ENIC...

[longtimespur]

This won’t be music to the ears of sum. In a letter from Daniel levy personally to the council regarding high road west objection.

“ unlike any developer, we are not here to develop take a profit and leave. We are here for the long term, this is our home “

Now you can say this is hot air. But we are talking about a scheme that’s not gonna be finished for 5 years at the earliest probably 10 years. So like he says if they have intentions to leave why bother objecting so strongly to the scheme, which may not be perfect. But it’s not exactly disastrous to the point it would effect the value of a sale. Just doesn’t meet Levy’s vision.

Here's the article it was taken from:-

MSN

Hope it hasn't been posted already but I couldn't find it
Football London

 

[Wine Gum]

Here's the article it was taken from:-

MSN

Hope it hasn't been posted already but I couldn't find it
Football London

This is the full letter Levy sent that caused the planning decision to be pulled.

 

[dovahkiin]

Just 4% of Man United fans back the Glazers - the worst rating in the Premier League - as our poll finds Man City's Sheikh Mansour the 'most damaging'... but where does your owner rank?​

• Survey was taken by more than 100,000 fans of the 20 Premier League clubs
• 
  Tottenham - 76.3%
  Owner: ENIC, majority owned by Joe Lewis, 85, British
  In control since: 2007
  Average league position: 5.2
  Ave league position in five years before: 8.6
  Ave net transfer spend: £22.7m
  Ave wage bill: £138.5m
  Net debt: £728m
  Controversies: Spurs involvement in European Super League (2021)
  Achievements: 1 League Cup, new stadium
  Consensus fan view: ‘Improvement in the infrastructure and not using helicopter money to do so. Upgrading the stadium and training ground without sacrificing what the club is; ENIC have taken us from outside the elite to in it.’
  Detractor view: ‘Too much emphasis on business growth rather than winning trophies. Sacking a manager before a final for example; neglect of the footballing and scouting parts of the club.’

United's Glazers sink to a new low with only 4% of fans backing them

NICK HARRIS: In a survey of more than 100,000 fans of the 20 Premier League clubs, the Glazers attracted the least support of any set of owners.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[sausage]

Average league position: 5.2
Ave league position in five years before: 8.6

There's a subtle understatement in here, too - the 5 years before didn't include the Abramovich Chelsea, or the Shinawatra/Abu Dhabi Man City. Granted, Chelsea were generally finishing above us beforehand, but City were just being promoted from the equivalent of League One at the time ENIC came in, so they have effectively - over time - pushed every club's average finish down around 1 place.

 

[Delboy75]

Not sure where else to put this. Not listened yet but might hold some interest interview with Todd Kline.

 

[Albertbarich]

I think/wish we as fans would agree to acknowledge that there is a world of difference to greedy businessman ( glaziers) to state ownership, especially when the states have the records of certain ones involved in English football.

The replies on twitter were so depressing, in between the deluded Newcastle fan replies, too many aren't seeing this as an opportunity to really rid football of sportswashing.

Look at the data collected though and its clear that the rest of the league would happily be rid of Chelsea, Newcastle and man City . Nobody would miss them or their owners.

Until our government get out of these peoples pockets though we have no chance of real action being taken.

 

[Delboy75]

Not sure where else to put this. Not listened yet but might hold some interest interview with Todd Kline.

Literally not a word about spurs which is a bit odd. He’s definitely still at the club as it’s on his Twitter that he used yesterday. The tweet even mentions he’s at Spurs. Anyway still quite interesting if you have an interest in business. He sounds incredibly impressive and certainly knows his onions. I’m sure he’s proving a great asset to us commercially even if he hasn’t got the big one over the line yet.

 

[cookiemonster]

Just 4% of Man United fans back the Glazers - the worst rating in the Premier League - as our poll finds Man City's Sheikh Mansour the 'most damaging'... but where does your owner rank?​

• Survey was taken by more than 100,000 fans of the 20 Premier League clubs
• 
  Tottenham - 76.3%
  Owner: ENIC, majority owned by Joe Lewis, 85, British
  In control since: 2007
  Average league position: 5.2
  Ave league position in five years before: 8.6
  Ave net transfer spend: £22.7m
  Ave wage bill: £138.5m
  Net debt: £728m
  Controversies: Spurs involvement in European Super League (2021)
  Achievements: 1 League Cup, new stadium
  Consensus fan view: ‘Improvement in the infrastructure and not using helicopter money to do so. Upgrading the stadium and training ground without sacrificing what the club is; ENIC have taken us from outside the elite to in it.’
  Detractor view: ‘Too much emphasis on business growth rather than winning trophies. Sacking a manager before a final for example; neglect of the footballing and scouting parts of the club.’

United's Glazers sink to a new low with only 4% of fans backing them

NICK HARRIS: In a survey of more than 100,000 fans of the 20 Premier League clubs, the Glazers attracted the least support of any set of owners.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Tells me Manure fans demand trophies while ours do not

 

[southlondonyiddo]

Just 4% of Man United fans back the Glazers - the worst rating in the Premier League - as our poll finds Man City's Sheikh Mansour the 'most damaging'... but where does your owner rank?​

• Survey was taken by more than 100,000 fans of the 20 Premier League clubs
• 
  Tottenham - 76.3%
  Owner: ENIC, majority owned by Joe Lewis, 85, British
  In control since: 2007
  Average league position: 5.2
  Ave league position in five years before: 8.6
  Ave net transfer spend: £22.7m
  Ave wage bill: £138.5m
  Net debt: £728m
  Controversies: Spurs involvement in European Super League (2021)
  Achievements: 1 League Cup, new stadium
  Consensus fan view: ‘Improvement in the infrastructure and not using helicopter money to do so. Upgrading the stadium and training ground without sacrificing what the club is; ENIC have taken us from outside the elite to in it.’
  Detractor view: ‘Too much emphasis on business growth rather than winning trophies. Sacking a manager before a final for example; neglect of the footballing and scouting parts of the club.’

United's Glazers sink to a new low with only 4% of fans backing them

NICK HARRIS: In a survey of more than 100,000 fans of the 20 Premier League clubs, the Glazers attracted the least support of any set of owners.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Took control of the club in 2007!

Yeah ok

 

[sausage]

Took control of the club in 2007!

Yeah ok

ENIC only bought 27% from Sugar in 2001. Sugar still owned 12% until 2007, which effectively made ENIC majority shareholders, but not necessarily in full control I think - possibly semantics with a hint of "technically..."

I don't quite know how much was owned over time, but there's still around 15% they don't own.

 

[DogsOfWar]

Tells me Manure fans demand trophies while ours do not

No, the takeaway from this survey is fans want improvement.
United's fans (and Arsenal) recognise their owners have taken them backwards whereas ours recognise Enic have taken us forward.

Brentford, Villa, Leeds, Palace etc haven't won a thing but their fans recognise their owners have taken them forward.

 

[Delboy75]

Had an interesting chat with someone yesterday who said don’t rule out Joe lewis selling Tavistock lock stock and barrel. When you think about his age it almost makes more sense than just selling Spurs. Apparently he’s very friendly with the owner at Blackstone and they’ve had conversations. Sort of thing that if it happened you could see levy still keeping his share and staying in charge.

 

[Aay_Jay_Dee]

Had an interesting chat with someone yesterday who said don’t rule out Joe lewis selling Tavistock lock stock and barrel. When you think about his age it almost makes more sense than just selling Spurs. Apparently he’s very friendly with the owner at Blackstone and they’ve had conversations. Sort of thing that if it happened you could see levy still keeping his share and staying in charge.

Would probably mean one owner with no interest in us to another.

 

[arthurgrimsdell]

Had an interesting chat with someone yesterday who said don’t rule out Joe lewis selling Tavistock lock stock and barrel. When you think about his age it almost makes more sense than just selling Spurs. Apparently he’s very friendly with the owner at Blackstone and they’ve had conversations. Sort of thing that if it happened you could see levy still keeping his share and staying in charge.

I have always had difficulty with understanding the Tavistock Group's role, if any, in the legal ownership of Tottenham Hotspur.
If you look at the Annual Accounts of Tottenham Hotspur Plc and later Tottenham Hotspur Ltd since ENIC bought the club, Tavistcock Group is never mentioned. That is during a period of over two decades. The Ultimate Shareholders of the club are stated in the Annual Accounts as Enic Sports Inc, though there have been various different names over the years always including the name "ENIC".

In the Shareholder Information section of the club website, it states the following:

"Ultimate Ownership of the Club

Of the total issued share capital of Tottenham Hotspur Limited, ENIC Sports and Development Holdings Limited own 85.55%.

Mr D Levy and certain members of his family are potential beneficiaries of a discretionary trust which ultimately owns 29.4% of the share capital of ENIC Sports and Development Holdings Limited.

Mr J Lewis has an interest of 70.6% of ENIC Sports and Development Holdings Limited."

Again, no mention of Tavistock Group.

If you look at the website of The Tavistock Group, there is certainly mention of Tottenham Hotspur, but the Group itself is described as follows "Tavistock Group is an international private investment family office ", rather than a single legal entity. The website itself seems to be an umbrella promotion exercise for everything the Group ( Joe Lewis and his family and associates?) are involved in.
If you look at the careers section, the available positions all appear to be within self-contained companies rather than a holding company.
Tavistock Group does not appear to be designated as a company, merely as an " International Private Investment Organisation".

No accounts are to be found.

The idea that Joe Lewis is considering selling such an amorphous collection of part and whole investments with no legal connections to each other lock, stock and barrel seems to me to be a little far fetched, unless he's had a massive falling out with his family and associates. If and when he dies, which at 85 might not be far away, one would presume that such a clever and successful business man would have created a succession plan, and that, since he has a reputation as a hands off day-to-day operator, that this would mostly be in place already.

But I don't preclude the possibility that there is more to the situation than is readily apparent to someone like me.

​

 

[rajmak]

Wasn't sure of the right thread for this but without knowing great detail about the financials regarding THFC debts due to the stadium build I am hearing the interest on our loans is around £15m to £25m a year but if that is interest then I am guessing the actual debt is not reducing itself?

 

[Delboy75]

I have always had difficulty with understanding the Tavistock Group's role, if any, in the legal ownership of Tottenham Hotspur.
If you look at the Annual Accounts of Tottenham Hotspur Plc and later Tottenham Hotspur Ltd since ENIC bought the club, Tavistcock Group is never mentioned. That is during a period of over two decades. The Ultimate Shareholders of the club are stated in the Annual Accounts as Enic Sports Inc, though there have been various different names over the years always including the name "ENIC".

In the Shareholder Information section of the club website, it states the following:

"Ultimate Ownership of the Club

Of the total issued share capital of Tottenham Hotspur Limited, ENIC Sports and Development Holdings Limited own 85.55%.

Mr D Levy and certain members of his family are potential beneficiaries of a discretionary trust which ultimately owns 29.4% of the share capital of ENIC Sports and Development Holdings Limited.

Mr J Lewis has an interest of 70.6% of ENIC Sports and Development Holdings Limited."

Again, no mention of Tavistock Group.

If you look at the website of The Tavistock Group, there is certainly mention of Tottenham Hotspur, but the Group itself is described as follows "Tavistock Group is an international private investment family office ", rather than a single legal entity. The website itself seems to be an umbrella promotion exercise for everything the Group ( Joe Lewis and his family and associates?) are involved in.
If you look at the careers section, the available positions all appear to be within self-contained companies rather than a holding company.
Tavistock Group does not appear to be designated as a company, merely as an " International Private Investment Organisation".

No accounts are to be found.

The idea that Joe Lewis is considering selling such an amorphous collection of part and whole investments with no legal connections to each other lock, stock and barrel seems to me to be a little far fetched, unless he's had a massive falling out with his family and associates. If and when he dies, which at 85 might not be far away, one would presume that such a clever and successful business man would have created a succession plan, and that, since he has a reputation as a hands off day-to-day operator, that this would mostly be in place already.

But I don't preclude the possibility that there is more to the situation than is readily apparent to someone like me.

​

Not really sure where you’re coming from. I’ve not had time to look into company accounts. But The Tavistock development company is a real thing with a head office their name is all over the Lake Nona Bahamas developments. It’s not like they are some fictitious invisible shell company. As you say Tottenham Hotspur are clearly listed on all their websites. It’s not that mysterious Joe Lewis owns Tavistock who own ENIC.

Home | Tavistock Development Company

tavistockdevelopment.com

 

[arthurgrimsdell]

Not really sure where you’re coming from. I’ve not had time to look into company accounts. But The Tavistock development company is a real thing with a head office their name is all over the Lake Nona Bahamas developments. It’s not like they are some fictitious invisible shell company. As you say Tottenham Hotspur are clearly listed on all their websites. It’s not that mysterious Joe Lewis owns Tavistock who own ENIC.

Home | Tavistock Development Company

tavistockdevelopment.com

The Tavistock Development Company does not appear to be a holding company. It appears to be a a company that is involved in American and Caribbean Property Developments. There are various other companies mentioned within the Tavistock Group umbrella, as mentioned on the Tavistock Group website, some with the Tavistock name in them, others without, some possibly fully owned by Joe Lewis, others not. If The Tavistock Development Company is the holding company for all the interests of the the Tavistock Group, why is it not designated as such on the Tavistock Group Website? Where are the audited annual Accounts to verify its ownership credentials and why are they not referred to on that website? If it is the holding company for all Joe Lewis's interests, why is it not stated as the ultimate owner of Tottenham Hotspur Ltd in the Tottenham Hotspur Ltd Annual Accounts nor on the Shareholder Information section of the Tottenham Hotspur website? That it is not seems to strongly assert that the statement that Joe Lewis owns Tavistock who own ENIC is incorrect, and adds nothing to anyone's knowledge of the legailities of the situation.
My suspicion is that Tavistock Group is a red herring, and that what matters is not a promotional website, but the legal ownership of 70.6% of ENIC Sports Inc. by Joe Lewis as an individual, not by the Tavistock Group, and the remaining 29.4% which is owned by Daniel Levy and certain members of his family as potential beneficiaries of a discretionary trust. This is stated on the Tottenham Hotspur website and in the audited Annual Accounts of Tottenham Hotspur Plc.
I may be wrong, but you haven't provided any evidence as yet to show that.

 

[Delboy75]

The Tavistock Development Company does not appear to be a holding company. It appears to be a a company that is involved in American and Caribbean Property Developments. There are various other companies mentioned within the Tavistock Group umbrella, as mentioned on the Tavistock Group website, some with the Tavistock name in them, others without, some possibly fully owned by Joe Lewis, others not. If The Tavistock Development Company is the holding company for all the interests of the the Tavistock Group, why is it not designated as such on the Tavistock Group Website? Where are the audited annual Accounts to verify its ownership credentials and why are they not referred to on that website? If it is the holding company for all Joe Lewis's interests, why is it not stated as the ultimate owner of Tottenham Hotspur Ltd in the Tottenham Hotspur Ltd Annual Accounts nor on the Shareholder Information section of the Tottenham Hotspur website? That it is not seems to strongly assert that the statement that Joe Lewis owns Tavistock who own ENIC is incorrect, and adds nothing to anyone's knowledge of the legailities of the situation.
My suspicion is that Tavistock Group is a red herring, and that what matters is not a promotional website, but the legal ownership of 70.6% of ENIC Sports Inc. by Joe Lewis as an individual, not by the Tavistock Group, and the remaining 29.4% which is owned by Daniel Levy and certain members of his family as potential beneficiaries of a discretionary trust. This is stated on the Tottenham Hotspur website and in the audited Annual Accounts of Tottenham Hotspur Plc.
I may be wrong, but you haven't provided any evidence as yet to show that.

Just google who owns ENIC. Joe Lewis through the Tavistock group. I mean I’m not sure of the structure but I’d be surprised if Tavistock group doesn’t exist in some legal form. And is just some made up name.

 

[arthurgrimsdell]

Just google who owns ENIC. Joe Lewis through the Tavistock group. I mean I’m not sure of the structure but I’d be surprised if Tavistock group doesn’t exist in some legal form. And is just some made up name.

That's from wikipedia without any stated source, and I'd suggest is extremely likely to have come from someone who has read the Tavistock Group website casually. The source is all important, not Google (a search engine which just gives you pointers to postings on the net), nor Wikipedia (which is notoriously unreliable, because it can be easily changed, and you will note does not give a source for the assertion), neither of which are themselves sources. Tavistock is clearly not some made up name. It is a self-styled "International Private Investment Organisation" (Note it doesn't profess to be a company). Whether it holds any sort of legal interest in Tottenham Hotspur Ltd. is another matter entirely.
Just googling something is of itself inadequate. It depends on the information that's provided and how reliable that is.
My preference is to believe verifiable legally binding statements from audited accounts of legal entities.

 

[Delboy75]

That's from wikipedia without any stated source, and I'd suggest is extremely likely to have come from someone who has read the Tavistock Group website casually. The source is all important, not Google (a search engine which just gives you pointers to postings on the net), nor Wikipedia (which is notoriously unreliable, because it can be easily changed, and you will note does not give a source for the assertion), neither of which are themselves sources. Tavistock is clearly not some made up name. It is a self-styled "International Private Investment Organisation" (Note it doesn't profess to be a company). Whether it holds any sort of legal interest in Tottenham Hotspur Ltd. is another matter entirely.
Just googling something is of itself inadequate. It depends on the information that's provided and how reliable that is.
My preference is to believe verifiable legally binding statements from audited accounts of legal entities.

You’re being a bit pedantic mate. It’s clearly all owned by Joe Lewis and if he decides to sell the whole show as one entity I would think he can. I mean the grouping obviously holds some meaning otherwise why bother having it. It’s consistently referenced in regard to projects in lake Nona. There’s no other companies referenced just Tavistock.