have and are achieving. Pheww! i'm off for a lie down. jason bloody cundy my arse!
 

N10toN17

New Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2007
Messages
1,288
#18
I would love to be patient and i appreciate the excellent work of our board and manager and players, but i feel because of circumstances beyond their control we r not going to get a better chance to get into the top 4 then next season. Fair enough what ive said is sensationalist but im concerned that if we dont get 4th our best players will leave and that inturn will make it even harder to attract players of a calibre to even maintain our level when they see our best players leaving whilst at the same time clubs like Newcastle get better and better. We currently have an advantage over clubs like that but another 5th placed finsih may see the gap between us and the teams below us close rather than that between us and the top 4.
Didn't mean to be agressive, so apologies, but yes alot of these teams below us are and will improve, but guess what, so are we, it's all relative. Can they improve enough to overtake us, time will tell, but I believe we have a better chance of topling the top four in the next few seasons than they have of toppling us.
 

Lanh

Bjorn Too Soon
Joined
Jan 4, 2006
Messages
22,213
#19
Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear!

The prophet of doom has spoken, be forewarned Yids of the world, your beloved Spurs may very well be doomed!!!

I'd apologise for the sarcasm but I'm not sorry.

Stop stressing out so much Chimbo, what will be will be. Sure we'd all love it if it happened but bloody hell, we'll get over it if it doesn't and try again the year after!

Reading this thread, it's difficult to believe that some would be on the brink of committing suicide if we finished outside the top 4, as much as I love Spurs personally, that is going too far!
 

WhiteHeartLowe

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Joined
Jul 7, 2004
Messages
1,617
#20

With Arsenal withering and uncertain for the first time since Wenger took over, it at last appears reasonable to say that we are capable of qualifying for the Champions League.

Two things bother me about this sentence, one is this idea of Arsenal 'withering' without Henry, I just cant see that happening, and secondly it seems to be saying that our only route to champions league football is if one of the 'top four' clubs become less good than us, then we can succeed them in the top four. I think thats a mistake, we must concentrait on being better than them, not waiting for them to slip up. :-|
 
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