Sissoko - Central Midfield Powerhouse or Strong Wideman?

[widmerpool]

No need to be mean. Trot along eh?

Sorry, didn't mean to stirrup any bad feeling.

 

[dondo]

France haven't stopped playing him there, they swap him around between CM and the AM spots, in fact he apparently played CM when he came on yesterday but Italy.

Dembele, Mason and Bentaleb aren't DMs yet played in CM for us. Even Alli has played CM and certainly isn't a DM.

https://cdn0.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/6O...sset/file/6936777/tottenham influence map.png


http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/03575/spurs-position_3575070a.jpg

 

[spurs9]

Dembele, mason, benteleb or whoever play in pochettino cm are primary Dms even if it didn't/doesn't come naturally to them.
I've been looking for a heat map of average positions of the dier/dembele partnership of last season to try to prove or disprove my point but I am struggling to find one

Last season Dier was the only CM to play DM and he occasionally slotted into the back 3. His role was different than his CM partner's.

 

[spurs9]

https://cdn0.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/6Ov3M9OnNcYGMYg5HBi_OW2S33c=/400x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/6936777/tottenham influence map.png


http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/03575/spurs-position_3575070a.jpg

What does that prove?

 

[dondo]

What does that prove?

That we play with 2 defensive midfielders, one deeper dropping into a back 3 when the fullbacks push on.
Sissoko imo will not be played in this position as he is not a defensive player

 

[spurs9]

That we play with 2 defensive midfielders, one deeper dropping into a back 3 when the fullbacks push on.
Sissoko imo will not be played in this position as he is not a defensive player

It didn't prove that. Alli is not a defensive player but we played him there, ditto for Mason and Bentaleb.

 

[dondo]

It didn't prove that. Alli is not a defensive player but we played him there, ditto for Mason and Bentaleb.

It shows average positions of our 3 best cms and only the cbs play deeper, so if that doesn't prove we play with 2 Dms I don't know what to say.
How many games has alli play in cm from the start? He only played there vs pool when we were chasing the game on Saturday.
I'm not saying benteleb and mason are defensive players as such but when they played in cm for poch they did the job asked of them.

 

[spurs9]

It shows average positions of our 3 best cms and only the cbs play deeper, so if that doesn't prove we play with 2 Dms I don't know what to say.
How many games has alli play in cm from the start? He only played there vs pool when we were chasing the game on Saturday.
I'm not saying benteleb and mason are defensive players as such but when they played in cm for poch they did the job asked of them.

First pick was of Dier and Wanyama both of whom are DMs. Second pick is of 1 game, average positions usually just show when they touched the ball, which could just mean Dembele drops back to show for the ball more (something Dier has been accused of not doing enough). Also if that proves Dembele is a DM, then it must also prove Kane isnt a striker as it shows him further back than Eriksen and Son.

Edit: Alli has started 9 games in CM, we won 6 of those and drew 3.

 

[DJS]

His best position to me looks wide right so will be interesting to see how this plays out...

Could be a case of completion for Lamela as Ndokou will be pushing for starts wide left.

Very exciting though as we have an abundance of talent for that attacking three now whereas before we were a little light.

And it will give Eriksen a kick up the arse too as he'll have to consistently play as he can to keep a place as will Lamela (either could also go central although Eriksen always seems better on left of the attacking trio).

I love wide pacey bastards myself

 

[beats1]

France haven't stopped playing him there, they swap him around between CM and the AM spots, in fact he apparently played CM when he came on yesterday but Italy.

Dembele, Mason and Bentaleb aren't DMs yet played in CM for us. Even Alli has played CM and certainly isn't a DM.

He played two times for France there during the Euro's and was poor then he got moved to RM not AM

Plus the move from AM to CM is harder than CB to DM(unless you're a slow fucker)

Not to mention Dier was 20/21 when he moved not 27

Also I dont understand your point about Mason/Dembele/Bentaleb. All three before moving to our first team were CM's in a 2 man CM/DM. Mason for Swindon, Bentaleb for the U21's and Dembele for Fulham.

 

[spurs9]

He played two times for France there during the Euro's and was poor then he got moved to RM not AM

Plus the move from AM to CM is harder than CB to DM(unless you're a slow basterd)

Not to mention Dier was 20/21 when he moved not 27

Also I dont understand your point about Mason/Dembele/Bentaleb. All three before moving to our first team were CM's in a 2 man CM/DM. Mason for Swindon, Bentaleb for the U21's and Dembele for Fulham.

I said the AM spots, meaning either AM RW or LW. France constantly swap him between CM and the AM spots and he has played CM for France since the Euros (v Italy after he came on as sub).

Sissoko has played CM before, it is not something new to him, so I don't know what being 27 has to do with it.

My point about Mason, Bentaleb and Dembele was in response to the poster's claim that Poch only plays DMs and my point was these 3 aren't DMs.

 

[Spurs1960]

He would be a wizard if he did.

Every manager has to sell his vision to each player and tell him how he sees his future so to suggets he has no idea how he will use him is plain stupid.

We approached Newcastle before the last day and we will certainly have spoken to his representatives. Pochettinio as is frequently reported rings targets and has a chat with them. Do you seriously think Pochettino tells Daniel levy to buy a payer and hasn't a clue what he's going to do with him.

I think the negativity thread was written for you.

 

[LexingtonSpurs]

Poch was using Dembele in the AM3 - before moving him to the CM2. Dier was a CB and RB before moving to the CM2.

I don't think Poch cares where you played in the past - if you have the right attributes to play the position.

Having said that, I have no idea where Poch sees Sissoko. I don't see him as similar to Mane or Zaha - which is what one report claims Poch was looking for when he wanted to sign Sissoko - so I am dubious about that report - and how that reporter connected the dots. He has pace, but he is not the kind of player to sit on a defenders shoulder, and chase down through balls - imo. I see him as a player who can transition the ball quickly from back to front, and who can help shield the ball with his size. So - I think he will play in the central MF - attacking role.

Also, he is predominantly right-footed - so I don't think he will play on the right in the AM3 - Poch will still want players to cut in from the outside onto their strong foot. Walker will remain on the outside, so a wide right player becomes redundant. So, if he plays in the AM positions, I think he will either play behind the striker, or on the left.

 

[EQP]

From the :57 mark the video shows sissoko vs spurs. What he does well is draw players out of position, if he starts releasing the ball quicker he'll make life hard for opposing teams. Also the vid highlights his runs from deep and his ability to ride a tackle.

 

[beats1]

I said the AM spots, meaning either AM RW or LW. France constantly swap him between CM and the AM spots and he has played CM for France since the Euros (v Italy after he came on as sub).

Sissoko has played CM before, it is not something new to him, so I don't know what being 27 has to do with it.

My point about Mason, Bentaleb and Dembele was in response to the poster's claim that Poch only plays DMs and my point was these 3 aren't DMs.

Yea but he was playing out wide replacing Greizmann

Sissoko has played CM before he hasnt done well there

Also I disagree there isn't much difference between CM/DM in Poch's system. They may not be holders but they have played that position

Poch was using Dembele in the AM3 - before moving him to the CM2. Dier was a CB and RB before moving to the CM2.

I don't think Poch cares where you played in the past - if you have the right attributes to play the position.

Having said that, I have no idea where Poch sees Sissoko. I don't see him as similar to Mane or Zaha - which is what one report claims Poch was looking for when he wanted to sign Sissoko - so I am dubious about that report - and how that reporter connected the dots. He has pace, but he is not the kind of player to sit on a defenders shoulder, and chase down through balls - imo. I see him as a player who can transition the ball quickly from back to front, and who can help shield the ball with his size. So - I think he will play in the central MF - attacking role.

Also, he is predominantly right-footed - so I don't think he will play on the right in the AM3 - Poch will still want players to cut in from the outside onto their strong foot. Walker will remain on the outside, so a wide right player becomes redundant. So, if he plays in the AM positions, I think he will either play behind the striker, or on the left.

Dembele was a CM who was moved further forward and never played great and he was used as a more Defensive AM. Dier has played DM before and moving to DM isn't that hard from RB/CB like King

The thing is Sissoko has never been a player to carry the ball from the back forward. If you watch his Euro highlights his best bits are from the right of the AM 3. He isn't a a winger. He isn't a player to sit on a defenders shoulder but he does try and run at defenders

 

[dondo]

QUOTE="spurs9, post: 5187233, member: 24169"]I said the AM spots, meaning either AM RW or LW. France constantly swap him between CM and the AM spots and he has played CM for France since the Euros (v Italy after he came on as sub).

Sissoko has played CM before, it is not something new to him, so I don't know what being 27 has to do with it.

My point about Mason, Bentaleb and Dembele was in response to the poster's claim that Poch only plays DMs and my point was these 3 aren't DMs.[/QUOTE]


My point regarding this was although mason and benteleb are not natural Dms that's where poch played them.
When benteleb and mason were the1st choice pairing did we play with no defensive midfielders?
Dembele has generally been a defensive midfielder since he joined us

 

[yankspurs]

Sissoko being a strong wideman is something that baffles me, tbh. What need do we have for someone like that? Poch will almost surely primarily use him as cover for Dembele, IMO. Which is what partly makes that 30m fee extreme. 30m for someone who will not be in the first XI is nuts.

 

[Tottenham_God]

Sissoko being a strong wideman is something that baffles me, tbh. What need do we have for someone like that? Poch will almost surely primarily use him as cover for Dembele, IMO. Which is what partly makes that 30m fee extreme. 30m for someone who will not be in the first XI is nuts.

What do you mean what need do we have ? Maybe the need to create and score goals, confuse teams in regards to which team selection we will choose, maybe a different tact to Lamela or Son .. number of reasons.

The fact that he can slot into CM or CAM if need be only increases his value.

 

[rossdapep]

If Poch is open to the idea, we may see him used as part of a CM 3, operating as the more advanced CM given free roam to drive forward with the ball. That would require a flexible 4-3-2-1, not sure if Poch would ever play that but I guess it is an option he would have at his disposal

 

[robin09]

His physical attributes make him look more like an up and down CM to me. But then I also like his ability to float in crosses. It will be interesting to see how Poch coaches him, and how he looks by the end of the season.