Where are the kids?

[eddiebailey]

I recall Jol defending his fitness regime by saying it was intended to ensure players maintained fitness over the whole season. Certainly we always finished strongly under Jol, picking up points against tired teams.

Obviously we were off the pace going into the start of the season, so Jol did not get it right, but a pre-season aimed more at establishing the brand in mew markets than at preparing players for the demands of the Premiership cannot of helped.

 

[yanno]

Ramos and Marcos Alvarez were famed for brutal pre-seasons at Sevilla, culminating in the notorious "silent protest" where the players put tape over their mouths. They were complaining that the schedule was too hard, and the tape was meant to signify their respect for Ramos (ie a silent rather than a vocal protest). AIUI.

The club's announcement of our participation in a pre-season tournament in Holland, and the fact that the far east trip is happening at the end of this season (not during pre-season), suggests that Ramos may be insisting on having the players close to home in July so Alvarez can well and truly get his whip out....

 

[Bus-Conductor]

How so?

After the CC Final we still had an outside chance of a top six-seven finish if we'd put together as good a run-in as last season's. You aren't going to do that messing around with kids. The fact that many of our senior players haven't delivered is an trrelevance and being wise after the event.

I see what you are saying SS. I wanted the CC win to boost the confidence of our team and bring out the "winner" in them. I hoped we would go on a run, boosted by the victory and manner of it. But it didn't quite happen. King disapeared again and our possible top 6 challenge ended about a month ago.

I don't think we needed to have the whole youth team out there, but surely the last few weeks were tailor made for a bit of experimetation. We'll never get a better chance to do it with less pressure. Even if we made 6th it wouldn't have added that much to ou win kitty from 10th. people like Taarabt, Rose, Peckart, Birchichie, Kaboul, Boeteng, Olsen could have been introduced without causing major ripples.
When would we ever get aless risky chance to do so ? Taarabt could'nt be any more of a fanny than Keane and is more creative. It would have been great to see if Kaboul grows with the experienced Woodgate next to him. Birchichie won best player in tournement playing in a position that we have a RB playing who was deemed not good enough for right back. Rose has just won player of the tournement in another international tournement playing in a position were we have another player playing out of position. And peckhart could have been the nearest we have to a perfect foil for people like Keane if Berbatov goes. But who knows now eh ?

 

[yanno]

people like Taarabt, Rose, Peckart, Birchichie, Kaboul, Boeteng, Olsen could have been introduced without causing major ripples.
When would we ever get aless risky chance to do so ?
...
Birchichie won best player in tournement playing in a position that we have a RB playing who was deemed not good enough for right back. Rose has just won player of the tournement in another international tournement playing in a position were we have another player playing out of position. And peckhart could have been the nearest we have to a perfect foil for people like Keane if Berbatov goes. But who knows now eh ?

I agree that I would have liked to see Ramos blood a couple of our most promising youngsters, but he presumably does not think that the likes of Rose are ready yet. And our young LB/LCB Yuri Berchiche (although I quite like your version: Birchichie! :wink seems to be injured at the moment.

The one that's most frustrating is Taarabt. I agree that now is probably the only opportunity we'll ever have to give him a chance in a low pressure situation. However, having said that, he was crucified on this forum for losing the ball against the Barcodes for their fourth goal.

I hope the club has a medium-term plan for drilling it into Taarabt's brain that football is a team game, and that he has to learn when to use his excellent dribbling skills, and when to pass to a teammate. Reserve football is not the solution. And I don't think a loan to say the Championship is either, because playing with technically inferior players will only encourage young Adel's worst habit: his attempts to dribble past the entire opposition single-handed.

If Ramos isn't going to pick Taarabt, then personally I think he should be loaned out to a league where he'll be playing with technically good teammates in the hope that the penny (that football is a team game) drops whilst he's still under contract to us. So, I would loan him to either La Liga or the French top division.

 

[Krafty]

fair comments Krafty and I totally respect your views

- but you skipped the West Ham question - have a look at their punters - they're moaning even more than ours - yoof or no yoof

Thats spammers for you!

I want to see us get something out of every game. At the moment points arent important, its about individual and team performance and development, and we arent seeing that.

We still have the same players starting, the same players coming off the bench, and you can see that if its not a derby game then the players dont really go all out.

I think a start for Bent or Taarabt, 20 minutes for Rose etc, will do a lot more than playing the same team against Wigan.

Plus giving a youngster a debut now has little pressure associatted with it. If he doesnt do well, well he's still young and its not like the first team have been on fire recently. Its not the be all and end all, he wont be in the spotlight, and then he will be a better option for when we really need him.

 

[eddiebailey]

Sorry, B-C we disagree again on footie. I know you do not rate Keane, but to say he fannies around as much as Taraabt is ridiculous. Pekhart performances at reserve team level do not merit promotion to the first team. Berchiche has yet to establish himself at reserve team level. Olsen is not even starting regularly for the U18s.

As others have said - including me! - we do not really have many reserves who are making the case for first team football. Gunter and Taarabt might come off the bench or even start, though both are quite raw, and Rose or Archibald-Henville might be non- playing substitutes or 17th man to get them involved with the first team, but that is about it.

The players Ramos needs to look at are those who could form part of our plans for next season - O'Hara, Huddlestone, Gilberto, Bent; Kaboul and Tainio if he has not already made his mind up about them.

 

[DC_Boy]

Thats spammers for you!

I think a start for Bent or Taarabt, 20 minutes for Rose etc, will do a lot more than playing the same team against Wigan.

Plus giving a youngster a debut now has little pressure associatted with it. If he doesnt do well, well he's still young and its not like the first team have been on fire recently. Its not the be all and end all, he wont be in the spotlight, and then he will be a better option for when we really need him.

fair points Krafty - but let's remember Bent ain't no kid - so he don't count - if he starts it'll be a natural rotation

starting Taraabt up at Wigan - I dunno - if it happens it happens I won't be overly optimistic - but of course will support him if he plays