The Daily ITK Discussion Thread - 23rd June 2015

raggy said:

I'm mainly referring back to the pro-zone scouting video that's being talked about a lot round here. According to them in that Kramer and Imbula are in a class of two who were way way better than everybody else at creating options when they have the ball. People seem to have skipped just how highly he was spoken about in that video. According to them we will get better options with Imbula in the team than Schneiderlin.

I honestly think Imbula is getting tarred a little too much with the Zakora and Dembele brush. He's clearly very highly rated with these scouts.

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raggy said:

On the other hand I watched that pro-zone video as well and Imbula came out looking like the second best player according to their measurements, better then a lot of players he was being compared with including Bentaleb and Schneiderlin. Both Kramer and Imbula stood out for the options their teams gained while they were on the ball. He came out of the video seeming like a great player to me...

I'm in camp Kramer if given the choice like most others, but I'm far less negative about Imbula then most seem to be.

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dk-yid said:

He came out strong and surely second in that lot - no doubt - but the conclusion is that they bring vastly different things to the team and that is for me what does not compute. If we are to believe that we are using Mitchell to apply a better more targeted recruitment to address the needs we have, then why are we looking at two players with different profiles to address these.


IF we believe that our defense needs support then look at such a profile... IF we believe that we can solve our problems through a greater attacking fluidity and ball retention then look for that. Regardless, If we have a round hole then we need to be looking for only round pegs ..

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mikeeegreen said:

I'm only going by what I've seen. If he was to join I'd love to be proved wrong, honestly I would. He just seems like the wrong player for such a key position. We always get this wrong, and I think this is a massive reason to why we always fall short.

It's why I always say to anyone that given the choice, I'd take Modric back over Bale any day of the week.

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dk-yid said:

Yes, I agree. But I wouldn't mind both.

Is that being greedy?

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spursfan77 said:

First out of the window!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/33238538

Jordan Archer to Milwall

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dk-yid said:

Thanks Dov.

From watching the Prozone vids (recommended for all) I still cannot fathom why it seems like a choice between these two since they are vastly different in what they bring to a team. Now I am not claiming to having watched them in any detail bit the analysis on Kramer is that he is so much more productive than Imbula because he makes more space through his hold up play than Imbula and creates momentum for the front four through his ability to retain the ball under pressure. Basically he makes our attackers better through his play. Imbula is more or less the opposite despite being great at coping under pressure but does not create attacking momentum unless carrying it forward - and would therefore stifle our already over-stifled and ponderous play.

Definitely Team Kramer for me.

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dk-yid said:

Thanks Dov.

From watching the Prozone vids (recommended for all) I still cannot fathom why it seems like a choice between these two since they are vastly different in what they bring to a team. Now I am not claiming to having watched them in any detail bit the analysis on Kramer is that he is so much more productive than Imbula because he makes more space through his hold up play than Imbula and creates momentum for the front four through his ability to retain the ball under pressure. Basically he makes our attackers better through his play. Imbula is more or less the opposite despite being great at coping under pressure but does not create attacking momentum unless carrying it forward - and would therefore stifle our already over-stifled and ponderous play.

Definitely Team Kramer for me.

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spursfan77 said:

First out of the window!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/33238538

Jordan Archer to Milwall

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mikeeegreen said:

He isn't really a defensive player though. Very much box to box, which is what we are looking for. I have just been so underwhelmed when I've seen footage of him, reminds me of another Dembele. Like I said, I'd loved to be proved wrong if he was to join, but I find it very uninspiring that he is the one we are closest too. If the rumours of interest in him are true, then what on earth are our transfer team doing? He doesn't seem like MS in the slightest to me.

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Gbspurs said:

Decent move for him.

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WiganSpur said:

Whilst I agree, I would definitely rather Imbula than no one. He is still better than what we have, and has great scope for improvement at 22..

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WiganSpur said:

Whilst I agree, I would definitely rather Imbula than no one. He is still better than what we have, and has great scope for improvement at 22.

But again, if we signed Imbula then it would really make you question why we aren't going 4-3-3 anytime soon. It's perfect for our team bar one player in Eriksen who still wouldn't be in that unfamiliar of a position on the left.

Undoubtedly though for me Kramer or MS would probably be our best buy since Lloris.

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mikeeegreen said:

He isn't really a defensive player though. Very much box to box, which is what we are looking for. I have just been so underwhelmed when I've seen footage of him, reminds me of another Dembele. Like I said, I'd loved to be proved wrong if he was to join, but I find it very uninspiring that he is the one we are closest too. If the rumours of interest in him are true, then what on earth are our transfer team doing? He doesn't seem like MS in the slightest to me.

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WiganSpur said:

Although it's highly unlikely perhaps if we can't get the right midfielders then Pochettino will adapt the system accordingly to 3 man midfield, hence bringing in Imbula? Suddenly it would accommodate the likes of Paulinho, Mason, Stambouli etc and could perhaps compensate for our lack of complete midfielders.

Don't really want to get into formation discussion but it is interesting why we're targeting Imbula as an alternative to MS and Kramer. Why not Song, Illarramendi, Geis, Bender, Carvalho, Nainggolan etc?

As I said looking at his history of tactical line ups it's unlikely, but he did have the luxury of the right midfielders in Schneiderlin and Wanyama at Southampton.

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dk-yid said:

He came out strong and surely second in that lot - no doubt - but the conclusion is that they bring vastly different things to the team and that is for me what does not compute. If we are to believe that we are using Mitchell to apply a better more targeted recruitment to address the needs we have, then why are we looking at two players with different profiles to address these.


IF we believe that our defense needs support then look at such a profile... IF we believe that we can solve our problems through a greater attacking fluidity and ball retention then look for that. Regardless, If we have a round hole then we need to be looking for only round pegs ..

Click to expand...

WiganSpur said:

Whilst I agree, I would definitely rather Imbula than no one. He is still better than what we have, and has great scope for improvement at 22.

But again, if we signed Imbula then it would really make you question why we aren't going 4-3-3 anytime soon. It's perfect for our team bar one player in Eriksen who still wouldn't be in that unfamiliar of a position on the left.

Undoubtedly though for me Kramer or MS would probably be our best buy since Lloris.

Click to expand...