Next Manager Watch
- Thread starter spursfan1991
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-Afri-Coy-
Well-Known Member
- Jun 26, 2012
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I actually wanted to mention, the saints were this team a few years ago and then the recruitment fell apart due to a departure in the scouting/recruitment team if I recall correctly.
We would definitely need to adjust the system to suit our clubs size and needs, but it’s probably the best bet seems as we can’t compete for the players that City, Chelsea, United and probably Newcastle will be able to sign.
A hybrid system of sorts.
kremlyn
Well-Known Member
- Jul 30, 2004
- 1,827
- 2,814
Bring back Poch.
As far as I can see there are 2 main reasons for not bringing him back and they are:
1. We'd risk the age old adage 'never go back'. Meaning it'll never be as good, he'll ruin the only good memories of Spurs in the last 20 years (longer probably).
2. His style of play is ruinous for players as the high press is so demanding.
There's nothing to be said for the first reason because it isn't a reason, it's a feeling and basically a superstition. The second point is true, extremely relevant but also a call to arms, a wake up call for what needs to happen to the squad for it to become successful.
In his last reign he ran that team into the ground. We had numerous injuries and by the end of it the players were running on fumes. Eriksen was done, Dembele was broken, Walker had gone, Rose was defeated, Wanyama had gone too. It was the end of Dele and Kane was crocked up to the champions League final. I hated the fact that he left but I also saw that it just couldn't continue.
The fact was that he'd squeezed every last performance out of that squad and they were tired and probably wanted him gone too.
But, was it his fault? What would have happened if he'd had a squad deep and talented enough to allow him to rotate? What would have happened if he'd been kept away from recruitment and had players like Bentancur and Kulusevski given to him rather than let him bring in Ndombele and Lo Celso?
The first reason to welcome him back is because the structure is in place to enable him to succeed. Paratici has a great eye for talent and the skill to complete the deals and to persuade Levy to let him do it. On top of that, Paratici seems to be able to spot players that would be perfect for a Poch team. Bentancur, Romero, Kulusevski, Lenglet, Richarlison are all players who thrive on pressing aggressively. Coming through the ranks are Sarr and Skipp who also seem well suited to the demands of the double pivot. We genuinely seem to have 2 players for each position in a 4231. Poch loved full backs who pushed up so high they might as well have been wingers - we've suddenly got 3 of each for either side.
The second reason is because change is coming. We've relied on Harry and Son to win for years now and it can't continue. We need to create a winning team again and not just a platform for them to score. If they stay beyond this season then they know his methods and can help the team to transition quickly as well as enough depth to not kill them with game after game of pressing football. If they go then we need to have a game plan that makes us effective quickly; Poch's high press and the personel we have are perfect for that IMO.
The third reason to bring him back is not specific to Poch but specific to us. For better or worse, we're spurs; an attacking team who'll win by scoring more goals than you, not by waiting for you to die of boredom. Just imagine that stadium with a team playing attacking football! The team would be lifted as would we and that is what Poch does.
If you look at the reasons Poch failed last time, they've all been addressed: Squad depth, aligned and timely recruitment, friction with Levy.
There are great managers out there, Tuchel for one, who'd do a great job but none are ours, resonant with who we are, how we like to play in the way that Poch is.
If he comes and fails again then at the very least I'll never wonder 'what might have been'.
If he comes and succeeds then I don't think I could ever be happier for my team. Feels.
As far as I can see there are 2 main reasons for not bringing him back and they are:
1. We'd risk the age old adage 'never go back'. Meaning it'll never be as good, he'll ruin the only good memories of Spurs in the last 20 years (longer probably).
2. His style of play is ruinous for players as the high press is so demanding.
There's nothing to be said for the first reason because it isn't a reason, it's a feeling and basically a superstition. The second point is true, extremely relevant but also a call to arms, a wake up call for what needs to happen to the squad for it to become successful.
In his last reign he ran that team into the ground. We had numerous injuries and by the end of it the players were running on fumes. Eriksen was done, Dembele was broken, Walker had gone, Rose was defeated, Wanyama had gone too. It was the end of Dele and Kane was crocked up to the champions League final. I hated the fact that he left but I also saw that it just couldn't continue.
The fact was that he'd squeezed every last performance out of that squad and they were tired and probably wanted him gone too.
But, was it his fault? What would have happened if he'd had a squad deep and talented enough to allow him to rotate? What would have happened if he'd been kept away from recruitment and had players like Bentancur and Kulusevski given to him rather than let him bring in Ndombele and Lo Celso?
The first reason to welcome him back is because the structure is in place to enable him to succeed. Paratici has a great eye for talent and the skill to complete the deals and to persuade Levy to let him do it. On top of that, Paratici seems to be able to spot players that would be perfect for a Poch team. Bentancur, Romero, Kulusevski, Lenglet, Richarlison are all players who thrive on pressing aggressively. Coming through the ranks are Sarr and Skipp who also seem well suited to the demands of the double pivot. We genuinely seem to have 2 players for each position in a 4231. Poch loved full backs who pushed up so high they might as well have been wingers - we've suddenly got 3 of each for either side.
The second reason is because change is coming. We've relied on Harry and Son to win for years now and it can't continue. We need to create a winning team again and not just a platform for them to score. If they stay beyond this season then they know his methods and can help the team to transition quickly as well as enough depth to not kill them with game after game of pressing football. If they go then we need to have a game plan that makes us effective quickly; Poch's high press and the personel we have are perfect for that IMO.
The third reason to bring him back is not specific to Poch but specific to us. For better or worse, we're spurs; an attacking team who'll win by scoring more goals than you, not by waiting for you to die of boredom. Just imagine that stadium with a team playing attacking football! The team would be lifted as would we and that is what Poch does.
If you look at the reasons Poch failed last time, they've all been addressed: Squad depth, aligned and timely recruitment, friction with Levy.
There are great managers out there, Tuchel for one, who'd do a great job but none are ours, resonant with who we are, how we like to play in the way that Poch is.
If he comes and fails again then at the very least I'll never wonder 'what might have been'.
If he comes and succeeds then I don't think I could ever be happier for my team. Feels.
mattspur1986
Well-Known Member
- Jan 27, 2007
- 1,105
- 5,861
yeah, and how did those 2 pan out?
That's a little misleading if you ask me, most managers over that period at Barcelona likely win exactly the same in my opinion.
Ribble
Well-Known Member
- Apr 13, 2011
- 3,532
- 4,822
You mean Luis Campos? He's DoF at PSG now.
In an around-about-way you've answered your own question. There's no such thing as a 'dead cert'. What you're relying on, is the infrastructure getting more 'right' then 'wrong'.
The trouble at THFC, we get very little right and the majority goes catastrophically wrong. There's no such thing as 'luck' it all comes down to recruitment and succession planning. Didn't we hear in the week Guardiola talk about Kompany being the ideal Man City manager (and his successor) in the next 3 years?
We always seem to be so reactive and "blinded" by what's unfolding. Fraser Campbell still haunts me!
Ledders Army
Well-Known Member
- Jul 26, 2008
- 738
- 783
I think Poch had had enough & needed a break. He said a rebuild was needed but don't think he had the energy for it & how long it would take given lack of investment. Always felt to me he understood the decision to fire him which is why him & Levy have maintained a good relationship.
Odds on him Leaving PSG for Spurs? More chance of being kicked by a snake!
Timberwolf
Well-Known Member
- Jan 17, 2008
- 10,328
- 50,217
One thing that concerns me is that I don't know which Poch we'll be getting. I'm doubtful he'll come in and immediately employ the all-action, high-pressing 4-2-3-1 we played back in 15/16 as by the end of his tenure we weren't playing like that at all and he was talking about a "need to evolve the style every season". Unfortunately this evolution was a bad one as it led to the horrible diamond and a slow degradation of all the good aspects of his early football.
I suppose the key question is, was that degradation and the diamond simply Poch doing the absolute best he could with what, in retrospect, was a squad lacking in quality reinforcements, a weak bench and no majestic Dembele to run things in the middle. Or had Poch gone off the deep end tactically?
Either way, I highly suspect that if Poch does return it won't be a return to style the glory days and his football will be different in ways that people won't expect, for better or for worse.
sidford
Well-Known Member
- Oct 20, 2003
- 11,440
- 30,202
Can I ask why you think that? because lessons won't have been learned by Levy so not much will change no matter who the manager?
(You've said this is your opinion so it's not a Q of an ITK but if people think different obviously il delete this)
Timberwolf
Well-Known Member
- Jan 17, 2008
- 10,328
- 50,217
Yeah I completely agree. Even if the Brighton model falls apart in the coming years, at least they actually have a bloody model whereas we're stumbling around in the dark treading on bits of lego and bumping into walls.
Dunc2610
Well-Known Member
- Aug 7, 2008
- 1,612
- 4,034
I don't normally get annoyed with facetious replies on the internet, but in this case, it was a uncalled for I asked a perfectly polite question knowing there are some knowledgeable people on here who watch more football than I get to and could give me an a straight forward answer.
Sometimes it's not that difficult to be polite!
andyp8080
SC Supporter
- Jan 30, 2011
- 2,098
- 4,203
this sound ominous
It wasn't aimed at you mate. It was more in general that De Zerbi is seen as a 5min wonder when you can see on Wikipedia, Google hes done really well last few years.
Thought you was being sarcastic saying hes done nothing, so nothing personal at you at all.
kremlyn
Well-Known Member
- Jul 30, 2004
- 1,827
- 2,814
I used to like his formational tweaks! But I think they were born of necessity like moving Dier to the anchor role was mainly because we ran out of Dembeles
I think his basic formation is a 4231 and he'll tweak as he learns more about his players.
Pochs only limitation remains his awful substitutions. Again, that might change with the 5 subs rule and a better bench.
mil1lion
This is the place to be
- May 7, 2004
- 42,682
- 78,559
But then it comes down to what do we do if the manager isn't going to be backed? Just get another who is in the same boat as Conte and Jose? It makes no difference either way.
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