Player Watch - Tanguy Ndombele

[BringBack_leGin]

By asking who you were referring to? A Liverpool fan might have assumed Ian Rush. Have you heard of him?

Even though I specified that he’d scored at a very good rate, which it’s well known Rush didn’t?

Anyway, this has nothing to do with Ndombele anymore though my original response of course had some relevance, so feel free to PM if you care to discuss further ?

 

[Timberwolf]

Pogba is a silky footballer his range of passing is brilliant his more a Sebastian Veron than say Steven Gerrard.
The mistake United keep making is not surrounding him with legs.

Yeah they've kinda screwed themselves by investing like 170 million in 3 players who are best in the exact same position (Pogba, Fernandes, VDB). Pogba really works best in a midfield 3 but that means Fernandes has to play wide and VDB likely remains on the bench. It all reeks of poor squad planning and bad recruitment.

They could probably get away with Fernandes and VDB in the same side as Donny is a lot more industrious than Pogba and a better fit as a no.8, but that means they have to bench their moody 70 million star man in Pogba. That in turn causes unrest in the dressing room and we know how that worked out for Jose.

Ole seems like too much of a yes man and I struggle to see him dropping the big players for the betterment of the team and I think it will be his undoing. I think he'll be out of a job by December as I just can't see him turning it around this time. And tbh even if he does turn it around it would just be delaying the inevitable.

Bringing it back to Tanguy, there are some parallels between the Pogba/Fernandes situation and him and Alli. I think we look much better now that we've settled on more of a 4-3-3 with Alli benched rather than trying to fit them both into the side. I think Utd would be wise to do the same.

 

[sausage]

Arguably the greatest player Britain has ever produced

A Liverpool fan might have assumed Ian Rush.

Now I know they're a delusion bunch, but I think that's even beyond them

 

[punky]

If Tanguy continues to play well, i'm going to get this on the back of my shirt

 

[GLC10]

The player with the highest quality in the premier league, and he's only 23 years old ... Raw diamond.

 

[ohtottenham!]

The player with the highest quality in the premier league, and he's only 23 years old ... Raw diamond.

I agree, but I’d say the potential for the highest quality. It’s off the charts! I was looking at some of the different stuff Tanguy did on Sunday, and not just Sunday, and thought...damn!

That’s why reading @Hercules comments really hit home for me, both because he spoke very, very specifically about the player’s qualities, and he couldn’t have expressed it better in my eyes; and obviously because hercs has inside club info.

We’ve seen what Tanguy can do, but it’s still all potential in my view, and I think his ceiling could be higher than anyone else at our club. I can understand why he has to be especially coached, managed, personally taken care of etc., He’s still in transition in his footballing and personal life with his move. He’s more than worth that effort/trouble!

He’s already approaching levels of Kane-like vision in our attacking phases. He’s not there yet, but he’s 4 years younger and he’s in transition. He has that attacking intent, movement and urgency that influences players around him…it means goals!

 

[slartibartfast]

So what we can take from all of this is, dont go to Milan, yeah?

Hear that Danny?

 

[Now it's Spursonal]

If Tanguy continues to play well, i'm going to get this on the back of my shirt

I like it personally, but don’t be surprised if you wind up on some rival fans twitter page?

 

[t79boy]

Being an elite athlete is completely different to going abroad and doing a 9-5 elsewhere, it's laughable to even compare it.

I find these vague answers interesting ... so what exactly is different please explain . He isn’t learning anything new ... the club bought him not to develop further here (short term) but because he has all the attributes already to improve the first team ... so what exactly is difficult ?

 

[t79boy]

Arguably the greatest player Britain has ever produced, and certainly the greatest striker, couldn’t hack 6 months in Italy, and that’s while he was actually playing and scoring at a very good rate. Don’t underestimate how difficult it is to adapt to other cultures as a young man.

Is that your reply ? Picking out one person who went abroad and couldn’t hack it ? Surely it boils down to mental strength and so forth .... so in similar vein if I mention that Sancho didn’t seem to have any problems settling into Germany and performing almost immediately (and being younger) ... does that nullify your comment ?

 

[wrd]

I find these vague answers interesting ... so what exactly is different please explain . He isn’t learning anything new ... the club bought him not to develop further here (short term) but because he has all the attributes already to improve the first team ... so what exactly is difficult ?

Okay first of all you're being disingenuous because he was brought in develop and that was made clear by Poch at the time because before the season started he said this:

Pochettino calls for record signing Ndombele to be given time to adjust to Spurs regime

Mauricio Pochettino has conceded that Spurs new boy Tanguy Ndombele has so far found his system “difficult”, but has called for patience.

www.squawka.com

Then he said this

Pochettino warns Ndombele could need two seasons to fully adapt

Mauricio Pochettino has warned Tottenham fans they could have to wait two years to see record signing Tanguay Ndombele at his best in England.

www.standard.co.uk

So you're literally making up your argument to suit your position and it's simply not true. The club has reaffirmed this since Poch left and explained he was given a 6 year deal because they knew it was a long term investment and no matter how you feel about the money spent that is the case.

The rest really shouldn't need explaining to you, playing in the premier league is vastly different to france, the physical demands are much higher, you need to be fitter in terms of stamina, speed, strength. No desk job in the world that you would need to transition to would have the amount of variable change of adapting from ligue 1 to the premier league. There's physical demands on an athlete adapting to a different way of playing which simply can't be compared to you or me switching jobs.

Now a large part of the difficulty for him was that we changed managers at a time when he was injured and he wasn't starting. You can literally see in the documentary how much harder not starting made things difficult for him, perhaps he could have culturally adjusted if he was starting week in and week out on the football pitch but he wasn't. Under Poch he was starting fairly regularly but suffered injuries which is part and parcel of adjusting to the new physical demands of the league.

 

[t79boy]

Okay first of all you're being disingenuous because he was brought in develop and that was made clear by Poch at the time because before the season started he said this:

Pochettino calls for record signing Ndombele to be given time to adjust to Spurs regime

Mauricio Pochettino has conceded that Spurs new boy Tanguy Ndombele has so far found his system “difficult”, but has called for patience.

www.squawka.com

Then he said this

Pochettino warns Ndombele could need two seasons to fully adapt

Mauricio Pochettino has warned Tottenham fans they could have to wait two years to see record signing Tanguay Ndombele at his best in England.

www.standard.co.uk

So you're literally making up your argument to suit your position and it's simply not true. The club has reaffirmed this since Poch left and explained he was given a 6 year deal because they knew it was a long term investment and no matter how you feel about the money spent that is the case.

The rest really shouldn't need explaining to you, playing in the premier league is vastly different to france, the physical demands are much higher, you need to be fitter in terms of stamina, speed, strength. No desk job in the world that you would need to transition to would have the amount of variable change of adapting from ligue 1 to the premier league. There's physical demands on an athlete adapting to a different way of playing which simply can't be compared to you or me switching jobs.

Now a large part of the difficulty for him was that we changed managers at a time when he was injured and he wasn't starting. You can literally see in the documentary how much harder not starting made things difficult for him, perhaps he could have culturally adjusted if he was starting week in and week out on the football pitch but he wasn't. Under Poch he was starting fairly regularly but suffered injuries which is part and parcel of adjusting to the new physical demands of the league.

first of all I appreciate this reply a lot more as it has more substance ?
To me Poch saying what he did was a case of sheltering him from the “record transfer” pressure he would have faced and also give him time to settle (I know what you are thinking) , BUT there is NO escaping the fact that the Ndombele I saw play for Lyon was completely ready to make our first eleven stronger immediately . Granted there is a difference in physicality between the French league and the premiership but as an elite athlete who is paid to do this as his full time job , there should be no excuse to get this up to scratch ASAP.
yes I saw the documentary and he found it hard not starting ... that actually should tell you that he didn’t put in the hard graft he should have in training to get selected ! Who wants to leave their record signing on the sidelines for other reasons ?
For every Ndombele there is there is also example of players hitting the ground running ... our new LB is one such example

 

[BringBack_leGin]

Is that your reply ? Picking out one person who went abroad and couldn’t hack it ? Surely it boils down to mental strength and so forth .... so in similar vein if I mention that Sancho didn’t seem to have any problems settling into Germany and performing almost immediately (and being younger) ... does that nullify your comment ?

No, because what I said, totally non confrontational I might add, merely displays that it’s possible for a young man with the pressure of a huge transfer and with it, huge expectation. to find a new culture intimidating and difficult to acclimatise to, whereas the Sancho situation, apart from the fact that he went for a modest sum and didn’t start a match until halfway through his first season, and even then only properly broke through the following season, merely displays that some people do adapt well. The Greaves situation isn’t a rule of thumb, neither is Sancho, both are possible.

But you knew my initial post wasn’t a generalisation about all players moving abroad.

 

[wrd]

first of all I appreciate this reply a lot more as it has more substance ?
To me Poch saying what he did was a case of sheltering him from the “record transfer” pressure he would have faced and also give him time to settle (I know what you are thinking) , BUT there is NO escaping the fact that the Ndombele I saw play for Lyon was completely ready to make our first eleven stronger immediately . Granted there is a difference in physicality between the French league and the premiership but as an elite athlete who is paid to do this as his full time job , there should be no excuse to get this up to scratch ASAP.
yes I saw the documentary and he found it hard not starting ... that actually should tell you that he didn’t put in the hard graft he should have in training to get selected ! Who wants to leave their record signing on the sidelines for other reasons ?
For every Ndombele there is there is also example of players hitting the ground running ... our new LB is one such example

I think the reality is, you're going to get some people who struggle mentally with the switch than others, regardless of how good their playing ability is the mental aspect is ultimately what takes control.

I imagine the club could probably see that Tanguy has some mental fragility but his talent is so big they were willing to take a risk they normally would not. They probably knew it'd take time to build him up.

Then you look at reguilon the guy oozes confidence. His welcome singing vidso showed that much, he seems to be mentally strong and nothing fazes him. Made a mistake vs Chelsea and came back swinging.

You look at Sonny, he took a season to adapt wanted to go back to Germant and Poch would not let him now he's dancing at old trafford after banging his 2nd. It is very player dependant and I hate that a fee is this huge weight around a player because he didn't pick his transfer fee, he didn't force spurs to take that risk and the fee and wages are irrelevant if you're lacking confidence. There's other players like it, look at Keita at Liverpool, similar fee and has taken him 2 seasons and he's just now getting starts.

The biggest example for me in terms of ths way the mental aspect affects a player is Fernando Torres. Even taking account of injuries he just suddenly got in his own way and turned into a shell of his former self. Tanguy seemingly has the life drained from him when he wasn't getting starts, I think we saw in the documentary the language barrier was not helping whatsoever and that's where the new culture starts to add issues to the situation. If he's starting week in and week out then like Ancelotti said the adaption takes care of itself.

 

[ohtottenham!]

No, because what I said, totally non confrontational I might add, merely displays that it’s possible for a young man with the pressure of a huge transfer and with it, huge expectation. to find a new culture intimidating and difficult to acclimatise to, whereas the Sancho situation, apart from the fact that he went for a modest sum and didn’t start a match until halfway through his first season, and even then only properly broke through the following season, merely displays that some people do adapt well. The Greaves situation isn’t a rule of thumb, neither is Sancho, both are possible.

But you knew my initial post wasn’t a generalisation about all players moving abroad.

I'd let it go mate, and I agree with you. Ndombele's a great talent with crazy potential. Let's see how it goes.

 

[kent brockman]

Having a CM who can beat the press like he does really is invaluable.

Still a lot of fitness work to be done though. But it looks as if it is going in the right direction.

 

[fecka]

first of all I appreciate this reply a lot more as it has more substance ?
To me Poch saying what he did was a case of sheltering him from the “record transfer” pressure he would have faced and also give him time to settle (I know what you are thinking) , BUT there is NO escaping the fact that the Ndombele I saw play for Lyon was completely ready to make our first eleven stronger immediately . Granted there is a difference in physicality between the French league and the premiership but as an elite athlete who is paid to do this as his full time job , there should be no excuse to get this up to scratch ASAP.
yes I saw the documentary and he found it hard not starting ... that actually should tell you that he didn’t put in the hard graft he should have in training to get selected ! Who wants to leave their record signing on the sidelines for other reasons ?
For every Ndombele there is there is also example of players hitting the ground running ... our new LB is one such example

I take it you've never lived abroad? It's not about just being mentally strong as we all adapt and handle things differently. To be at your physical best you have to be at your mental best and being thrown into a completely different culture with no friends or family can be incredibly tough on your mind and it can take a very long time to settle. It can be things like not knowing what to eat or buy, how to go about social situations, missing your family and not to forget the language barrier.

From my personal experience it depends more on your personality than your mental strength. Going by reports, Reguilon for example seems like a very extraverted, outgoing person who seemingly is very good at creating connections with people and he also already has pretty good english. Ndombele on the other hand didn't speak english when he joined the club and is a lot more intraverted and keeps a lot more to himself.
Depending on the mentality of the group a player is about to join, the former could for example mean that you'd have an easier time to integrate.

There are no rules to who will adapt better than the other but saying that they are snowflakes for not doing it within a month is incredibly narrowminded and simply not true and take it from someone who's lived and worked abroad in several countries, I have yet to work for a single employer that expected me to deliver at my best before 6 months in a new country, even at a 9-5 job.

 

[GLC10]

I need October 18 to arrive to see Tanguy distilling quality !!

 

[Ledley's Right Foot]

If he did it was on social media. Every time I watch him I don’t see the fuss.

Except, of course, when he helped France win the world cup...he was majestic...that was peak pogba...not seen much of that guy since.

 

[Gilzeanking]

I do hope this hasn't been posted already .This is NDombele's September , superb stuff .