HappySpur
You Can't Unfry Things Jerri
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Carr told us to buy Cisse in 2008 and he was the one that scouted Arfa for us
The Daily ITK Discussion Thread - 18th July
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Carr told us to buy Cisse in 2008 and he was the one that scouted Arfa for us
michaelden
Knight of the Fat Fanny
- Aug 13, 2004
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This. I think its time for a £23M bid and get him in sharpish
dav3j
SC Supporter
- Jan 28, 2011
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Given as his job is to search the entire planet for players for Newcastle, he could be forgiven for not bringing some kid off the Hackney Marshes. The fact is, he not only has found these players, he's found them on the cheap and they worked fantastically well for Newcastle. They were only just behind us despite having a cheaper squad, and ahead of Chelski, who obviously had a far superior transfer budget.
CoopsieDeadpool
Well-Known Member
- Jun 8, 2012
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I see what you're saying, but I also very much see what Vincenzo is saying too. It really was nothing special that the players he mentioned were 'spotted' though. Cabaye had been playing CL & EL football since 2005, had played his first full International over a year before Newcastle bought him, and had actually played over 250 professional matches for Lille. So not really any 'spotting' necessary for him.
Ben Arfa, as Vicenzo said, was linked with us ages ago, and had been playing International football & CL football since around 2007. So again, not much 'spotting' needed there. The only risk with him was his often questioned attitude.
Demba Ba had already tore the PL to pieces whilst in his short stint at Wet Spam (7 goals in 12 games), and it was DUMB of Recaro to not go for him when he was available for free after the Spammers were relegated. However, I believe there were insurance issues & Mr Levy wasn't interested in taking that risk?
As for Papiss Cisse, well the guy was, and always has been a very good goalscorer, and it amazed me how long it took for a PL team to take a punt on him, because he is, in my opinion, perfectly suited to the PL.
I think people have got massively carried away with the whole "Graham Carr discovered these players" myth, he didn't. They were all watchable on Sky Sports or ITV, every other week. Unfortunately for us, they were never on MOTD, so our manager at the time never got to see them.
I'm not saying that Graham Carr isn't a good scout, he obviously has something about him, and I was as pissed off as anyone when Recaro Redknapp made Mr Levy get rid of him. But until somebody can point me to a player that he really has 'unearthed', I don't think he can be deemed worthy of the accolades that have been bestowed upon him since Cabaye, Cisse & Ba showed up.
One question though, was it him who came across Tiote? I'd never heard of him before he joined Newcastle, and he's an absolute beast of a player.
PrettyColors
Rosie47 Fan
- Aug 13, 2011
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michaelden
Knight of the Fat Fanny
- Aug 13, 2004
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We talking about the same one? Diamao not the 17 yr old CAM.
How can you say that without having seen him play in the PL?
If he becomes a success and gets us CL the next 2, 3 years he will be worth more than 100m for us.
If he fails, he is so young that we will get a huge amount of the money back.
PrettyColors
Rosie47 Fan
- Aug 13, 2011
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Leandro Damiao, the 22-year old striker from Brazil is the one I'm talking about.
23 million is what you pay for an established striker who will get you 15-25 goals. We could get Huntelaar (48 goals in all competitions) for less. Leandro would be, at best, a back up striker in his first season, as I don't think anyone could say he's as good as Adebayor. We can't break our transfer record by 7 million for that.
CoopsieDeadpool
Well-Known Member
- Jun 8, 2012
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I've never seen anything of Leandro, but I've got to ask you this. How much would you say Defoe is worth? Most press statements etc seem to say it's around £10mil, and that's how much we sold Crouch for too. Is Leandro only £5mil better than Defoe? If so, I truly don't understand the screaming for him to come to our club.
PrettyColors
Rosie47 Fan
- Aug 13, 2011
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how can you say that he is worth that huge amount of money?
When you're talking about 20m+ I think the burden of proof falls on the supporter rather then the "naysayer" which appears to be me.
Misfit
President of The Niles Crane Fanclub
- May 7, 2006
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Yes but say the Ade deal isn't done - forgive me for suggesting it. What do the club do? Overpay for a striker the club is confident enough in to lead the line or go with options they arent sure about but cost less? I'm all for not overpaying for player but if the alternative is harming our chances of success for the next 4 months and then definitely overspending hideously in the Jan window by going with strikers of lesser ability - fuck that!
Misfit
President of The Niles Crane Fanclub
- May 7, 2006
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True enough. Suggest an alternative at least.
jurgen
Busy ****
- Jul 5, 2008
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Yep, clearly scouting isn't just whisking away 8 year olds kicking tin cans around the streets, but also involves detailed analysis into whether a player like Cabaye would adapt to the English game quickly and well enough to justify replacing another player with him, or whether Ben Arfa could be made to keep his ego in check enough to be a productive squad member and so on.. Makoun was also successful with Lille and then Lyon, and seemed tailor made for the Premiership but thus far it hasn't happened for him at Villa, and most clubs can't write off £4-6m so even Cabaye was a calculated risk with the risk presumably minimised by dilligent scouting. And part of that has to be working within a realistic budget for the club, which if the latest ITK downer is any indication of, appears to be rather hard for us...
Bus-Conductor
SC Supporter
- Oct 19, 2004
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But there is a difference between knowing players and being prepared to stake your professional reputation on them. Look at the Suarez fiasco. We get Redknapp telling us he didn't sign him because his "people" told him he was too much like VDV. Utter garbage which translates as "I didn't have the bollocks to stake my reputation on him".
whitelightwhiteheat
SC Supporter
- Jul 21, 2006
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Excellent news we've got ITK on Dembele and Dempsey then....er...hang on...I can't find it anywhere...can anyone help?
There's ITK on Dempsey and Dembele?! Where?
My point is that LD can be the 'new' Falcao (just an example). Before Falcao went to Porto we could have got him, but now he is worth 40m.
How do you know the same will not happen with LD?
Paolo10
Well-Known Member
- Apr 6, 2004
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Carr's as much of a genius as Commolli, sign highly rated players and it's a gamble, some pay off, others don't.
I can't think of too many players that anyone with a passing interest in football wouldn't have wanted to be linked with. Even Benni was rated highly enough in France before Commolli 'unearthed' him.
My issue is the fact we have sold our best players for big money and failed to adequately replace them time and time again. This needs to change. We're still missing a Berbatov replacement ffs, Carrick was another, heartbeat of the side different to Luka, but a critical player.
We were on the cusp of Top 4, we sold our best players, failed to replace them properly by taking a series of low(ish) punts on various foreign and domestic names, it went tits up. It took a new (and very good IMO) manager and sizeable investment to finally get us into the Top 4. Since then other teams around us and above us have strengthened and we've relatively faltered in the market, losing out on the CL 2 seasons running now. Some of the punts have paid off, but a lot have failed.
DL didn't back Harry because he was on his way etc. Harry wanted two top class players to push us on, we ended up with 2 loans. Now AVB's in and you'd expect Levy to back him, talk of a warchest and every fucking player under the sun and what have we got so far? Vertonghen (running out of contract) who's been signing since last year it would seem, Gylfi from left field (young, Prem-proven and relatively cheap...punt for a superstar) and hoping for Adebayor tied up. Big things happening? Err, let us know when it's happening. It's well fucking overdue IMO if we've any chance of getting near the Top 4 again, especially when Modders fucks off.
We know other clubs have more spending power, yet pre the CL season the Spanish wheelbarrow was out, although I suspect it was more a time share. City and Chelsea can't buy all the players for fuck sake, it's about time we got our arse in gear and made some progress with strengthening the squad.
King out - Vertonghen in
Modric out - Gylfi in
...is what it's looking like at the moment. Is it strengthening yet? Even if Ade signs permanently I still don't see we're any stronger than last year, apart from the fact that hopefully Ade would be available from the very start of the season.
Strengthening is well past due IMO, cost us too much already. Penny-pinching saves money short term, but can cost a lot too and has cost us a fair bit already in the bigger picture IMO.
I can't think of too many players that anyone with a passing interest in football wouldn't have wanted to be linked with. Even Benni was rated highly enough in France before Commolli 'unearthed' him.
My issue is the fact we have sold our best players for big money and failed to adequately replace them time and time again. This needs to change. We're still missing a Berbatov replacement ffs, Carrick was another, heartbeat of the side different to Luka, but a critical player.
We were on the cusp of Top 4, we sold our best players, failed to replace them properly by taking a series of low(ish) punts on various foreign and domestic names, it went tits up. It took a new (and very good IMO) manager and sizeable investment to finally get us into the Top 4. Since then other teams around us and above us have strengthened and we've relatively faltered in the market, losing out on the CL 2 seasons running now. Some of the punts have paid off, but a lot have failed.
DL didn't back Harry because he was on his way etc. Harry wanted two top class players to push us on, we ended up with 2 loans. Now AVB's in and you'd expect Levy to back him, talk of a warchest and every fucking player under the sun and what have we got so far? Vertonghen (running out of contract) who's been signing since last year it would seem, Gylfi from left field (young, Prem-proven and relatively cheap...punt for a superstar) and hoping for Adebayor tied up. Big things happening? Err, let us know when it's happening. It's well fucking overdue IMO if we've any chance of getting near the Top 4 again, especially when Modders fucks off.
We know other clubs have more spending power, yet pre the CL season the Spanish wheelbarrow was out, although I suspect it was more a time share. City and Chelsea can't buy all the players for fuck sake, it's about time we got our arse in gear and made some progress with strengthening the squad.
King out - Vertonghen in
Modric out - Gylfi in
...is what it's looking like at the moment. Is it strengthening yet? Even if Ade signs permanently I still don't see we're any stronger than last year, apart from the fact that hopefully Ade would be available from the very start of the season.
Strengthening is well past due IMO, cost us too much already. Penny-pinching saves money short term, but can cost a lot too and has cost us a fair bit already in the bigger picture IMO.
Makkaveli101
SC Supporter
- Apr 11, 2004
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I can't believe we let Carr go (I also was surprised to hear he's Alan Carr, the comedian's Dad too!), was there ever any plaudits given to who he actually brought in at Spurs? Cisse is the one I really kick myself about, why we went for Saha and not the prolific Cisse for 9m is completely and utterly beyond me!!
steve
Well-Known Member
- Oct 21, 2003
- 3,503
- 1,767
Yeah Stoof shut down the Twitter thread 'cos of spam so everyone came in here and spammed the shit out of this instead...nothings happened today...
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