New Stadium Details And Discussions

[UpTownSpur]

I'm OK with that. You still haven't understood my posts. Because you're still obsessing about what we "should" do and assuming that I am doing the same. It's a collective blind spot on SC.

At no point have I made any recommendations or demands. I have not said what I think we should be doing about the stadium, nor where we should be playing next season's matches. I don't do that.

I am asking you whether you think the club has those priorities - I don't think so. I'm not interested in what you want. I'm interested in what you think the club wants. But your brain doesn't seem to be able to adjust to the difference.

So moan away. Just don't revive this and insist that I said that the club "should" be paying at Wembley next season. Because I have not communicated any opinion on that. I have no view on whether it is a "bad idea". I'm interested discussing what is likely to happen.

I think the club wants success on the pitch but the club underestimates what effect playing at Wembley will have on that success. We as fans can influence the club - if I had my way I'd start a fan protest against the move to Wembley. I don't go to Spurs these days but when I did I was a very active supporter. I sang songs and shouted abuse at opposition players. You sound like someone who just sits there.

 

[Lilbaz]

I'm gonna remind you of this post next season. You'll have no right to moan if we have abnormally poor results at Wembley, because according to you it doesn't matter. I will be moaning and reminding everyone I told them this was a bad idea, and going on a forum is the only way I can express that in the faint hope it will make difference.

Just out of interest, why do you think we would have abnormally poor results at wembley but not at the new partially completed stadium (which probably wouldn't have a roof and only a temporary pitch without drainage or heating as we would be unable to put in the proper retractable pitch)?

 

[davidmatzdorf]

I think the club wants success on the pitch but the club underestimates what effect playing at Wembley will have on that success.

I think you're right.

I don't go to Spurs these days but when I did I was a very active supporter. I sang songs and shouted abuse at opposition players. You sound like someone who just sits there.

I have a season ticket and I attend every home league match and nearly all home cup matches (although I missed today because I missed the deadline for reserving our seats).

When I haven't got a singing gig or a strenuous rehearsal in the next few days, I sing along with the chants (but not the abusive ones). When I have to sing in the same week, I try (and usually fail) to keep my gob shut, to save my voice.

 

[UpTownSpur]

Just out of interest, why do you think we would have abnormally poor results at wembley but not at the new partially completed stadium (which probably wouldn't have a roof and only a temporary pitch without drainage or heating as we would be unable to put in the proper retractable pitch)?

I just know Wembley will be a bad idea. Guardiola said about the Olympic Stadium that the openess of the stadium itself gave a psychological impression that the pitch itself was bigger and the players seemed to have more time. If we did play in play in a partially built stadium, it would be with a roof and a proper pitch. I don't know what it would be like, just it will be in a familiar location and better than Wembley with the top tier closed. The best solution, for results in the pitch, would be somewhere like Milton Keynes but too many people are focussed on the difficulty that presents them personally rather than how it would benefit the team and club in terms of results.

 

[RichieS]

Whilst I appreciate the info from someone who plainly is ITK, I have to say that the post from Matilda Cullen, sorry, I meant Collywobs, is an excruciating example of how to write pompous, tortuous, fake-educated prose of the worst kind.

I expend some effort here trying to set out technical or legal issues from the development world in prose that people can read and grasp. If you want to see why, read this through a few times. It's accurate information, but for some ill-advised reason, perhaps insecurity about her education, the writer has felt compelled to cloak it in as much pretentious horseshit as she can.

My favourite bit of semi-Freudian bollocks: WTF is a "fail accompli"? Maybe we can be charitable and out that down to auto-correct.

I thought Matilda was reckoned to be Matthew Collecott?

 

[thebenjamin]

Posted by Matilda Collywobs on Glory-Glory

fail accompli".

French for 'Spursy'

 

[Flashspur]

I think the club wants success on the pitch but the club underestimates what effect playing at Wembley will have on that success. We as fans can influence the club - if I had my way I'd start a fan protest against the move to Wembley. I don't go to Spurs these days but when I did I was a very active supporter. I sang songs and shouted abuse at opposition players. You sound like someone who just sits there.

seriously dude...you take the cake

 

[Bruts]

I think you're right.



I have a season ticket and I attend every home league match and nearly all home cup matches (although I missed today because I missed the deadline for reserving our seats).

When I haven't got a singing gig or a strenuous rehearsal in the next few days, I sing along with the chants (but not the abusive ones). When I have to sing in the same week, I try (and usually fail) to keep my gob shut, to save my voice.

There was no deadline? It was included in our season tickets

 

[SandroClegane]

Dan Ahern ‏@topical_storm
If Tottenham's new stadium doesn't include a narrow row of sandwich shops called Deli Alley they aren't even trying and must be disbanded.

 

[whitesocks]

My uninformed view is that those who have said:
- The PL rules demand that stadiums all have a roof of some description are correct
- There are financial considerations to getting the roof up as soon as possible, regardless of when the stadium is operational are correct - that's why the NE corner was demolished early.
- Those who have said that the retractable pitch may come some time after the opening are correct - it is not essential.
- Those who have said that getting the structure up is only the start of the real work are correct, but given what happened at the Bilbao Stadium, it seems a lot of corners can be cut.

I think it is useful leverage to have a potential fallback in any negotiations with Wembley, but I cannot think Levy wants any bad publicity in the new stadium, with toilets backing up or the lighting failing or anyone getting as much as a splinter from a boarded up concession. There are a lot of people ready to laugh very loudly at any early misfortune so we cant rush this.

 

[Deeyal]

- Those who have said that the retractable pitch may come some time after the opening are correct - it is not essential.
.

Im intrigued- Please can you clarify what you mean by it not being essential? what is the alternative in your view?

I may be shouted down here by those more knowledgable, but I think that it may be esential due to the design. They are building a permanent artifical NFL surface that will sit underneath the retractable football pitch. Are you suggestuing they use the NFL pitch as a temporary solution? I'm not sure this would be viable would it? or are you saying the could build a non retracting pitch over the top of the NFL surface as a temporary solution. Surely this would not be cost effective, and then they would have to replace the entire pitch at some point anyway? and surely they would have to build whatever mechanisnm they are using to retract said pitch in advance? so at that point, wouldnt you be better off doing it all at the same time?

 

[davidmatzdorf]

There was no deadline? It was included in our season tickets

I thought we had already had our two cup tickets. No?

 

[Dougal]

I thought we had already had our two cup tickets. No?

Just Gillingham in the League Cup and Wembley which didn't count...

 

[yankspurs]

I think the club wants success on the pitch but the club underestimates what effect playing at Wembley will have on that success. We as fans can influence the club - if I had my way I'd start a fan protest against the move to Wembley. I don't go to Spurs these days but when I did I was a very active supporter. I sang songs and shouted abuse at opposition players. You sound like someone who just sits there.

Where do you think would be a good place to play if not at Wembley? We're not going to the OS, the bridge or the emirates. Upton Park is destroyed. Wembley was chosen because its the only viable option in London(capacity wise) and they dont want to move the club out of London, even for a year. The fans in England fought so hard against that when the talk was Mk Dons. There's no problems playing at Wembley. We just have to play better. Bottom line. Plus, we need to get used to playing at a big stadium with a bigger pitch regularly. The new stadium's pitch will be the same size as Wembley's.

 

[UpTownSpur]

seriously dude...you take the cake

And your point is? Do you think our job as fans is to be dispassionate observes of the club? Or to try and influence it if we think it's taking a wrong direction? It was the likes of me that chased Sugar out of the club. I'm not dissing DM for his dispassionate observer stance anymore than I'd diss his terrible song lyrics, but why should I not be able to express an opinion that the current plan to play at Wembley for a year would be a terrible mistake and an alternative should be found?

 

[davidmatzdorf]

Just Gillingham in the League Cup and Wembley which didn't count...

I guess I thought there had been two League Cup matches.

 

[UpTownSpur]

Where do you think would be a good place to play if not at Wembley? We're not going to the OS, the bridge or the emirates. Upton Park is destroyed. Wembley was chosen because its the only viable option in London(capacity wise) and they dont want to move the club out of London, even for a year. The fans in England fought so hard against that when the talk was Mk Dons. There's no problems playing at Wembley. We just have to play better. Bottom line. Plus, we need to get used to playing at a big stadium with a bigger pitch regularly. The new stadium's pitch will be the same size as Wembley's.

Some stadiums have a particular quality that allows the players playing there to essentially block out the crowd and play as if they're playing a training match. Wembley, like the Olympic Stadium, has that quality. This means that the teams playing their home games in such stadiums effectively have no home advantage. Home advantage is basically a psychologial phenomenon that causes the home players to play at or above their level and the opposition players to play below it. Our two games this season against Chelsea showed this point. Both games were even and the psychological phenomenon of home advantage created by the design of WHL and SB proved the decisive factor. Look at what's happened to West Ham when they play home games without home advantage. We won't suffer as badly as them at Wembley because we have a better team, but we won't be as dominant at home as we have been this season.

In my opinion, our choice of temporary home should be somewhere that we are able to utilise the psychological phenomenon of home advantage, or else we'll find it difficult to compete for the top 4 next season.

 

[yiddopaul]

Some stadiums have a particular quality that allows the players playing there to essentially block out the crowd and play as if they're playing a training match. Wembley, like the Olympic Stadium, has that quality. This means that the teams playing their home games in such stadiums effectively have no home advantage. Home advantage is basically a psychologial phenomenon that causes the home players to play at or above their level and the opposition players to play below it. Our two games this season against Chelsea showed this point. Both games were even and the psychological phenomenon of home advantage created by the design of WHL and SB proved the decisive factor. Look at what's happened to West Ham when they play home games without home advantage. We won't suffer as badly as them at Wembley because we have a better team, but we won't be as dominant at home as we have been this season.

In my opinion, our choice of temporary home should be somewhere that we are able to utilise the psychological phenomenon of home advantage, or else we'll find it difficult to compete for the top 4 next season.

It's hard to use that argument with West Ham as they are constantly getting relegated then promoted irrespective of where they play!

Also, I'm not so sure that playing at Wembley was entirely the problem. We were playing pretty poorly for the first 3rd of the season anyway. If we were to be playing there now, I feel confident we would be a different team.

 

[chico]

Winning matches creates "the psychological phenomenon of home advantage". Why can't we turn it into a fortress? If we play like we did vs Chelsea and City we will that's for sure. Great stadium, big crowds and kudos might actually attract a couple of players in the summer, particularly if we have qualified for the CL again? WE create the atmosphere. The London Stadium is a poorly designed (football wise) football ground and can not be compared to Wembley, which was purpose built.

Imagine if we get to the League or FA Cup final? Home advantage, and unfair one, would be the cry then!

I'm looking forward to it, because I know we will be going into our new state of the art football palace and future fortress, the following season.

 

[widmerpool]

Some stadiums have a particular quality that allows the players playing there to essentially block out the crowd and play as if they're playing a training match. Wembley, like the Olympic Stadium, has that quality. This means that the teams playing their home games in such stadiums effectively have no home advantage. Home advantage is basically a psychologial phenomenon that causes the home players to play at or above their level and the opposition players to play below it. Our two games this season against Chelsea showed this point. Both games were even and the psychological phenomenon of home advantage created by the design of WHL and SB proved the decisive factor. Look at what's happened to West Ham when they play home games without home advantage. We won't suffer as badly as them at Wembley because we have a better team, but we won't be as dominant at home as we have been this season.

In my opinion, our choice of temporary home should be somewhere that we are able to utilise the psychological phenomenon of home advantage, or else we'll find it difficult to compete for the top 4 next season.

I'm sure that what you describe is an important component of home advantage, but it can't be the whole story.

An intuitive feel for the position of the goal, for the behaviour of wind and turf in different parts of the pitch, for what is likely to work and where - all that must, surely, come from playing in the same place every week, and must be part of what contributes to home advantage. And having that instinct for playing at Wembley would be very useful if we made it into any cups over the next few years.