- May 19, 2015
- 2,608
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Lol what? How? Why don't Winks' excellent performances earlier in the season count?...today proved once and for all that Sissoko is a far better footballer than Winks...
...far better...
COYS
Lol what? How? Why don't Winks' excellent performances earlier in the season count?...today proved once and for all that Sissoko is a far better footballer than Winks...
...far better...
COYS
Trippier’s defending prevented them going a goal or 2 ahead before their first. The goal came through the middle after the ball had been lost by Winks well ahead of Trippier.That wasn't easy at all.
Trippier can't defend his positioning for their first goal was shocking.
I don't know what has happened to Harry Winks. If he's not careful he will end up as the new Vinny Samways aka sideways .
Llorente needs a goal.
Moura looks quality very composed .
Danny Rose needs a succession of games to really get back to his true level.
On paper that starting 11 should easily beat a team from the bottom of League One but games are not won on paper.
If you pick a team consisting of 3 reserves(Vorm, Foyth and Liorrente) with very little playing time, 4 players(Toby, Rose Victor and Winks) returning from long term(ish) injuries and one recently signed player(Moura) who had very little playing time at his previous club then you are going to have a team that is not fully match fit and will have very little rhythm from never playing together regularly. Teams are made up of little partnerships (the 2 CBs, a CB and his FB, the midfield 2,the No. 9 and the No. 10 etc). The players in today's line up have not had enough playing time together to form these partnerships. Regardless that the opposition is a weaker team they play together regularly and are at home in front of their biggest crowd of the season in their Cup Final and so are going to be up for it. Why is it a surprise we struggle. Why did Poch not learn that lesson from the Newport game away. We've now added 2 unnecessary extra games to a crowded fixture list. It's always better to start with a strong first 11, get the job done early and then rest important players.
Having said all that I thought Moura was our best player who will improve us going forward. Not enough of the riches from the game peculate down to the lower leagues so I'm happy to see a team like Rochdale earn the money from both a televised game and a replay at Wembley.
Sometimes I feel like you're a computer program suffering a Windows Blue Screen of Death, where many lines of code flash up but only the odd phrase makes sense to the majority of humans....today proved once and for all that Sissoko is a far better footballer than Winks...
...far better...
COYS
Honestly, this thread continues to blow my mind. I really wish people would grow up a bit.
Not much credit for Rochdale, no appreciation for how difficult cup ties can be and just massive overreactions to some performances.
Obviously we're expected to beat them but we have no divine right and the reason they show these ties live on tv is because they often go this way. You'd think our fan base would learn something from the last round but apparently not. Rochdale upped their level and matched us and they deserve huge credit for that. The pitch may have been new but it was still very bobbly and cutting up a lot with Toby losing his footing twice early on. It can't be easy for our lads playing at small, hostile grounds like that I would bet that if you asked them they would all say it's a more comfortable experience playing away at Man Utd, Chelsea, Liverpool etc than it is away to Newport and Rochdale. I know I'd hate it if I were them.
As usual Sissoko gets the bulk of the blame. Nonsense. He did fine, his 1st touch is clearly something he has to work on but he largely did well, his passing was tidy, he made driving runs through midfield and laid on the assist for Moura. Fans going after him is just indicative of a fan base desperately searching for a scapegoat.
Llorente is the next one to get an unnecessary bashing. Clearly he's lacking confidence and struggling to score but his overall hold up play was good and to say otherwise would be lying. We also still don't play to his strengths and he's a victim of our system in that regard. He was far better yesterday than he was in the first tie against Newport. He linked play effeftively and had Son been on his game then he'd have an assist or two.
Not gonna do ratings cos in all honesty it's really not worth getting your knickers in a twist over this type of game when we've rotated all 11 spots and we know the team would lack chemistry.
Some observations:
I thought Toby really struggled. For their 2nd goal he didn't seem to get off the floor when he "jumped". Had he done what he is capable of then I think he heads towards the edge of the box rather than glancing it on to their player at the back post.
Equally Winks looked lively but he didn't not his usual self still and it was his mistake that led to them breaking on us and scoring their 1st goal. Needs consistent minutes to re-establish his form. Don't expect him to get many starts in remainder of season.
Danny Rose seriously needs to work on his final ball. The work rate is there but he's still rusty and when he hits a cross it reminds me of how much more valuable Davies is at this stage.
Obviously Lucas was the shining light. His energy and effort were 1st class. He took his goal superbly well and could be the game changer that we've needed for a few seasons.
And the fact that we've not been able to give Onomah a single minute, even in pre season as a CM,
I think this is a good, considered post and makes plenty of rational and sensible points. Putting out completely changed 11, with a mature of reserves, squad and recovering players, away at an unusual scenario, against a team with absolutely nothing to lose will always likely result in disjointed football.
But I do disagree with the Sissoko stuff. Running across a bit of open pitch a couple of times is not "making driving runs". And he is 28yo, it's a bit late to be working on his first touch don't you think ? And what is the point of having "tidy" passing if you are an attacking midfielder ?If all a defensive midfielder does is pass two yards to the guy net to him even that would be worthy of some criticism at this level of football.
I've criticised Winks for being too cautious and insipid and he's playing in a CM2. Sissoko is cautious and insipid even when he's playing as an attacking player in a more forward remit.
I really don't think this is about scapegoating in SIssoko's case. Negative opinion on his performances is so overwhelming from diverse quarters - both on here and in the football media.
I can understand people criticising others using abusive language towards him, but I really don't understand people defending his performance levels.
Even when Onomah was played completely out of position as an ARM, his performances we no less awkward or lacking in endeavour as Sissoko's have been, and that\s his better position.
And the fact that we've not been able to give Onomah a single minute, even in pre season as a CM, but have given plenty to Sissoko is bordering on tragic. There is not way, even the complete novice could be any more insipid and lacking in intelligence or diligence than Sissoko is, certainly not after the first half dozen games anyway.
My worry is everyone will see the replay as just that, the chance for this rusty 11 to get more minutes under their belts. If this is true and we start with the same 11 we could easily come unstuck against a very well drilled, fit and young Rochdale team playing at Wembley on the Telly for maybe the first and last time for many! This is the biggest game of their career!How can we play so well against Juve and then play like that against Rochdale?
simple......play a totally different line up...whats the drama?
I am not really surprised,angry or throwing myself off the nearest bridge, this was always going to happen , it was the biggest game of their history and probably the smallest in ours, so how do you really get our 2nd string really up for that?
Lets move on ,the extra game will come in handy for those rusty starters yesterday.
I dont disagree with you BC and it's a very fair point regarding Onomah. Watching Sissoko play does beg the question, couldn't Onomah have done this? I don't know what the answer is to that and Poch is the only man that can explain it. Maybe he just doesn't rate the kid? A lot of us can see Josh's potential but Poch may just not be a fan. I doubt it, but it's possible. Hopefully he comes back in the summer and we see more of him next season.
I guess the reason I've given Sissoko more praise than he may deserve is as much to do with being fed up with him just getting panned every week even when he's not been that bad. Trust me, I recognise that he's not good enough for this team but I just don't believe in constantly criticising him. He's shown some good things and he provided an assist when nobody else in the team was doing it so that should be recognised and not ignored just to suit this repititive agenda that many fans have. I think it's reached the stage now where people are hammering him and they probably haven't even watched the game, it's just become the thing to do and that's just not on.
I dont disagree with you BC and it's a very fair point regarding Onomah. Watching Sissoko play does beg the question, couldn't Onomah have done this? I don't know what the answer is to that and Poch is the only man that can explain it. Maybe he just doesn't rate the kid? A lot of us can see Josh's potential but Poch may just not be a fan. I doubt it, but it's possible. Hopefully he comes back in the summer and we see more of him next season.
I guess the reason I've given Sissoko more praise than he may deserve is as much to do with being fed up with him just getting panned every week even when he's not been that bad. Trust me, I recognise that he's not good enough for this team but I just don't believe in constantly criticising him. He's shown some good things and he provided an assist when nobody else in the team was doing it so that should be recognised and not ignored just to suit this repititive agenda that many fans have. I think it's reached the stage now where people are hammering him and they probably haven't even watched the game, it's just become the thing to do and that's just not on.
If he continues to commit the same errors every week
he will get criticised every week.
Your last point is just silly.
and giving a player, any player,
more praise than they deserve to even up the criticism
is very misleading.
You got it right here: ''Trust me, I recognise that he's not good enough for this team ''
I hope he stars against Juventus or whoever
and scores a hatrick and wins the game.
Then let the love-in begin and i will be leading the praise.
Nobody wants a Spurs player to fail.
Nose, face?.
I think this is a good, considered post and makes plenty of rational and sensible points. Putting out completely changed 11, with a mature of reserves, squad and recovering players, away at an unusual scenario, against a team with absolutely nothing to lose will always likely result in disjointed football.
But I do disagree with the Sissoko stuff. Running across a bit of open pitch a couple of times is not "making driving runs". And he is 28yo, it's a bit late to be working on his first touch don't you think ? And what is the point of having "tidy" passing if you are an attacking midfielder ?If all a defensive midfielder does is pass two yards to the guy next to him even that would be worthy of some criticism at this level of football.
I've criticised Winks for being too cautious and insipid and he's playing in a CM2. Sissoko is cautious and insipid even when he's playing as an attacking player in a more forward remit.
I really don't think this is about scapegoating in SIssoko's case. Negative opinion on his performances is so overwhelming from diverse quarters - both on here and in the football media.
I can understand people criticising others using abusive language towards him, but I really don't understand people defending his performance levels.
Even when Onomah was played completely out of position as an ARM, his performances we no less awkward or lacking in endeavour as Sissoko's have been, and that\s his better position.
And the fact that we've not been able to give Onomah a single minute, even in pre season as a CM, but have given plenty to Sissoko is bordering on tragic. There is no way, even the complete novice could be any more insipid and lacking in intelligence or diligence than Sissoko is, certainly not after the first half dozen games anyway.
Iv'e Not seen Onomah play recently for villa. But he was lambasted by their fans for their last game against Preston North. By all accounts very lazy by not tracking back etc.
How the fuck SIssoko is getting time in this team is anyone's fucking guess. Yes, he made the pass for the first goal, but that only put his account half back in the black for their two goals. His touch is terrible, his movement off the ball and the positions he takes up are atrocious. I am absolutely convinced this is about money and not football, because I do not understand how this fella gets anywhere near it.
Pochettino could see that they were outnumbering us in midfield but did nothing. Or maybe he hoped Sissoko would drop in and help. LO fucking L.
I was disappointed generally by Winks first half. And to be honest, I've always tempered praise for Winks, because I do have some general reservations about the kid (I've never believed his ceiling was what Onomah's could be for example, even if Wink's busy baseline could be higher some days) but he was very much not solely to blame for the first goal. Just watch what Sissoko does. Sees Winks desperately looking for an out ball, sees Trippier is marked on the touchline and instead of just taking two paces and offering himself inside, jogs to the one place Winks can't find him. It just sums up the effect Sissoko has on our football. Winks now has no choice at all, no options, he tries to turn inside and gets striped.
And just as Winks was actually starting to show a bit of enterprise and ambition second half, Pochettino takes him off and sticks Sissoko back into CM. It was a fuctardially stupid thing to do, because whatever Winks's deficiencies are, there is absolutely nothing Sissoko is going to do any better, he isn't going to pass the ball an better or more often, he certainly isn't going to show for the ball any more. And as we saw for their equaliser, he isn't going to press or win the ball any better either. He's just going to stand there and fucking point their player the direction of the penalty box.
Son deserves special mention too. Jesus this boy can fuck about on his day. I thought he'd put this kind of slapdash bollocks behind him, but this was vintage. Couldn't control the fucking thing, couldn't pass the fucking two yards, couldn't play simple through balls. How the fuck him and the other (above mentioned) fucking chuckle brother stay on that pitch 90 minutes is a mystery to me.
I'm not really sure why Wanyama is getting any stick. He got caught on the ball once, but that was because unlike some other ****s he was one of the only ones showing up for it despite getting pressed. And then he got a back header a bit wrong, but apart from that he was one of the few to keep trying too play, showing up for the ball (along with Moura) when other wankers were scurrying out of reach as best they could. He was also up against three CM's on is own for much of the game (up against four after Poch moved Sissoko) back into our midfield. I thought Wanyama and Moura were the only two to come out of this with much credit at all. Foyth was decent with the ball but his defending doesn't always fill me with glee. Only Foyth saw more ball than Wanyama - who saw twice as much as anyone else ahead of the defenders.
People also seem to forget the fucking dogs dinner Dembele and Dier made of Newport, at least we actually played some football and created some chances today, against a better side than Newport.
Trippier's had better days but did make a course le of vital blocks, and at least he tried, which Rose only did for the last half hour, which was half hour more than Alderweireld managed to look like he cared.
Oh, and I forgot about Llorente. Easily done.
So just to be clear, Sissoko isn't my scapegoat. Pochettino is. His rotation is all or nothing. His selections were poorly thought out. We seemed ill prepared again early on, and he didn't react to what was happening, we don't press teams like this for some reason, his (first two) subs were fucking incomprehensible, and he picked Sissoko and compounded this by leaving him and Son on the pitch and taking off Winks and Moura.