Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

[TOLBINY]

I have no patience when it comes to incompetence. Ange and his coaching staff shows a lot of it. We had two weeks to work on set pieces. And they give us this? He does nothing about the opponents backing into Vic. Put someone between Vic and White, so Vic can push his own player on White and create space for himself. Even a sunday league coach know this. But apparently our top tier manager doesn’t.

Who said he is top tier?

 

[superted4]

Would be genuinely curious to hear some reasons why he hasn't changed the set piece problem, because the only reasons I can think of is a) it's easier to not do something than to do something and b) he's scared of Jedinak.

Must be scared of Mason too, as we are wank at attacking set pieces too!

 

[mil1lion]

I am 100% convinced Ange wont win us the league or cups. He will win enough to be in Europe or even CL. He will win enough of those big games but when it matters to be pragmatic & tactically switched on, I dont think his sides can do it.

Defenses win trophies. Theres absolutely no way, we do anything serious with a coach who is not preparing the team tactically or addressing teams failings like set pieces.

It's not him though it's the quality of players. We had defensive managers and still didn't win anything. If you're talking about winning things you need to be talking about whether we actually have the players to win things. Sign him top players and things will look different. That's where we failed with Poch.

 

[Thenewcat]

Needs to hire a set piece coach. It shouldn’t be a request either

 

[RuskyM]

Must be scared of Mason too, as we are wank at attacking set pieces too!

I mean Romero nearly scored from two today.

 

[Gb160]

People are on his back now. This is our problem as a fanbase, we’ve no patience. We need to give him time to build the team the way he wants it.

You're right but I think a lot of it is coming from a lack of progress. We seem to be getting worse as the season has progressed.

 

[floydiohead]

I find the naievity being shown by Postecoglu to be infuriating.

He plays Davies at full back and anybody, and I mean anybody, can see that Davies cannot play his system. Yet he makes Davies play it, and that results in him being massively out of position and flustering against Saka for the second goal. During the second half Davies was obviously told to stay back when we were in position and he was much better. Why didn't you start him like that, mate?

Their third goal. Vicario has been targeted for every corner, every game, since City. Yet, for some reason, he lets it happen game after game. He's changed nothing. Add to that our absolutely shambolic 'zonal' marking on corners, and you have the third goal. Apparently though, nothing is changing.

Not starting Sarr, and Hojbjerg instead. I think Hojbjerg was unlucky with his OG; but why start him? It made absolutely no sense in this game. Can anyone enlighten me?

Persisting with playing Son up front. Son has been almost entirely ineffectual for ages. He puts him on the left and brings Richarilson on, good move. But why leave it so late and why has it taken him so long?

It just felt massively that we didn't start playing the way we should have against this lot until the second half, when we were three down. Infuriating.

 

[Thenewcat]

It's not him though it's the quality of players. We had defensive managers and still didn't win anything. If you're talking about winning things you need to be talking about whether we actually have the players to win things. Sign him top players and things will look different. That's where we failed with Poch.

The fact that we can’t defend a corner to save our lives isn’t down the quality of players. It’s down to poor coaching and nothing else

 

[TOLBINY]

I hope we stick with him. Might as well go all in for the next few years, get who he wants, commit to his vision etc. What's the alternative? I don't want to go back to Mourinho or Conte ball, especially without Kane.

Having said that, I think the end of this season could get ugly.

Not saying I disagree with you - but do you honestly think that Mourinho or Conte got who they wanted? We know they weren't given the time.

 

[funkycoldmedina]

Why haven’t you mentioned the set piece defending- don’t you think it was decisive?

We could have scored four in the first half, the narrative they were much better than us was wrong. We missed by inches apart from Son who missed a gilt edged chance by a mile

I said the opposite and I do think the set piece thing is an issue

 

[Dave1882]

Any manager can say my mantra is to attack. Well, his teams can’t fucking defend. Another imposter, he’ll be gone within 18 months. Stake my mortgage on it

 

[felmani26]

I'll be honest I've never been fully on the Ange train. I really like the man but have always had my doubts on if he can stack up at such a higher level. The PL is a world away from his previous leagues.

I love his attitude around things but we've really struggled since the Chelsea game. After the Chelsea defeat he said we will always try even if the odds are against us. When I look at a lot of our performances since then I feel we lack courage, too many players taking the easy option. Whilst I fully agree he needs players and more depth we have had plenty of time on the training ground this season and have got worse as the season progresses.

I really do worry for him with the end to the season we have. We need to at least show something, we are too passive and lack conviction. The performances are just as crucial as the results for me and like many said under Jose and Conte they wanted good performances and to play good football. Simply put other than the start of the season we haven't played good football. Injuries and internationals have definitely not helped but we need to see more IMO. Too many preventable mistakes and a lack of positive attacking football are really highlighting some concerns that were raised against Ange before he got the job.

I hope it works out as I really like the man, if he can tweak his tactical approach in certain situations and make tough decisions and drop players way off form, appoint specialist coaches then he will have a much better platform but he needs to accept he needs change and not just keep repeating the same mistakes with hope it will get better.

This summer will be quite telling in how rigid he wishes to be in terms of sticking to his principles and tactical set up and that it's simply a case of 'better players needed' and round pegs in round holes or that we assemble a much more flexible looking squad and that the matches that present themselves will be countered with a team best to accomodate.

He's always reinforced the point that this is in no way shape or form the finished article so have to see how he adapts over the summer with not only the benefit of a full season behind him but knowing we will be embarking on a European journey to boot.

I'll give Ange plenty of credit in the bank but there is little excuse to how we defend quick transitions and certainly not defending set pieces - that needs urgent attention!

 

[superted4]

I mean Romero nearly scored from two today.

Good point well put

 

[ginola99]

But the set backs v Newcastle and Fulham and then the first half today show that he's not willing to adjust or not able to learn from what we're doing wrong, would you not agree?

Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is the definition of madness.

Yes, it's a project and we have a lot of work to do, but we had a huge opportunity to finish in the top 4 with a little bit more tactfulness and playing with a bit more sensibility. And picking players on form rather than name. Maddison, Son have both been dreadful for weeks.

It's nice to watch us dominate the ball, but currently we lack that creative spark we had with Maddison earlier in the season, yet he keeps picking him over Gio who has shown more in fleeting performances. Strange he keeps picking players that are out of form at the business end of the season. Some decisions have been strange.

It's fine to be patient but there needs to be some sort of signs that he can adapt and change.

He has confidence in his methods and that is something refreshing to me.

A lot of the not willing to learn from what's going wrong and definition of madness are sound bites to when a manager is under pressure. Klopp lost 3 cup finals before he got it right, Arteta was wanted dead for finishing mid table and Pep had his worst season as a manger when he started at City. All were too stubborn and or the definition of madness. Although all had tons of cash thrown at them and I don't remember them losing their best player the week the season started.

I admit this doesn't look good and I'm not gonna pretend it is, but the writing was on the wall when it became obvious that we couldn't get out and in all the players we wanted to during the summer and it was simply too big a task.

Also, we haven't had much luck with injuries this season, when was the last time Soloman played for us? Etc.

 

[Thenewcat]

People are on his back now. This is our problem as a fanbase, we’ve no patience. We need to give him time to build the team the way he wants it.

I’m on his back about specific issues that are fixable and don’t need time. Decent set piece defending isn’t about personnel - plenty of teams with a fraction of our talent are good at it. It’s completely reasonable to be pissed off that that he hasn’t adequately addressed it

 

[Verloc]

Everything we worried about for the last two weeks happened. That is quite damning.

 

[spurs mental]

I hope we stick with him. Might as well go all in for the next few years, get who he wants, commit to his vision etc. What's the alternative? I don't want to go back to Mourinho or Conte ball, especially without Kane.

Having said that, I think the end of this season could get ugly.

See, this is what I find a bit funny, the bit in bold.

Both were said to be stubborn and unwilling to change their systems, however dated or boring you or anyone else may think they were.

But Ange is equally as stubborn, unwilling and outspoken about us not needing a specialist defensive coach, but it's quite clear we do.

It was also said they need specific players for their system, and we shouldn't have bought into them because it was so bad etc. But Ange needs better players too, if we're to improve.

Yet, here we are with most saying give Ange time whereas every man and their dog wanted Jose and Conte out. Even when results were good at times.

Sure, the football is better in terms of us dominating the ball, and playing well through a press most of the time(first goal came from the corner where we couldn't play out of the press today). But as soon as we get to the opposition box, regardless of its a low block or counter attack, we slow down, we freeze, we pass it backwards.

We can't continue to concede goals at the rate we are if we want to compete better next season. We can't continue to waste chances or lack that creative spark we had at the start of the season.

He could pick different players, but a rocket up Maddison and Son's backside's. Gio has shown in very fleeting minutes that he can make a difference. Deki in thr middle was heavily involved today and had one of his best games for a while.

Try something. I'll say it again, the definition of madness is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

 

[ajspurs]

There's a lot more right than there is wrong with Ange IMO, but the wrongs will really hamper our capabilities.

I've always said I don't mind seeing the things such as being too open, poor from set pieces etc. as long as there's an acknowledgement of it and a plan to rectify it. I'm yet to see it being acknowledged as much as I feel it should be, so the hope is just that it changes next season.

 

[arunspurs]

It's not him though it's the quality of players. We had defensive managers and still didn't win anything. If you're talking about winning things you need to be talking about whether we actually have the players to win things. Sign him top players and things will look different. That's where we failed with Poch.

To win things, you need better players. But at same time, you also need to have a defensive strucuture. Needing Van De Ven to make 4 impossible (for others) sprint in 2nd half isnt a worthy tactics. Thats why when VDV got injured, we kept losing games. Dependence on 1 CB to be super human isnt long term.

Moreover, problem is setpieces. We werent this bad in set piece defending for decades. Vicario, Romero, VDV, Davies , even Porro are not bad players. If anything apart from Davies, I fully expect others to start even next season if we bring in reinforcements.

Problem is clearly lack of organisation. Bringing in 200m worth of players isnt changing that characteristic one bit

 

[TOLBINY]

Would be genuinely curious to hear some reasons why he hasn't changed the set piece problem, because the only reasons I can think of is a) it's easier to not do something than to do something and b) he's scared of Jedinak.

Some suggestions;
He cannot see the problem ( I doubt it)
He is coaching the set pieces but the players are not competent enough to implement (possible)
He believes in the zonal system ( seems clear to me) and is giving the players time to master it (unlikely)
He is waiting until the end of the season to make changes to either the system or the defensive coach (most likely IMO)