Soldado and Lamela, the elephant in the room.

[prawnsandwich]

It's pretty annoying when people are replying to something you didn't write.

I'm a fan, I support every player that puts on the shirt, but it's so damn annoying that we can't talk about the players without someone posting bs personal attacks.

Why the fuck would I be glad if Lamela fails for us, when we actually need him to become good?

Fantastic post.

 

[prawnsandwich]

Not that you care though, as shown by your previous posts.

Why? What is the point of that remark?

 

[Matrix]

Wait until the end of next season? Why would we do that? Are we a charity that gives a home to under performing footballers? If he doesn't show a heck of a lot of improvement by the end of the season and start affecting football matches, it would be time to cut our losses and bring someone in who can do better.

Who exactly?

 

[THFCSPURS19]

Why? What is the point of that remark?

To piss you off. Bye.

 

[Buckoxx]

At least Lamela isn't looking bad no more, just an average winger. We all know he's got talent. It's just taking time to come through.

 

[Matrix]

Wait until the end of next season? Why would we do that? Are we a charity that gives a home to under performing footballers? If he doesn't show a heck of a lot of improvement by the end of the season and start affecting football matches, it would be time to cut our losses and bring someone in who can do better.

By that theory the following would kick out on their ear after their 1st full season.
Modric
Bale
Chadli
Sandro
BAE

 

[eViL]

I think it's the case that Pochettino was quite happy to expose both Lamela and Soldado to the full force of Premiership football until they came good.

The emergence of Kane, which I'm pretty certain none of the coaching team saw coming as soon as it did, has put paid to Soldado's acclimatisation.

With the rest of the team clicking as they are and Coco's undoubted desire and workrate - Poch can afford to carry Lamela to a point, and eventually, the talent will flourish onto another level.

The other option is to play Townsend, who will deliver less defensively, and about the same on attack.

Fergie did it with Ronaldo, albeit at a younger age - didn't turn out so bad for them.

 

[mrlilywhite]

Wait until the end of next season? Why would we do that? Are we a charity that gives a home to under performing footballers? If he doesn't show a heck of a lot of improvement by the end of the season and start affecting football matches, it would be time to cut our losses and bring someone in who can do better.

Out of curiosity, can you give me your opinion on why Lamela ( I assume you mean him?) is under performing? I guess a player who has had 3 managers in just over a year, had to adjust to the worlds hardest league, been out for almost most of his 1st season and had to adapt to a totally new culture and language might be expected to under perform? Though I guess all of that don't matter right cause he is a footballer, and thus should not be considered prone to any of that!?

 

[THOWIG]

I think a part of the problem is people expect him to go down the wing taking players on, like Townsend, Chadli or even Walker. To me he is not that player, more likely to link up with short sharp passing. And playing so narrow isn't going to see him get too much joy.

I hope he can turn around the attacking side of his performances the way he has the defensive side.

Yes it's an interesting one. I had only seem him a couple of times at Roma. I had imagined a Ronaldo type player, but he's very different. I still feel there is a lot more to come and I imagine that Pochettino has asked him to keep it simple and then the spectacular will come. He's building, developing and I'm certain we have a gem on our hands.

 

[Blake Griffin]

By that theory the following would kick out on their ear after their 1st full season.
Modric
Bale
Chadli
Sandro
Walker
BAE

i think the only one there you could apply that logic to is chadli. bale's history seems to have been re-written somewhere along the line, he actually looked pretty fantastic to begin with but was stopped short by a bad injury. modric struggled initially but by the end of his first season he was already one of the more important players. sandro barely got a chance until milan away which he took with both hands, he was superb thereafter and walker won young player of the year in his first season? benny was crocked for two years and did a solid job in his first season from memory and then improved year by year.

i don't want to say much more about lamela that i haven't already. i rewatched yesterday's game and he really does work hard off the ball but at some point he's going to have to really step it up going forward, otherwise he's going to become a very expensive park ji-sung.

 

[Matrix]

i think the only one there you could apply that logic to is chadli. bale's history seems to have been re-written somewhere along the line, he actually looked pretty fantastic to begin with but was stopped short by a bad injury. modric struggled initially but by the end of his first season he was already one of the more important players. sandro barely got a chance until milan away which he took with both hands, he was superb thereafter and walker won young player of the year in his first season? benny was crocked for two years and did a solid job in his first season from memory and then improved year by year.

i don't want to say much more about lamela that i haven't already. i rewatched yesterday's game and he really does work hard off the ball but at some point he's going to have to really step it up going forward, otherwise he's going to become a very expensive park ji-sung.

Yup I stand corrected on Walker. Ill edit that out!

 

[eViL]

I will also say.. Lamela is a bit too nice and shy right now - he needs to adopt the same mean streak that seems to have started rushing through the team lately.

A bit of Danny Rose's hate for the opposition wouldn't go amiss. (loved him kicking the ball at Wellbeck on the half time whistle yesterday)

 

[UpTownSpur]

The issue with Lamela in my opinion is that I think he has too many technical and physical deficiencies to ever be a success here.

He lacks body strength and genuine pace. Both of these are pretty essential for a wide player in the Premier League. He is all too easily barged off the ball and can't ever out pace a defender.

He's the most technically deficient attacking player at the club. He can't use his weaker right foot effectively for anything, not shooting or crossing - so it's hardly surprising he delivers very few crosses when playing on the right. This makes him predictable as he always wants to cut inside and it also puts enormous pressure on Walker to be the main attacking outlet on the right.

He's also extremely limited in the way he strikes a football when shooting. He basically does the same shot every time. A curler with the inside of his left foot to the far corner - if anyone can show me any evidence of him striking a football well (except volleys) in another way then please oblige. Again, it makes him predictable. If he isn't in the right position to take that shot, then he simply doesn't shoot.

He's 23 in a few weeks, the same age as Eriksen and nearly two years older than Kane, and he's not a developing player any more, he's the player he is and you don't get giant leap forwards by that age. There are simply better players with proven Premier League quality that we could buy for the money we'll be able to sell him for.

 

[THFCSPURS19]

He's 23 in a few weeks, the same age as Eriksen and nearly two years older than Kane, and he's not a developing player any more, he's the player he is and you don't get giant leap forwards by that age. There are simply better players with proven Premier League quality that we could buy for the money we'll be able to sell him for.

Can't be bothered with the rest of your post but do you remember that chap Gareth Bale? He was 23 in his last season. To say that he can't develop when he's only 23 is a clear example of the short-termism that ruins this club at times.

 

[nferno]

Soldado can't keep pace with Defoe in the EPL now - and Defoe's only played 3 games and is already outscoring him

I wonder how Defoe would have done in the Valencia team during the time Soldado was there with so many La Liga flat tracks to be a bully on, looking at the defending and space affording to Soldado in his youtube highlight clips Defoe probably would have been a superstar there

The thing is, though, that Soldado's finishing was exceptional in La Liga. Over here his linkup play/passing/spacial awareness is good, he's just so devoid of confidence that his finishing is now woeful.

There's no way I can dispute how good Defoe is in putting the ball in the back of the net, but he offers very little else. Even then, he averaged about the same GPG output in the MLS as Soldado in La Liga, and the standard of opposition there is worse than La Liga relegation fodder. Definitely not a fit for the system we employ now. I still believe Soldado is definitely the better player when both are at their best, he's just caught the curse of Torres and I don't see him regaining any confidence with us. Needs new surroundings.

 

[Rout-Ledge]

i think the only one there you could apply that logic to is chadli. bale's history seems to have been re-written somewhere along the line, he actually looked pretty fantastic to begin with but was stopped short by a bad injury. modric struggled initially but by the end of his first season he was already one of the more important players. sandro barely got a chance until milan away which he took with both hands, he was superb thereafter and walker won young player of the year in his first season? benny was crocked for two years and did a solid job in his first season from memory and then improved year by year.

Absolutely. These myths about Bale and Modric really do grate. Anyone who was paying attention could see that those two had a lot of quality from the off.

I think Lamela does too, but for whatever reason it's come out much more infrequently than you'd hope.

 

[Rout-Ledge]

Can't be bothered with the rest of your post but do you remember that chap Gareth Bale? He was 23 in his last season. To say that he can't develop when he's only 23 is a clear example of the short-termism that ruins this club at times.

Weird example. Bale hasn't pushed on in big leaps since he was 23.

 

[Timberwolf]

He's 23 in a few weeks, the same age as Eriksen and nearly two years older than Kane, and he's not a developing player any more, he's the player he is and you don't get giant leap forwards by that age. There are simply better players with proven Premier League quality that we could buy for the money we'll be able to sell him for.

I don't believe there's a magic age where all players simultaneously stop developing. Perhaps physically, but certainly not mentally. There are countless examples of players who become stars or develop in unexpected ways later in their careers (Ricky Lambert, Didier Drogba, Diego Costa, Diego Milito, Ian Wright, Luca Toni, just to name a new off the top of my head). This can happen for any number of reasons: a new manager, a different training regime, a personal epiphany, a greater understanding of the game/league, etc.

To simply say "he's 23 soon so he's done developing, get him out" is both reductive and, well, wrong. There's obviously a point where we may have to give up on him if he's not improving as much as we'd like, but that rigid, blanket approach to player development wont do us any favours.

 

[THFCSPURS19]

Weird example. Bale hasn't pushed on in big leaps since he was 23.

He turned 23 in July 2012, we know what happened next.

 

[Shadydan]

Iniesta didn't start to get games for Barca until he was 23, same with Xavi.