Spurs U21’s, U18’s and other youth news – 2015/16 Edition

[Spursidol]

E u15's tournament starts on Sunday in Italy.

Site claiming to stream the event http://livestream.com/accounts/99928/events/5181883

 

[Bus-Conductor]

For anybody who missed the u21 match its up on Youtube.

Just finished watching the game. That was probably the best U21 performance I watched all season. Beaten by three pot shots after utterly outplaying them. The result was an utter travesty (hilarious manc commentary "you'd probably say on the balance of play Spurs just about deserve to be level") but I couldn't really give a shit about the result, it was just nice to see a coherent, cohesive performance and we learnt a lot more about our players, whereas all they learnt was that if you whack the ball from 20 yards against a rooky keeper you have a chance.

There was a nice balance to that CM pairing of Stylianides and Winks, and we also looked better balanced with KWP and Muscat as FB's - neither contributed loads offensively as ManU pretty much just parked a bus and camped in the third, making getting in behind them very difficult - but with a proper RB and LB our team just looked more comfortable and cohesive.

Same problem we've had all season though is creating and scoring goals. I really think if Edwards had played the whole game we'd have been so much more threatening, as soon as he came on the dynamics of the game changed, all of a sudden we were getting behind them and people like Winks and Onomah had someone to "play" with in the final third.

Sonupe clearly has decent feet but doesn't really blow me away, his end product is a bit lacking. Sterling is a lively little fucker, who works hard and is tenacious but again just seems to lack that bit of craft.

I thought Walkes and Lesniak actually had decent games, both reading things well, intercepting and coming out with the ball. It's a shame about Walkes, he does have ability, I just get the impression that mentally he lacks that 100% focus that you need. I really like Lesniak, he never gives less than 100%, he's got a good quick brain, very industrious, tenacious, technically very tidy and I think will make a very decent, little busy **** for someone somewhere, just don't think it will be us. I'd have no problem at all keeping him around and giving him cup game time next year, the world needs Kante's and he's a bit like a young Polish Kante in many ways. I doubt Poch sees it that way though.

 

[Spursidol]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490#article-3552530

Chelsea director Michael Emenalo slams Tottenham's youth policy and says Harry Kane is the only key player they have produced and the rest is all 'hoopla'

Chelsea technical director Michael Emenalo is proud of the standards at his academy and is clearly annoyed by all the praise heaped on Tottenham's youth policy this season.

Emenalo doesn't understand why Spurs seem to get a lot of praise when he believes the one player they have truly produced is England striker Harry Kane. He also says Chelsea are in a better position in terms of their academy.

'In reality it is just the one key player, Harry Kane,' said Emenalo. 'Dele Alli they bought, Eric Dier they bought; Tom Carroll is a fringe player. So with all the hoopla about Tottenham, it's just the one player.'

'So with all the hoopla about Tottenham, it's just the one player so we try to remind them it's not just a Chelsea problem. We want them to be patient because they (the parents) want it quicker than the boys want it or the boys are ready to take it.'

Indeed, Emenalo speaks with confidence for another reason and that is because Chelsea's academy has been successful in winning trophies. They have just come off the back of retaining the UEFA Youth League.

On Friday, they play Manchester City in the first-leg of the FA Youth Cup final, which they are defending for a fourth time.

Two players who have been part of the Blues' youth success, Ruben Loftus-Cheek and Bertrand Traore, have both had chances this season at Stamford Bridge.

Both are also expected to be retained in the first-team squad by incoming manager Antonio Conte. And there are high hopes for right-back Todd Kane after an impressive season at NEC Nijmegen in Holland's Eredivisie.


Others will have to show patience. Andreas Christensen will spend a second year at Borussia Monchengladbach and a decision will be made about the next step for Tammy Abraham, an 18-year-old striker who drew enquiries from Premier League teams in January.

But Emenalo urged them to have faith in a system which will see them mature at 21 or 22.

'Christensen will be a superb player,' said Emenalo. 'I see on a regular basis that Jake Clarke-Salter and Fikayo Tomori are going to be outstanding players.

'They are young and I don't know if they decide to get fat. There's nothing I can do about that. If they continue the way that they are, they will make it because they have great talent, there's no doubt about that.

'There is a co-ordinated effort from everybody to want to make this happen. Not just because it feels good, and it is nice to have a backbone the fans can relate to and support.

'But with the investment we are making and where we think the game is going and the competition that we have, you can't just buy your way out of trouble all the time.

'We have a philosophy in the academy to teach them to play the right way, the way we think a big team should play. And ultimately the only way they can play that gives them a chance to play for our first-team.'


He seems a bit bitter and deluded.

ehm, Harry Kane is the obvious one he can't miss

But clearly he wasn't watching :

- PFA awards announcement with Danny Rose included (joined aged almost 17 without having appeared in a first team squad for Leeds, and played for a season for Spurs u18's)
- Mason and Bentaleb being mainstays of Spurs CM last season when we finished in 5th place
- Regular PL appearances from Townsend, Caulker and Livermore and Carroll (I'd guess each of them have made more appearances than the aggregate appearances of ALL Chelsea Academy players who have appeared for Chelsea first team in the last 10 years)

So how is he measuring the success of Chelsea's academy again - by PL appearances by his players

Muppett

 

[Spursidol]

Just finished watching the game. That was probably the best U21 performance I watched all season. Beaten by three pot shots after utterly outplaying them. The result was an utter travesty (hilarious manc commentary "you'd probably say on the balance of play Spurs just about deserve to be level") but I couldn't really give a shit about the result, it was just nice to see a coherent, cohesive performance and we learnt a lot more about our players, whereas all they learnt was that if you whack the ball from 20 yards against a rooky keeper you have a chance.

There was a nice balance to that CM pairing of Stylianides and Winks, and we also looked better balanced with KWP and Muscat as FB's - neither contributed loads offensively as ManU pretty much just parked a bus and camped in the third, making getting in behind them very difficult. Same problem we've had all season though is creating and scoring goals. I really think if Edwards had played the whole game we'd have been so much more threatening, as soon as he came on the dynamics of the game changed, all of a sudden we were getting behind them and people like Winks and Onomah had someone to "play" with in the final third.

Sonupe clearly has decent feet but doesn't really blow me away, his end product is a bit lacking. Sterling is a lively little fucker, who works hard and is tenacious but again just seems to lack that bit of craft.

I thought Walkes and Lesniak actually had decent games, both reading things well, intercepting and coming out with the ball. It's a shame about Walkes, he does have ability, I just get the impression that mentally he lacks that 100% focus that you need. I really like Lesniak, he never gives less than 100%, he's got a good quick brain, very industrious, tenacious, technically very tidy and I think will make a very decent, little busy **** for someone somewhere, just don't think it will be us. I'd have no problem at all keeping him around and giving him cup game time next year, the world needs Kante's and he's a bit like a young Polish Kante in many ways. I doubt Poch sees it that way though.

Slovakian Kante.....?

 

[newbie]

ehm, Harry Kane is the obvious one he can't miss

But clearly he wasn't watching :

- PFA awards announcement with Danny Rose included (joined aged almost 17 without having appeared in a first team squad for Leeds, and played for a season for Spurs u18's)
- Mason and Bentaleb being mainstays of Spurs CM last season when we finished in 5th place
- Regular PL appearances from Townsend, Caulker and Livermore and Carroll (I'd guess each of them have made more appearances than the aggregate appearances of ALL Chelsea Academy players who have appeared for Chelsea first team in the last 10 years)

So how is he measuring the success of Chelsea's academy again - by PL appearances by his players

Muppett

I think Pritchard was unlucky he could easily have clocked up a lot of minutes and could be on you list

Who has played more this year for there team RLC, or each of Carroll, Bentalab, mason, Onomah ?

 

[spurs9]

Once again Im not comparing us to Chelsea at the moment and even said that we are doing much better in that original post

However most of this is players from the old regime not new system bar onomah

I saw what happened with us and how we made this possible

I think they way they are developing players is better than us imo, partly because from the age of 18-21 the loan system is better for some players.

Look at what is happening and bar Onomah who hasnt got that much time, I cant see anyone being ready for the first team

Perhaps I said it wrong, but imo their pathway to get them ready for the first team is better than our current system except for two players which will be Onomah and Edwards. I don't think anyone is suggesting that they give their players more of a chance they don't. I expect it to improve though.

In two or three years time from each current group of players, realistically at the moment they are more likely to have bigger players than us. Whether they are of the quality of onomah or Edwards will be one thing.

In the next 3 years imo the promotions to the first team squad at the moment will be:
Onomah
CCV
maybe Edwards
maybe Winks

Now the last two are debatable because they maybe first team quality in four seasons time after a couple of loans

Whereas them I can see them having the same if not more.
Ake
Solanke
RLC
Baker
DaSilva (maybe)

Also people may forget that we employed the same system as chelsea we had these CM on our books at the same time:
Mason
Kasim(was a very good prospect)
Parrett
Carroll
Bostock
Livermore

Plus there are some others people forget about like Mason-Bush and etc. who didnt make it in league football

Also I never suggested they are giving youth more of a chance so highlighting that we have given more players a chance isn't the point, Im making

However if you are not the best prospect in the academy, the pathway now is really bad as they aren't getting loaned and they aren't good enough for the first team especially when it is doing so well. Your late bloomers like a Carroll, Mason and etc. I don't think could happen in the current setup

From the bold, you have missed KWP, Ball, Ward and Harrison. Also for Chelsea you missed Christensen, who IMO along with Da Silva are the most likely to make it with Chelsea.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490#article-3552530

Chelsea director Michael Emenalo slams Tottenham's youth policy and says Harry Kane is the only key player they have produced and the rest is all 'hoopla'

Chelsea technical director Michael Emenalo is proud of the standards at his academy and is clearly annoyed by all the praise heaped on Tottenham's youth policy this season.

Emenalo doesn't understand why Spurs seem to get a lot of praise when he believes the one player they have truly produced is England striker Harry Kane. He also says Chelsea are in a better position in terms of their academy.

'In reality it is just the one key player, Harry Kane,' said Emenalo. 'Dele Alli they bought, Eric Dier they bought; Tom Carroll is a fringe player. So with all the hoopla about Tottenham, it's just the one player.'

'So with all the hoopla about Tottenham, it's just the one player so we try to remind them it's not just a Chelsea problem. We want them to be patient because they (the parents) want it quicker than the boys want it or the boys are ready to take it.'

Indeed, Emenalo speaks with confidence for another reason and that is because Chelsea's academy has been successful in winning trophies. They have just come off the back of retaining the UEFA Youth League.

On Friday, they play Manchester City in the first-leg of the FA Youth Cup final, which they are defending for a fourth time.

Two players who have been part of the Blues' youth success, Ruben Loftus-Cheek and Bertrand Traore, have both had chances this season at Stamford Bridge.

Both are also expected to be retained in the first-team squad by incoming manager Antonio Conte. And there are high hopes for right-back Todd Kane after an impressive season at NEC Nijmegen in Holland's Eredivisie.


Others will have to show patience. Andreas Christensen will spend a second year at Borussia Monchengladbach and a decision will be made about the next step for Tammy Abraham, an 18-year-old striker who drew enquiries from Premier League teams in January.

But Emenalo urged them to have faith in a system which will see them mature at 21 or 22.

'Christensen will be a superb player,' said Emenalo. 'I see on a regular basis that Jake Clarke-Salter and Fikayo Tomori are going to be outstanding players.

'They are young and I don't know if they decide to get fat. There's nothing I can do about that. If they continue the way that they are, they will make it because they have great talent, there's no doubt about that.

'There is a co-ordinated effort from everybody to want to make this happen. Not just because it feels good, and it is nice to have a backbone the fans can relate to and support.

'But with the investment we are making and where we think the game is going and the competition that we have, you can't just buy your way out of trouble all the time.

'We have a philosophy in the academy to teach them to play the right way, the way we think a big team should play. And ultimately the only way they can play that gives them a chance to play for our first-team.'


He seems a bit bitter and deluded.

chelsea fans hate emenalo, wasn't really sure why before as i don't pay much attention to them but i guess the above goes some way to explaining it.

He's just a glorified bellend isn't he. One of the owners mates.

I don't think Emenalo is right to say Chelsea kids have a better pathway, but I think @beats1 has a point and I said something similar the other day in here:

If anything, I'm arguing with Poch by proxy. Everyone is saying isn't it great that Poch is playing the kids. But the hard truth is only one academy player is now a first team regular, Kane, and he'd proved himself pretty much before Poch got here, and even then it took three months of Adebayor being Adebayor and Soldado having his boots on back to front every week for Kane to get his chance last season.

Every other first team regular has been purchased.

Really not sure why we are buying young players like NJie and Trippier when we are struggling to give people like Pritchard and KWP game time.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Slovakian Kante.....?

Polish had a better ring to it.

 

[THFCSPURS19]

I don't think Emenalo is right to say Chelsea kids have a better pathway, but I think @beats1 has a point and I said something similar the other day in here:



Really not sure why we are buying young players like NJie and Trippier when we are struggling to give people like Pritchard and KWP game time.

Trippier's 25.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Trippier's 25.

Appreciate Njie is younger, confess I thought Trippier was 22/23 ish (don't know why) but Trippier was still only 24 when we bought him. Still don't get why we bought either really with the development players we have here.

 

[THFCSPURS19]

Appreciate Njie is younger, confess I thought Trippier was 22/23 ish (don't know why) but Trippier was still only 24 when we bought him. Still don't get why we bought either really with the development players we have here.

Think Trippier will end up being a stop-gap TBH. N'Jie I completely understand because I think Poch wanted more pace in the squad (something Pritchard lacks). No point getting into another pace vs. brains debate though...

 

[spursfan77]

It's always the same story with Chelsea, because their academy's job is to win youth tournaments and generate hype. It's not to produce 1st team players.

Wasn't it originally just to circumvent FFP. they bought loads of youngsters in to sell on for profit in the future. They had no intention of brining them through as their own players. They were just being used to make the club money. But now FFP has gone they're lumbered with the players and now have to make a choice as to whether they might actually need them themselves.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Think Trippier will end up being a stop-gap TBH. N'Jie I completely understand because I think Poch wanted more pace in the squad (something Pritchard lacks). No point getting into another pace vs. brains debate though...

What debate, that desperately needed "pace" has played virtually no part in our best EPL season thus far. In fact we've probably got slower overall this season with the likes of Dier and Dembele as CM's. And Pritchard's not exactly a plodder.

 

[StartingPrice]

This goes way back, I remember seeing the FAYC quarter final v Arsenal at WHL in 2009 (link to the Arse site for match report, couldn't find it on ours). We had current PL players Mason, Caulker, Smith and Townsend in the side as well as Parrett, Bostock, M'Poku and Obika who were supposedly massive talents but haven't made the top level. Arse had Wilshere and Coquelin + Bartley who's at Swansea now but the main reason they won wasn't because they had more skilful players, they were just so much bigger and stronger than our guys that night. Emmanuel-Thomas in particular was 18 but looked 28 and dwarfed every other player on the pitch physically.

& @For the love of Spurs - To be exact, the movers and shakers of our youth policy made the connect between English football having gone down a cul-de-sac and the way youth set-ups emphasised winning, prioritised big, powerful players, and only looked for the obvious. To take one example, one kid could be born right at the start of the August year-group (or whenever), and another could be born right at the end of the July of the same year group. Now that is basically almost a full calendar year age difference - something that can be massive (in every sense of the word) at, say, 13 or 14. But for years they would be ticked off as a aged x or y and sent out to compete against one another as though the flat age meant they were competing on a level playing field.

And then some kids are early developers and others are late developers. I believe that girls stop growing at 18 and boys stop growing at 21 (could be wrong on that, but that is how I learned it at school). In any case, you'll see the point: one player can be an early developer, at the beginning of his year group and fully grown by 16, another can be one of the youngest in his year group, a late developer and not fully grown until 20/21. So how much do we really learn forcing them to compete at any given age before they are adults and picking one because he won because he was bigger and stronger and able to dominate the other. You could have them compete at 21 and the latter could be bigger and stronger by then, could be not quick as big and strong but not as easy to bully off the ball, and more skillful, have a quicker footballing brain, have developed a more competitive streak, or could just have been plain more dedicated and less inclined to go off the rails. And then apply the same principles across teams picked for any game - and the selection process, youth set-ups, etc.

We haven't specifically gone after under developed players, and we haven't specifically gone after discarded talents. We've just made ourselves aware of all these issues and how they apply to any given target. And we've been prepared to take a gamble on smaller/weaker players who were exceptionally skillful on the basis that they may well grow/fill out, and even if they didn't they may develop coping skills (ala Messi or Modric, who, let's not forget, was sent to the post-war Bosnian League, on loan, when he was a kid)

 

[Blake Griffin]

 

[spurs9]

What debate, that desperately needed "pace" has played virtually no part in our best EPL season thus far. In fact we've probably got slower overall this season with the likes of Dier and Dembele as CM's. And Pritchard's not exactly a plodder.

Alli and Son are both quicker than Chadli, so our front 4 is quicker and I would say most of our players are quicker than they were last year.

 

[StartingPrice]

It's always the same story with Chelsea, because their academy's job is to win youth tournaments and generate hype. It's not to produce 1st team players.

This.

I have a feeling that Mr Emenalo's message was more one for internal consumption. And/or maybe also at potential yoot signings. Because he must have known that any half-intelligent and even reasonably informed hearer is going to be able to pour scorn on it - thus ruling most of the media out

 

[spurs9]

I don't think Emenalo is right to say Chelsea kids have a better pathway, but I think @beats1 has a point and I said something similar the other day in here:



Really not sure why we are buying young players like NJie and Trippier when we are struggling to give people like Pritchard and KWP game time.

KWP wasn't ready, so buying a cheap player on relatively low wages with PL experience that also counts as home grown was a good move, especially since he adds something our other RB doesn't.

Njie is a forward and has a completely different skillset than Pritchard.

 

[StartingPrice]

TBH the job he has done hasnt been to bad, its arguably Mourinho who has cocked up

Mourinho was the one who we are led to believe happy for De Bruyne to leave and Lukaku to go and get in a guy who is a known trouble maker, imo at fault for some of spains problems in the tournament

He can be doing a good job and the route into the first team can be poor at Chelsea at one and the same time. All it takes for the latter to be true is for him to have little influence on whether players under his tutelage are given a fair shot at the first team. Or, the whole set-up at Chelsea could be geared towards buying young talent and then selling them at a profit to generate revenues for the club. TBH, I believe it is the latter - Chelsea want to be competing at the very top year after year (lol), so they don't really have the patience to give a fair number of young players the opportunity to impress as the chances are, even if they are an exceptional group, they may take two or more seasons to reach enough of a peak to challenge for titles. Far easier, so their assumptions go, to buy top level players who are going to perform immediately. Little about that has much to do with whether this fella is doing a good job

 

[Bus-Conductor]

KWP wasn't ready, so buying a cheap player on relatively low wages with PL experience that also counts as home grown was a good move, especially since he adds something our other RB doesn't.

Njie is a forward and has a completely different skillset than Pritchard.

I think KWP was ready to do the same type of job that Trippier has done this season.

I know Njie is different to Pritchard, but I don't necessarily think he was a better option for that difference, personally I think Pritchard offers a lot more than NJie apart from in a 10 yard sprint. And when you consider we already had Chadli, Eriksen, Lamela, and bought Son and Alli as well (know Son arrived after but we were obviously working on both so could have made the choice of either or regardless of who came first).

All we did was throw another 10m body - with even less senior experience and proven ability - in front of Pritchard in the queue for a AM place.