Ratings vs Olympique Lyonnais

[HotspurFC1950]

Bus conductor
How can you say that Vertonghen/Gallas is our best defensive combo when Kaboul hasn't played yet.

I think you have answered your own question Omar.

 

[ibbz]

Team played well apart from BAE and KW - pony!

And I prefer Bale on the left with Dempsey rather than Ade up front right now

 

[ibbz]

I think Sandro missing has been our biggest shortcoming so far, parker can't fill Sandro's boots

 

[HotspurFC1950]

Plan explain.

Why are the comments on here after each game put us as playing poorly and yet we keep making progress ?

 

[AW?]

Two great games on the bounce for Gallas.

 

[chinaman]

Just as in the 1st leg, Gallas was head and shoulder above everyone.

 

[Huddlestone22]

Friedel - 6 - Solid enough although we really miss Lloris' sweeper style of keeping when he isn't playing. Made a good save in the second half.
BAE - 3 - Defensively sloppy and was very wasteful attacking. Hopefully this is one of his off games only.
Vertonghen - 6 - Didn't do too much wrong, great challenge in the second half
Gallas - 7 - One of his best games this season, didn't put a foot wrong. My only criticism is the direction of his headers, too many went straight to opponents in dangerous areas.
Walker - 6 - Wasn't bad but wasn't great either, offered a decent attacking threat in the second half.
Bale - 6 - Couple of good shots but not his best game, at least the effort was there.
Dembele - 5 - Seems to have been a bit average recently, coincides with Sandro's injury. Lovely goal though.
Parker - 4 - Didn't offer us anything apart from an obsession of spinning around with a football, even lacked his usually good break up play.
Holtby - 6.5 - Good first half, looks like the player we need with his direct passing approach on occasions. Looked tired in the second but understandable.
Lennon - 4 - What's with his really bad dip in form recently? offered no threat at all. Wasn't even working too hard.
Ade - 5 - Anonymous first half but helped contribute to the better attacks of the second half. Still isn't the same Ade as we had last season .

 

[fortworthspur]

some harsh, harsh ratings. We were better than them on their pitch. they were lucky to score on a questionable foul.

Friedel - 6.5 caught in no mans land in the 2nd half, Lyon striker should've got a yellow for the dive.

Walker - 6.5 his defending wasnt too bad, but Im not sure what he does well anymore.

Gallas -7.5 cool as cucumber

Verts - 7 no mistakes

BAE - 7 plenty of mistakes but bless him for coming forward on the left after Bale moved to the middle

Parker - 7.5 flawless and unspectacular at the same time

Dembele -7 pretty lackluster for 89 minutes but what a goal

Lennon - 6 shut down by Lyon

Bale - 7.5 better than average just by showing up. he's that good.

Holtby - 7.5 thought he worked his socks off. Intelligent play

Ade - 7 best shift this season to my eye

Dempsey - 7 did what he was supposed to do - try to score

Siggy/Livermore - NET

 

[ItsBoris]

I think the ratings from the whoscored.com website are interesting to look at, more often that not I agree with most of the ratings but this match the ratings are a bit different from what I would have given, but then they are based only on stats and not any sort of subjective observation. Just for reference 6 is basically what you get if you go on the pitch and do nothing at all either good or bad. Blatant errors you lose points, any decent bits of play you gain points. So 6 is a poor score, 7 is a fairly good score.

Anyway:
Friedel: 6.6
Walker: 6.6
Gallas: 6.5
Vertonghen: 7.3
BAE: 6.9

Parker: 6.4
Dembele: 8.0
Bale: 7.5
Lennon: 5.9
Holtby: 7.2

Adebayor: 6.8

So according to them, Dembele Motm, then Bale, Vertonghen and Holtby were the only other above 7.

Lennon and Parker the bottom 2.

 

[coldasice199]

We have no game changing subs at all. The only good thing Dempsey did was hold the ball in the corner at the end. Sig looks bereft of confidence and I'm not sure the other players trust him.

Benny's crossing was apauling. Before Dembele's shot and a few from Dempsey (he shouldn't have bothered), Bale was the only one looking to hit it.

I worry about our lack of firepower. We need to get that finishing instinct back quickly and a brace from Ade would be ideal. Why he's a target man hugging the left touchline was bizarre to me.

 

[onthetwo]

Hands up who saw that coming (apart from the evangelical optimist SP that is) ?

Lyon were a really tough nut. Like us they lack a bit of creative quality having lost some decent players over the last couple of years but they were extremely well drilled, pressed like bastards and put up two banks of four behind Gomis and squeezed the life out of us.



The thing we really needed most, was the thing we lack the most. Invention, creative spark, craft, guile etc etc. And when rare great chances were created by Adebayor for Bale and Dempsey they were wasted.

There's a lot to like about how we go about things these days. We are better organised, more diligent defensively, work harder and much more coherently. Second half we completely dominated, with lots of huff and puff. But truth be told, we were wasteful with the ball, and not just because they pressed well or denied us space.

Parker and Ekotto were the worst offenders, continually wasting possession with stupid decisions when other choices were available. You will never fault Parker's work rate or effort for the cause, but he gave the ball away needlessly tonight numerous times and failed to see good passes when they were on.

To be honest, I don't think Dembele gave the game enough until that wonderful last moment of the game. Some of us said earlier in the season that we were not sure we would truly see the best of Dembele in a cm2. That is not to say he's bad or a liability, I just think to best utilise his skill set he needs to be in a 433 or played in a more forward role of a 4231/433. I think playing with the more simplistic Sandro possibly suits him better than the whirling dervish that is Parker, but I still think Dembele's contribution's lately have been a bit under whelming. With Sandro injured though, I guess he'll be playing in the cm2 for the foreseeable future. Not terrible news, just not sure he's giving the team all he can from there.

Lennon was the most disappointing player on the pitch as he invariably can be when the going gets tough. He gave the game virtually nothing offensively.

Walker's puppy dog stupidity was in early evidence. The free kick he needlessly gave (the second he'd given away stupidly) away for the goal came about because he initially misjudged a headed challenge. He played better defensively as the game wore on but offers very little craft or attacking threat. On days like this you really need to FB to offer a threat, running from deep to beat the lines of defence. Ekotto was far more pro-active and found himself in several great positions, he just wasted most of them.

I need to see it again but Bale didn't cover himself in glory defending the goal either.

Dempsey is the worst footballer I've seen in a Spurs shirt since before Arnesen arrived with his shit broom. It is making me incredibly angry that we are sending kids like Kane and Mason on loan and giving this **** a game. Not because I know they will prove to be world beaters, but I'd rather watch some kid we've deemed talented enough to spend time teaching for years fail, than watch some talentless prick we've wasted money on fail.

I like the Gallas/Vertonghen pairing. It's our best IMO.

We need a couple of players who can see a run and play the pass instantly. We have too many ditherers. Particularly Parker and Dembele (Sandro's no better). Holtby offers hope. But one in the cm area and one more up top would be good.

We got what our effort deserved.

Player ratings:

Friedel - I thought he was poor tonight.

Walker - Early Walkerisms over (like giving the ball away, two daft free kicks, turning his back on a ball into the box etc) he played quite well defensively, but we were having most of the ball by then. Needs to contribute more offensively to justify being a hap hazard defender.

Gallas - Good game.

Vertonghen - Good game

Ekotto - sees lots of ball, is good technically, but makes poor decisions when going forward. Defensively could show more urgency at times.

Parker - Works his absolute nuts off. Poor distribution continually. Some times needs to just play it simple and quickly.

Dembele - Redeemed a ho hum performance with a wonderful shift and shoot.

Lennon - insipid.

Holtby - tried hard, played a couple of good balls, worked hard and kept moving and taking the ball. Found the double layer hard to penetrate in the second half.

Bale - Tried to make something happen. It didn't.

Adebayor - worked hard all night off slim pickings. Couple of times when he was a bit wasteful with hard fought possession, but did create our only two decent chances, one a beautiful piece of play for Bale.

I thought it was the kind of game that showed how much we miss Modric.... Come back rat face!

 

[KeaneIsKeane]

Team needs to play the ball long to Adebayor more when teams sit back on us and decide to soak up the pressure. Adebayor was giving their back line trouble in the air and almost put Holtby through, but it was called back by an unjust foul on Adebayor. Put pressure on their defense this way. Launch balls into the box to Adebayor and get people around him to cause chaos. Punish them for letting us have possession in their half by putting their defenders under actual stress.

We make it way too comfortable for defenses that want to just sit back and do nothing. We are a more physical side than a lot of top sides. Use it. Look at Dembele compared to other team's midfielders. Bale is HUGE for a winger. Benny is pretty good with those diagonal balls...use them. Hell even Dempsey is good in this type of strategy. Instead we just let defenses easily track our midfields simple passes as they move side to side and we just hope something opens up down the sidelines or someone, Bale/Dembele, comes up with a moment of brilliance and beats a man or two. It is good that we have players that can do that, but we need to be more versatile.

AVB's pressing, which I love in games against other top sides, also isn't as beneficial in games like these because Lyon is sitting far enough back that you're pressing way too much of the field to be anything close to energy efficient.

Scott Parker, I love you and you worked well when the guy you were passing to could pick out an on the tip of a needle, orgasm inducing, 50 meter cross pitch pass, Modric/Van der Vaart, but in a team that wants to play physical high octane football you just don't fit. We're like a beautiful manual transmission car that is slowly moving up in gear as the ball moves down the pitch and then the ball arrives at the feet of one Scott Parker and the car just completely stalls out. I might be a little unfair here because Dembele was guilty of this too in this game, but at least he'll dribble the ball forward and has some sort of shot on him. He also wins the ball extremely well.

Sandro will never be mistaken as a play maker, but he uses his strength and athleticism, as well as an underrated touch, to push the ball forward and he has a decent shot. Not to mention he is an overall awesome man beast of a man who will karate kick you into next week.

What a fun match though. On a knives edge shit. MOUSSAAAAAAAAAA!

 

[Gilzeanking]

On the upside , there were the first signs of Ade 6.5 coming back to form . Pass to Bale was great . The desperation factor as we were 15 mins from defeat seemed to lift some players out of their comfort zones . I thought Dembele 7 lifted his game for 10 mins before his goal.
Lennon 4 was fab vs Utd...and maybe feels he can now rest up . This is his second substitution in 2 games when we were chasing the game so AvB sees this. Shame there is no competition for his place...he needs it .
I reckon Parker 6 is getting more stick than deserved . Maybe he slows things a bit ,but he works like a trojan and saw lots of the ball . The maligned pirhouettes can be effective sometimes imo as the oppo expects an attack one side of the pitch as he goes that way , may leave more space the other side which Parker will find after pirhouetting back .

Defence looked solid , the offside trap often stopped Lyon full marks for that kind of organisation...well..7 anyway .

As is generally understood here , its creatively where we have most probs . I saw a neutral piece in a broadsheet saying that Spurs not strengthening the attack in Jan was 'reckless' . Given how much is riding on CL this year and the tough run in we have , I tend to agree .

 

[Wardy]

Negative: Kyle Walker - Looks a total shadow of himself from 12 months ago! anyone understand why this is?

Positive - Adebayor - As above, he looks to be coming back to form


re: the criticism about BAE - he's had a horrific injury all season and in my opinion he's still getting back to match fitness. Discooooo benny!!

 

[SoulDog]

How about that!

How a win changes your opinion on things even though we were playing well and passing the ball around really nice it was one hell of a frustrating game.

Lyon are a good hardworking side who defend and press well, good on the ball and hold it up really well. It was always going to be hard. Both teams started well I thought, they were pressing us well but then we came into the game I thought. We were passing the ball around nice, untill Walker gives away a silly but soft foul away IMO which they score from and they are right back in the game, now they just need to hold on to the lead and to be honest they done very well to do that, they put all there men behind the ball and worked so hard and we just could not break them down.

We just lacked anything going forward, Lennon just gave it away and did nothing with the ball, Parker just kept giving the ball away with stupid passes, I think he was trying to do something special but he is just not that kind of player, he needs to keep it simple and stick to breaking up the play and Dembele was doing nothing and again making silly balls.

I could just not see us scoring even though we were and overall the better footballing side.

2nd half was better and we looked like we really wanted it but to be fair we had nothing to lose we had to go for it. Again we played some really nice stuff but just could not do anything creative with the ball, he pushed Ekotto forward who was playing like LM but everytime he got into some good positions he just gave it away cheaply or did not cross in the ball when he had the chance and kept doing silly things like doing too much with the ball or his touch not being good, god he was so frustrating!

We are going out I thought after all the nice football we have played, after the 2 wonder free kicks Bale scored in the first leg, after all the hard work we have put into it we are going out because we lack some one up front who can score and lack someone who can making something happen in that CAM and then out of nowhere DEMBELE JUST comes out with this amazing shot and i see the ball hit the back of the net and then my living room just go mad. Oh yes it was a good feeling!

And yes we deserved it overall we were the better side over two legs who played the best football.

Great win and now I am really looking forward to Inter who I think we can do IMO.

Frideal-6 not much to do, one decent save that was straight at him but wish Lloris was in goal.

Walker-5 poor, gave away silly fouls repeatedly even though he knew the ref was going to give anything from the lightest of touches on their players.

Gallas-7 good game, always like it when he starts, good defender.

vertoghen-7 again good good game made a couple of really good strong challenges

Ekotto-5 frustrating a bit like walker, gave it away so many times, that 2nd half we got into some good position but just wasted his chances and looked like he didnt care that much.

Lennon-4 poor, didnt offer anything at all, gave it away, didnt go on any runs, very poor game

parker-5.5 worked hard, but just gave it away so many times, need to stick at what he does best, frustrates me when hes on the ball to be honest. runs into trouble and does to much with it when he should just keep it nice and simple. Did play one good ball to ADE who made a great ball to bale who should of took a touch and scored.

dembele-7 only gave him 7 for the goal at the end, we was all moaning at him to take him of at one point as he was not offering anything, great goal tho and saved us,

holty-6.5 done some good things, made some really smart balls and was unlucky not to score, tell he is a good footballer and got a great pass on him,

BALE-6.5 made a great run i think it was in the first half not quite sure, He done a few good things, good freekick, couple of good shots, some good runs but he always had three men on him, done ok but should of scored with that chance when he just volleyed it and it just missed, maybe should of took a touch


ADE-5 DID nothing tbh, did not even hold it up well, was bit disappointed with him as I know he can do much better, Think he made one good ball to Bale thats it.

 

[SteveH]

Lyon away is a tough gig for any team.

COYS

 

[mpickard2087]

Team needs to play the ball long to Adebayor more when teams sit back on us and decide to soak up the pressure. Adebayor was giving their back line trouble in the air and almost put Holtby through, but it was called back by an unjust foul on Adebayor. Put pressure on their defense this way. Launch balls into the box to Adebayor and get people around him to cause chaos. Punish them for letting us have possession in their half by putting their defenders under actual stress.

We make it way too comfortable for defenses that want to just sit back and do nothing. We are a more physical side than a lot of top sides. Use it. Look at Dembele compared to other team's midfielders. Bale is HUGE for a winger. Benny is pretty good with those diagonal balls...use them. Hell even Dempsey is good in this type of strategy. Instead we just let defenses easily track our midfields simple passes as they move side to side and we just hope something opens up down the sidelines or someone, Bale/Dembele, comes up with a moment of brilliance and beats a man or two. It is good that we have players that can do that, but we need to be more versatile.

Yes I agree, we didn't adapt to their tactics at all or even look like he had a plan B when it came to breaking them down. I would have kept both wingers on. Told them to stay as wide as possible and put Caulker (and then maybe towards the end, Dawson as well in all truth) on up top as he is the best header of a ball we have and just chuck the ball into the box towards him. If teams are going to sit on the edge of their box, then get as many bodies up there around them and cause some havoc. These continental goalies more often than not are shoddy when it comes to dealing with the aerial bombardment, test them out a bit at times.

It can't always be the pretty stuff, you have to adapt sometimes.

 

[Damian99]

I need to see it again but Bale didn't cover himself in glory defending the goal either.

Trust me you don't, it was fucking shocking at best.

 

[Kalim]

To be honest mate I still think he was below par second half. Got his head up more and played a nice ball into Ade's path but I have to say I'm really worried by how ponderous we look at the moment, he seems to really slow us down in possession and when teams are sitting deep it just compounds the problem ten fold. Love his effort levels off the ball, always have but my God I'm worried about how slowly we move the ball - its so easy to defend against.

Of course Dembele needs to move it quicker and drive forward more but there doesn't seem to be a good fluency between the two of them in terms of getting the team moving foward quickly and progressively, and understanding who has more licence to seize the initiative and really dictate play - which should be Dembele.

I would give Gallas MOM.

This puts into words exactly what I have been thinking.

 

[robbiedee]

I had to listen to the match on the radio...bloody talksport!!!

I got back for the last 5 minutes so based on that...

Dembele 10 - I only saw his goal as I walked in fearing our Europa League exit. Full marks to Mousa.

Talksport 3 - just as a free kick or a corner is about to be taken, they go over to the Newcastle game - twats

Alvin Martin 2 - seemed very negative and I didn't like the cut of his jib

Jason Cundy 0 (wasn't even commentator for Spurs game. was doing the Chelscum game after but came on at half time previewing that game and talking absolute horse shit) Proper done my head in.

M25 - 50mph speed limit for 10 miles between South mimms and Potters Bar - 0