Roy Keane

[ljinko888]

I think he'll have a short term impact and take them up. I watch the EFL highlights on Sunday mornings and scoring goals isn't a problem with Sunderland. With Defoe up front and Keane on the touchline the place will be electric. Momentum and confidence is huge in the lower leagues.

 

[sausage]

Incredible, well, laughable anyway, how someone who is a complete and utter failure as a football manager can get a job as a pundit and , with a straight face, sit there and tell the world what these other managers are doing wrong.
Sky for you I suppose. They know he'll be sensational as he's an idiot.

This is a rather common but flawed argument. It suggests that only people who are good at something are capable at criticising it, which is nonsense.
Being good at something is either being able to effect an awareness, or just luck. Some people are far better at instructing others how to do something than they at doing it themselves, which is often due to the fact that knowing how to do something is very different to actually doing it, due to physical limitations or personality.

That's before you get into the fact that, as a manager, he won the Championship with Sunderland. And manager of the year. Didn't do a terrible job at Ipswich, either. About par really. Pretty exaggerated (if not totally odd) definition of "utter failure"?

 

[CoopsieDeadpool]

Only just come across this.

Fair pay for the lady and her poorly little-un (,hopefully still in the road to recovery) and an absolutely beautiful gesture from a guy who's largely heralded as some sort of heartless villain.

The bloke just wants to win.

 

[allatsea]

Only just come across this.

Fair pay for the lady and her poorly little-un (,hopefully still in the road to recovery) and an absolutely beautiful gesture from a guy who's largely heralded as some sort of heartless villain.

The bloke just wants to win.

At any cost regardless of the injuries he inflicts.

 

[CoopsieDeadpool]

At any cost regardless of the injuries he inflicts.

Was as happy to take it back, as he was to dish it out.

As he stated, when you go over those white lines it's to enter into war, and he was in the middle of it. And he would've had no complaints if anyone had injured him.

Roy Keane Insists He Has ‘No Regrets’ Over Injuring Alf-Inge Haaland

Manchester United legend says he meant to hurt - but not injure - Erling Haaland's dad.

www.sportbible.com

 

[allatsea]

Was as happy to take it back, as he was to dish it out.

As he stated, when you go over those white lines it's to enter into war, and he was in the middle of it. And he would've had no complaints if anyone had injured him.

Roy Keane Insists He Has ‘No Regrets’ Over Injuring Alf-Inge Haaland

Manchester United legend says he meant to hurt - but not injure - Erling Haaland's dad.

www.sportbible.com

Disgusting attitude. Deliberately setting out to injure an opposition player.

 

[sausage]

Disgusting attitude. Deliberately setting out to injure an opposition player.

Just a different era, though. The like of Ron Harris (and footballers of that era) are used to glorify the whole 'when men were men' type shtick.

I don't think it has a place in the modern game at all, nor would I glorify/condone it - but those were the days of Vinny Jones and others who played the game like it was just as much a physical contest as it was a sporting one.

 

[SpringHeeledJim]

Sometimes he's entertaining but i'm yet to actually here him offer proper insight or demonstrate and real tactical knowledge

Good at stating the obvious ''he should have saved that'' or ''the defence is all over the place'' Yes Roy I can see that myself. Can you explain how the defence should be set up or what tactical tweaks would you make apart from ''they need to bring on someone who can score goals'

Hope he fails miserably
'

 

[soup]

This is a rather common but flawed argument. It suggests that only people who are good at something are capable at criticising it, which is nonsense.
Being good at something is either being able to effect an awareness, or just luck. Some people are far better at instructing others how to do something than they at doing it themselves, which is often due to the fact that knowing how to do something is very different to actually doing it, due to physical limitations or personality.

That's before you get into the fact that, as a manager, he won the Championship with Sunderland. And manager of the year. Didn't do a terrible job at Ipswich, either. About par really. Pretty exaggerated (if not totally odd) definition of "utter failure"?

Many other sports back this up, such as boxers, MMA fighters, tennis players, cyclists, golfers, the list goes on, where you'll often find some 'unheard of' training world class athletes when they've probably only ever entered the actual sport on an amateur level themselves, or if not at all.

 

[CoopsieDeadpool]

Just a different era, though. The like of Ron Harris (and footballers of that era) are used to glorify the whole 'when men were men' type shtick.

I don't think it has a place in the modern game at all, nor would I glorify/condone it - but those were the days of Vinny Jones and others who played the game like it was just as much a physical contest as it was a sporting one.

Thank you.

Though I'm very surprised by @allatsea response.

 

[sausage]

Many other sports back this up, such as boxers, MMA fighters, tennis players, cyclists, golfers, the list goes on, where you'll often find some 'unheard of' training world class athletes when they've probably only ever entered the actual sport on an amateur level themselves, or if not at all.

Indeed. Horse riding is one.

A number of years ago a family friend was killed whilst training a showjumping horse. Didn't have a great deal of awards or honours as a jumper, but a lot of people knew and respected him in the industry. For whatever reason that was his own, he decided he would buy young horses for a coupe of grand, then he'd train them until they were ready for be ridden at a high level. He'd then get, what I recall as, huge amounts for these horses by selling them on, and he'd start again.

In many ways, he was much better than the top level ones because he was able to take a raw horse and make it ready to win. He 'failed' because his path had greater risks - not because his ability was lesser.

I know that doesn't exactly relate much to Roy Keane, but in the grand scheme of things you look at the relative CV of some of the "top" managers, and wonder if they'd be able to achieve what Mick McCarthy did with Sunderland and Wolves (pre-Fosun) or Neil Warnock's promotions. In some ways, you need to have completely different skill sets.
For example, a manager needs completely different skills to motivate Ravel Morrison or Taarabt to play to their best abilities, which is often why the top clubs can't get anything out of them. The same manager will cause a dressing room mutiny at a big club by telling Pogba to stop mucking about on Instatwitter and concentrate on his football.

 

[slartibartfast]

This is a rather common but flawed argument. It suggests that only people who are good at something are capable at criticising it, which is nonsense.
Being good at something is either being able to effect an awareness, or just luck. Some people are far better at instructing others how to do something than they at doing it themselves, which is often due to the fact that knowing how to do something is very different to actually doing it, due to physical limitations or personality.

That's before you get into the fact that, as a manager, he won the Championship with Sunderland. And manager of the year. Didn't do a terrible job at Ipswich, either. About par really. Pretty exaggerated (if not totally odd) definition of "utter failure"?

Being a football manager doesnt demand much physicality though and he isnt better at it.
And he was terrible at Ipswich mate lol.
You dont have to be good at something physically to criticise something physical.
Like that idiot Keown said 'what does he know he's never played the game' which is utter bollox.
Managing something is different imo.
Anyway, he's a total prick so who cares lol.

 

[sausage]

Being a football manager doesnt demand much physicality though and he isnt better at it.
And he was terrible at Ipswich mate lol.
You dont have to be good at something physically to criticise something physical.
Like that idiot Keown said 'what does he know he's never played the game' which is utter bollox.
Managing something is different imo.
Anyway, he's a total prick so who cares lol.

I said "physical limitations or personality". It's like someone who can teach someone to act, but can't remember lines well enough to be an actor. Knowing what to do is different to doing it.
If you want to get more abstract - someone who can verify the authenticity of a painting, but couldn't make a passable fake themselves.

I take more exception to someone like Shearer, who has next to no experience, and was awful at it, commenting on managers who relegate teams, as they don't have any basis to say they know anything about the job.

As for Ipswich, ignoring the subjectivity of the task in hand (which has had a churn of many managers), you don't win the Championship as a manager if you're a failure.

 

[sausage]

This is quite a gripping watch, hearing Roy call out the types of managers who get loads of chances and Gary trying to explain it to him without saying something like "Tim Sherwood"

 

[riggi]

This is quite a gripping watch, hearing Roy call out the types of managers who get loads of chances and Gary trying to explain it to him without saying something like "Tim Sherwood"

Really enjoyed that when I watched it before.

 

[sausage]

Really enjoyed that when I watched it before.

Quite funny though how his demeanour is (even if it's not representative of his personality). Every time Gary said something he just didn't understand.

"You know Roy, you were never easy going"
"What do you mean Gary?? Why wasn't I? What do you want me to do? Tell me? Tell me now!"

 

[riggi]

Quite funny though how his demeanour is (even if it's not representative of his personality). Every time Gary said something he just didn't understand.

"You know Roy, you were never easy going"
"What do you mean Gary?? Why wasn't I? What do you want me to do? Tell me? Tell me now!"

He’s great. I agree with so much of what he says. I can’t see him doing well as manager though. He can’t manage modern players. Like apples and oranges.

 

[sausage]

He’s great. I agree with so much of what he says. I can’t see him doing well as manager though. He can’t manage modern players. Like apples and oranges.

He seemed to be quite intelligent and reflective of his previous efforts, though, which bodes well.

If he ends up at Sunderland then he'll have someone like Defoe - a model professional - to work with, which will suit him. It's all about getting the right players in that suit what he seems to want (that is, players who want to work their way out of League 1, rather than players who think they deserve to be somewhere better).

 

[riggi]

He seemed to be quite intelligent and reflective of his previous efforts, though, which bodes well.

If he ends up at Sunderland then he'll have someone like Defoe - a model professional - to work with, which will suit him. It's all about getting the right players in that suit what he seems to want (that is, players who want to work their way out of League 1, rather than players who think they deserve to be somewhere better).

This is the thing. Him being demanding is just wanting the basics of being a professional. I think with the right group of players who have the right mentality, he might do ok.

 

[sausage]