ENIC in or out?

[Hercules]

Nothing wrong with this summers business. It's the previous summer that was the beginning of the end for Poch and Levy is to blame for not being brave and going for and getting players that Poch deemed good enough.

Poch is to blame on previous windows, as there was decent money available. He just kept knocking back players put to him. And they were quality players tbf. Does not mean that DL was squeaky clean and innocent neither.

 

[Hakkz]

Nothing wrong with this summers business. It's the previous summer that was the beginning of the end for Poch and Levy is to blame for not being brave and going for and getting players that Poch deemed good enough.

Except for de Jong, do we even know the names?

 

[yido_number1]

Poch is to blame on previous windows, as there was decent money available. He just kept knocking back players put to him. And they were quality players tbf. Does not mean that DL was squeaky clean and innocent neither.

Not to get into a debate about it but ultimately the club didn't sign the players he wanted. Why should accept first team players into his squad that he doesn't want? IMHO you bring in a manager to run the squad and select the team. Playing staff should be decided amongst their team. If you don't trust their opinions don't hire them. If they try this with Mourinho he will open up a lot more in the press than Pochettino did.

 

[yido_number1]

Except for de Jong, do we even know the names?

Saha & Nelson.

 

[tiger666]

Not to get into a debate about it but ultimately the club didn't sign the players he wanted.

Well boo fucking hoo. Even Pep doesn't get all the players he wants.

 

[Gassin's finest]

Not to get into a debate about it but ultimately the club didn't sign the players he wanted. Why should accept first team players into his squad that he doesn't want? IMHO you bring in a manager to run the squad and select the team. Playing staff should be decided amongst their team. If you don't trust their opinions don't hire them. If they try this with Mourinho he will open up a lot more in the press than Pochettino did.

Because even if they weren't exactly what he wanted, it would have still bolstered a squad that was blowing out of its arse for the last 10 games of last season, thanks to injuries and exhaustion.

 

[yido_number1]

Because even if they weren't exactly what he wanted, it would have still bolstered a squad that was blowing out of its arse for the last 10 games of last season, thanks to injuries and exhaustion.

We both know Poch doesn't play players that he didn't want to sign. See Stambouli et al and the time it took to rid them from the squad.

I've always supported Levy you can look back through my posts. They've reached their ceiling now and watching clubs like Liverpool out invest us and move forwards painfully highlights that.

 

[Dillspur]

Poch is to blame on previous windows, as there was decent money available. He just kept knocking back players put to him. And they were quality players tbf. Does not mean that DL was squeaky clean and innocent neither.

In your opinion they were quality players, but it's the opinion of Poch that mattered. Obviously there were going to be players like De Jong that wanted something bigger, but there were also players like Grealish that wanted to come.

 

[Dillspur]

Because even if they weren't exactly what he wanted, it would have still bolstered a squad that was blowing out of its arse for the last 10 games of last season, thanks to injuries and exhaustion.

We tried that with players like Janssen, N'koudou, N'jie and many other low cost high reward types that offered nothing and in the end were difficult to get rid of.

Those 3 players cost us 40-45m and 75-100k p/w in wages? That could have been spent on 1 better quality player, I think that's what Poch wanted.

 

[Hakkz]

We tried that with players like Janssen, N'koudou, N'jie and many other low cost high reward types that offered nothing and in the end were difficult to get rid of.

Those 3 players cost us 40-45m and 75-100k p/w in wages? That could have been spent on 1 better quality player, I think that's what Poch wanted.

Poch pushed hard for Janssen himself.

 

[Dillspur]

Poch pushed hard for Janssen himself.

I get that and at the time I didn't mind the signing, in fact (at the time) I didn't mind the signings I mentioned. But I think when Poch saw Pool spending big on glaring weaknesses, he wanted quality over quantity.

 

[Hercules]

In your opinion they were quality players, but it's the opinion of Poch that mattered. Obviously there were going to be players like De Jong that wanted something bigger, but there were also players like Grealish that wanted to come.

I will not name all the players. But as far as most would be concerned, they were massive improvements on what we already have. Maddison was ours if we pushed for him. But Poch had zero interest. And there are others of his ill, or better. Factor in that Poch alone pushed for VJ, against one or two concerns. How did that go?

 

[dagraham]

I will not name all the players. But as far as most would be concerned, they were massive improvements on what we already have. Maddison was ours if we pushed for him. But Poch had zero interest. And there are others of his ill, or better. Factor in that Poch alone pushed for VJ, against one or two concerns. How did that go?

Even with no inside knowledge I have always maintained this is the case. Massive, massive bollock dropped by all concerned if true.

 

[The Doc]

I will not name all the players. But as far as most would be concerned, they were massive improvements on what we already have. Maddison was ours if we pushed for him. But Poch had zero interest. And there are others of his ill, or better. Factor in that Poch alone pushed for VJ, against one or two concerns. How did that go?

Fair enough, if that's on him, although not sure Maddison was widely rated until this season, and wasn't VJ a result of not getting Batshuayi done? Lord knows what the thought process was if yes. Probably the same one that led to Zokora replacing Carrick. In mitigation, imagine there were also plenty who were "just out of reach" (Mane, Keita, insert name of any pacy, goalscoring wf that didn't happen for whatever reason). Appreciate I probably come across as a Poch apologist, but am sympathetic to the argument that he should not be alone in shouldering blame on this matter.

 

[Dillspur]

I will not name all the players. But as far as most would be concerned, they were massive improvements on what we already have. Maddison was ours if we pushed for him. But Poch had zero interest. And there are others of his ill, or better. Factor in that Poch alone pushed for VJ, against one or two concerns. How did that go?

You have to back the manager, if Poch didn't want/like Maddison then that's fine. If at the time of signing Janssen it was between him and another unknown striker, again I have no problem with that. I just mentioned I didn't mind those low risk high reward types, that was where we were, but it was clear Poch wanted more, everyone is saying Levy is showing ambition getting Jose in, if he'd shown this ambition in 2018 maybe we win the CL, maybe we're closer to pool and city and maybe Poch is still here with a squad that can seriously challenge for the title?

 

[dontcallme]

You have to back the manager, if Poch didn't want/like Maddison then that's fine. If at the time of signing Janssen it was between him and another unknown striker, again I have no problem with that. I just mentioned I didn't mind those low risk high reward types, that was where we were, but it was clear Poch wanted more, everyone is saying Levy is showing ambition getting Jose in, if he'd shown this ambition in 2018 maybe we win the CL, maybe we're closer to pool and city and maybe Poch is still here with a squad that can seriously challenge for the title?

So Poch wanted more but turned down players that would have improved us? If he turned down obtainable targets but wanted unobtainable then he has to take some responsibility.

Ultimately the transfer setup under Poch was wrong. Hopeully Jose, Levy and likely a DOF can get it right.

 

[Dillspur]

So Poch wanted more but turned down players that would have improved us? If he turned down obtainable targets but wanted unobtainable then he has to take some responsibility.

Ultimately the transfer setup under Poch was wrong. Hopeully Jose, Levy and likely a DOF can get it right.

The transfer set up was wrong, I agree with that. But again, it's Poch's opinion that matters, if he didn't want Maddison that's fine, but he wanted Grealish and Mane how did those turn out?

 

[dontcallme]

The transfer set up was wrong, I agree with that. But again, it's Poch's opinion that matters, if he didn't want Maddison that's fine, but he wanted Grealish and Mane how did those turn out?

Mane went to Liverpool. Only the most arrogant of fans would dismiss them as a pull.

Grealish became a bit of a mess but only those with an agenda pretend to know the facts.

 

[Shadydan]

Couldn't afford Mane's wages at the time could we?

 

[Joely]

The transfer set up was wrong, I agree with that. But again, it's Poch's opinion that matters, if he didn't want Maddison that's fine, but he wanted Grealish and Mane how did those turn out?

He may have wanted Mane but there was pretty much zero chance of it happening. Liverpool had that one more of less tied up a while before he actually signed.