New Stadium Details And Discussions

[Bobbins]

Have we got a limit on how many non football events we can have?

No idea - presumably this has been worked out with the council and is documented somewhere. I'd imagine that Haringay wants as many visitors as possible on weekends at least.

 

[Lilbaz]

No idea - presumably this has been worked out with the council and is documented somewhere. I'd imagine that Haringay wants as many visitors as possible on weekends at least.

Think after the riots and os we probably got as many as we want.

 

[LexingtonSpurs]

We're not limited to two NFL games a season and one or two summer events - we can host pretty much anything at any time - even so far as a PL match on a Saturday and a concert or event on the Sunday.

While I agree with the concept - there is very little chance of this ever happening. The pitch can be put away quickly enough, but I don't think anyone is building a stage, and sound and lighting system for a performer who would attract 40,000+ in a day's time...

 

[Saoirse]

https://www.minutes.haringey.gov.uk/mgAi.aspx?ID=47683

B19 there - a maximum of 16 major non-football events, including at most 6 concerts, and unlimited minor (less than 10,000 attendance) events, each year.

Only way I see us getting close to that is if we get an NFL franchise one day. They'd have a minimum of 8 home games, potentially 2 home playoff ties, and would normally play two home friendlies too (although I think those could all be away if needed).

 

[davidmatzdorf]

Let’s conservatively guess that the cost of incorporating the NFL piece of things was £100M. We get paid £2M per NFL game I think? It’ll take us 50 games to recoup that. That’s a long time, and not guaranteed beyond what 10 years? It hasn’t helped secure a naming rights sponsor (which I’m guessing Daniel thought it would).

We talk about the prohibitive cost of the stadium in reference to the transfer window, but at least 10% of the total cost of it is going toward accommodating someone not related to Tottenham Hotspur and whose relationship hasn’t contributed positively to our club. Hell of a deal for the NFL, a rare gamble by Levy that hasn’t paid off...

It isn't about recouping cash. It's not a current account or a piggy bank.

It's about positioning the club to be the home for an NFL franchise if/when one is based in London, with all the synergy of branding, merchandising and linked-up promotion that involves.

Like just about everything that ENIC (the English National Investment Company), does, It's about increasing the asset value of the club.

It's a long term investment and how long it takes to recover the additional cash-cost in revenue terms is a minor consideration.

 

[JamieSpursCommunityUser]

https://www.minutes.haringey.gov.uk/mgAi.aspx?ID=47683

B19 there - a maximum of 16 major non-football events, including at most 6 concerts, and unlimited minor (less than 10,000 attendance) events, each year.

Only way I see us getting close to that is if we get an NFL franchise one day. They'd have a minimum of 8 home games, potentially 2 home playoff ties, and would normally play two home friendlies too (although I think those could all be away if needed).

6 Concerts, 2 NFL games, Boxing, Esports

Plus plenty more football events...pre-Season tournament games (teams can train and stay at the lodge), Argentina or Brazil friendlies, bid for a Europa or CL finals.

The more high profile events, the stronger our hand for naming rights.

 

[TheWallYid]

I just want to point out that a decent chunk of the overall cost of the stadium is because we decided to turn it into a place that’s supposed to be the eventual home of the London NFL team. We didn’t have to do this at all.

This was a big risk Daniel took, and with Khan (whose Jaguars team is the shoe-in for the eventual London team) about to buy Wembley, it’s looking like one that will not pay off, as there’s no way Khan lets his team play anywhere but Wembley.

Let’s conservatively guess that the cost of incorporating the NFL piece of things was £100M. We get paid £2M per NFL game I think? It’ll take us 50 games to recoup that. That’s a long time, and not guaranteed beyond what 10 years? It hasn’t helped secure a naming rights sponsor (which I’m guessing Daniel thought it would).

We talk about the prohibitive cost of the stadium in reference to the transfer window, but at least 10% of the total cost of it is going toward accommodating someone not related to Tottenham Hotspur and whose relationship hasn’t contributed positively to our club. Hell of a deal for the NFL, a rare gamble by Levy that hasn’t paid off.

I like Daniel but this really annoys me. I know this is probably too linear of thinking but we could have easily not accommodated the NFL for our stadium and used those funds during the transfer window / paid off our stadium earlier / whatever.

Is it not well established that the stadium build cost is around £350m I don't think a third of it was based on the stadium having a sliding pitch and bigger changing rooms in the east stand. Also its not just NFL there will be concerts potentially boxing etc.

 

[Dougal]

Few more panels going up in the northwest corner. Should please a few people.

 

[LeParisien]

Is it not well established that the stadium build cost is around £350m I don't think a third of it was based on the stadium having a sliding pitch and bigger changing rooms in the east stand. Also its not just NFL there will be concerts potentially boxing etc.

As per a thread in this subsection, Donna Cullen has confirmed that it is now £800m. Some of that rise is attributed to Brexit.

 

[hakano]

As per a thread in this subsection, Donna Cullen has confirmed that it is now £800m. Some of that rise is attributed to Brexit.

I'm pretty sure that is the whole development once all phases are complete - not sure if all of that cost wise is borne by the club in anycase.

 

[davidmatzdorf]

As per a thread in this subsection, Donna Cullen has confirmed that it is now £800m. Some of that rise is attributed to Brexit.

I'm pretty sure that is the whole development once all phases are complete - not sure if all of that cost wise is borne by the club in anycase.

Yes, it was clarified a couple of weeks ago that (as many of us thought) the figure of £850m represents the whole development and that the stadium itself constitutes about £350m of this.

As @hakano implies, I'd expect the residential and hotel developments to be cash-flowed, in part or entirely, by a residential developer and/or hotel operator, with a profit-sharing arrangement between THFC and the developer.

Quite a bit of the £850m will relate to historical costs that were paid out many years ago: the land acquisition, the feasibility studies, the planning application and the construction of Phase 1 (Lilywhite House and the Sainsbury's). I wouldn't know or want to guess what proportion of those costs were borrowed and are secured on the land or the completed Phase 1, i.e., how much debt the club is carrying in respect of completed parts of the NDP, but I doubt it's very much in comparison to the current value of those properties. The stadium itself is the main cost that needs to be covered by some form of financing arranged directly by the club and that is estimated at £350m, not £850m.

 

[mark87]

I'm pretty sure that is the whole development once all phases are complete - not sure if all of that cost wise is borne by the club in anycase.

Wasn't it 350m to 400m on the stadium, with the rest of the development taking it to 800m?

 

[LeParisien]

I'm pretty sure that is the whole development once all phases are complete - not sure if all of that cost wise is borne by the club in anycase.

I would like some clarity here then.

I thought it was around £400m for stadium and around £850m for the whole project (including transport, hotel and flats etc).

However the message clearly states:

“In the latest minutes of the THST board to board meeting with the club, a figure of £800m was quoted as the cost now for the 'stadium' only - up some £400m from previously know public domain information.”

This is not challenged by Donna Cullen in her reply.

Edit- thank you @davidmatzdorf Do you have a source, from after August 1, which confirms that?

 

[davidmatzdorf]

Edit- thank you @davidmatzdorf Do you have a source, from after August 1, which confirms that?

It's on this thread somewhere. I think someone nicked it off Skyscraper City. I don't recall the date - perhaps 2 weeks ago?

Have you got the corresponding link to those THST minutes?

 

[LeParisien]

It's on this thread somewhere. I think someone nicked it off Skyscraper City. I don't recall the date - perhaps 2 weeks ago?

Have you got the corresponding link to those THST minutes?

I don’t.

My information was only from here http://www.spurscommunity.co.uk/index.php?threads/nwhl-stadium-costs.127862/#post-5380465

Having looked at the date though it’s very old so I am satisfied it is no longer relevant and the information you have posted is correct !

Thank you

 

[Saoirse]

6 Concerts, 2 NFL games, Boxing, Esports

Plus plenty more football events...pre-Season tournament games (teams can train and stay at the lodge), Argentina or Brazil friendlies, bid for a Europa or CL finals.

The more high profile events, the stronger our hand for naming rights.

Absolutely, I'm sure we'll put on as much as we can get. And conveniently there's no limit for the number of football games, so we can put on as much pre-season nonsense, Brazil friends, and UEFA finals as we can get our hands on.

 

[JamieSpursCommunityUser]

Absolutely, I'm sure we'll put on as much as we can get. And conveniently there's no limit for the number of football games, so we can put on as much pre-season nonsense, Brazil friends, and UEFA finals as we can get our hands on.

I'd have though they could also put a stage facing the South stand, and reconfigure it for outdoor theatre and comedy for say 4-5 months of the year.

Michael McIntyre say (spurs fan), Walking with Dinosaurs, League of Gentlemen live - the sort of acts that come through on the O2 and Wembley arena.

It would still hold 15-20k+.

 

[samspurs92]

Where’s this grass then?

Only 2 weeks before the test event.

 

[absolute bobbins]

Where’s this grass then?

Only 2 weeks before the test event.

At the training ground

 

[whitesocks]

While I agree with the concept - there is very little chance of this ever happening. The pitch can be put away quickly enough, but I don't think anyone is building a stage, and sound and lighting system for a performer who would attract 40,000+ in a day's time...

I agree.
The Rolling Stones crew need the best part of a week to build the stage, and the best part of a week to dismantle it all again.
I guess if the fixtures fall right with an international break, we could have a concert mid-season, but the big bands have schedules of their own - they are not necessarily going to go out of their way fit in with our precise window.

For concerts, we will be competing with Wembley and the Olympic stadium etc in the summer months. The retractable pitch doesn't add much advantage for these - Wembley can just relay the pitch if is beyond repair - not a big deal - they do it 4X a year anyway I believe.

Other events like boxing need less stage work, but because we have a permanent artificial pitch rather than bare concrete, all that will have to be carefully covered before seating can be put out. That will take a good 1-2 days. But, yes, we could just about fit events like that in amongst our busiest schedule. Are there many events like this that need a 60k stadium?

An NFL franchise, should it ever come to London - will generate more money at Wembley - that will be their preferred option. Wembley will need to ditch international fixtures though, so with the largest stadium in London, I guess we could pick up many of these events, but what has that to do with the retractable pitch?

I think the retractable pitch will start paying for itself when they set up a Euro NFL (again), but the main franchise would have to come over first to gee up interest, and obviously we'd have to wait until the war with europe had settled down a little. It is a very long term speculative investment.