Future Exits?

Discussion in 'Columns' started by chiveliyid, Jan 7, 2007.

  • by chiveliyid, Jan 7, 2007 at 9:12 PM
  • chiveliyid

    chiveliyid Member

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    Following on from a post made by drnbean today, he raised the point that we can't afford to sell another big player in the way that we did with Carrick.

    To me this is the most important factor in us becoming a really successful side once again and is the only thing (save something happening to Jol/Levy or one of the big players) that can derail us. In selling our big players, it invites the big teams to believe that they can poach our players and it lessens our impact as a team who want to break into the elite four. We've got to keep building a team, not look to off-load our best performers.

    I don't blame Levy etc for letting Carrick go, I didn't want him to but I think with the situation as it was, maybe we had to and in that case we had Huddlestone waiting in the wings. The money allowed us to strengthen in other areas too, so it could have strengthened us in the long term, even though it damaged us as a team in the short term.

    It is true also that whilst the players are developing there will be inconsistency and that is a massive feature of our current campaign. That is why when a player develops more consistency as Carrick had it is not viable to sell them. At the moment we have Robbo (if not so much of late), Chimbonda, King, Dawson and Keane as the only players who have sprung to mind that are consistent in games. In there I'd say Dawson still has a little way to go.

    Further afield we have players like Berbatov, Jenas, Defoe, Lennon, (Tainio, Davids and Mido - barring injuries) who are generally quite consistent but still don't always look completely at ease with what they are doing. Then further down are players like Lee, Huddlestone, Zokora, Ghaly, Davenport and Murphy who often look far from settled.

    For me, at this present moment we only really have two players who are currently settled/consistent and who are on good form, these being Dawson and Chimbonda. Malbranque, Defoe and Berbatov could also potentially be added in this bracket at this time. Even despite having few mature/comfortable/consistent performers in the side we are still generally getting results and 'bringing home the bacon' as one of my work colleagues so often likes to say.

    Basically we/Jol is looking to get it so we have 11-15 players in our squad who are settled/ consistent high performers. Who have been at Spurs for a couple of years, know the team, know each other and have experience of the English and European competitions. We now have the quality and talent, but we need to harvest it through to fruition if we are going to succeed in winning trophies and being successful. Man U with their crop of players (i.e. Scholes, Giggs, Beckham etc etc) didn't achieve success over night it took 2-4 seasons for them to grow as players and bond too. That is what we require, unfortunately we are more prone to losing one or two players along the way and this is what we must ensure does not happen. Hopefully our one or two can be Carrick and Arnesen.

    So to answer drnbean's question, what will prevent future exits? It will be brave and clever ownership (which we appear to have with Levy), consistent management (which I hope we will continue to have in Jol and Comolli), outstanding fan support (which on the whole is there) and future developments coming through (i.e. the training ground and new stadium plans). It is these things, which should help us to attain success on the pitch and ensure that loyalty to the developing Club is retained. If the management and the players can see that success is coming and development is nearing, then there should be no reason to want to move to another club.

    There is one over-riding factor that kept Henry at Arsenal last year and that was the new stadium. It offered change and new development at the club. Without that, he would now be at Barca. We need to have plans in for a new stadium or massive development of the Lane to be ready within say four years. Otherwise players like Lennon, Huddlestone may seek to move to play in front of a further 30-40,000 people each week. If they can see themselves being legends at a legendary club then they will stay. We need to do everything we can to accommodate the picture in their minds of Tottenham Hotspur being the club that people will look back on as the team of the era. (i.e. Liverpool in 80s, Man U 90s). We need to show them that we can become the team of the 10s (2010 onwards). The concept that they could be the catalyst to that rise and then fulfil their own potential with us is what will keep them at the club.

    In my eyes we are on our way to great things. We have the Chairman, the Manager and are only about 5 players away from having the squad to take us to the top. As stated selling our best players is not an option. Increased capacity and resources are also needed to keep the likes of Lennon, Robinson and Berbatov happy!
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Discussion in 'Columns' started by chiveliyid, Jan 7, 2007.

  1. drnbean
    I hope the ambitions of the club go beyond mid table w occasional forays into the promised land. I want a permanent and sustained return to the glory glory days. I want Spurs to be on par w the Real, Barca, Milan's of this world. To get there requires a new stadium 60000+. Ars#$% have made the plunge and as a result will remain light years ahead for some time. Is that acceptable? Do the Spurs faithful realize this? I fear many do not realize the significance and importance of prompt planning and action. It should be letter writing campaign, banner marching, up in arms type of stuff rather than....WHL is quaint and I'd hate to see us move.
  2. karennina
    Despite it being very early in the morning, I agree wholeheartedly with everything wot you said there.
  3. onthetwo
    at the end of the day there are only really two words that will make our top players stay...Champions League.
  4. easiman
    Good post, actually I think money has a say. Carrick for example, was reportedly offered a fourfold pay hike, hard to not be unsettled. Plus as was mentioned Champions League.
  5. Peters
    Champions League.. and a pay structure to compete with the best
  6. justfookinhitit
    Everything stems from cashflow, and spurs need a significantly bigger stadium capacity to drive that. With better cashflow we can pay the transfer fees and pay the salaries of the players we'd need to achieve Champions League qualification on a consistent basis.

    Look at Chelski, Manure, Liverpool and the Arse - all have healthier cashflow than ours. Now apart from Chelski finding an oligarch willing to pump his pocket money into the club, everyone else has the ground capacity to drive higher revenues.

    I can't help thinking spurs is ripe for a big investor - London club, wealthy fan base, good history, already has a good squad requiring only a few signings to really turn the corner etc etc.

  7. striebs
    Arsenal achieved their success with a ground only marginally bigger than ours but the climate is changing .

    We weren't ready for CL last year , the experience of Uefa will stand the team in good stead .

    Your assessment is correct , staff and particularly player retention is very important , as important as new signings .
    I think the club has been very clever in recent years with its transfer policy - I've calculated that from the Defoe/Brown purchases (7.5 million total) onwards we have spent 23.3 million pounds (includes the Arnsen fee but not the 15 million share issue).
    If you include the share issue, rising sponsorship etc. we are a club with lots of cash available for retention of current players or bringing in new ones.
    Going forward remember that if a player at the club wants to break the scale we have to be cautious because you have a lot of other stars at the club locked into long term contracts and they'd get unsettled.
    Finally remember that them lot down the road have been very cautious about paying big wages - Henry is the first to break their structure.
  9. Eyebrowman
    Justfookinhitit, I dont mean to criticize, but I personally would hate for an abramovich to take over, pump the club full of money and buy success. I'd rather it be 'my' Spurs who built up the right way, with good management from the top down and shrewd movements in the market coupled with developing our core of youth.
    I do agree we need stadium development, but i believe that Levy is moving as fast as he can on that because he knows it better than anyone. Its the local councils and the lack of money for regeneration that has stymied it so far. I honestly believe that if a partnership plan were put in place today for the regeneration of the area and transport links, Spurs would have space for 50-55k seats by the start of the 08/09 season.
  10. 2bearis2do
    Spot on.

    We don't need a NEW stadium.

    Best stadiums in the country...Man Ure and NEwQ Brown. Both being developed on their original sites. Heaven forbid we get an Emirates or Stadium of Doom.

    WHat we DO need is a larger capacity (55-60,000)and better transport links. I think we stand 8th in the Pleague for average attendances behind the likes of Citah and Everton and the moronic Chelski scum (Loyal...you're having a laugh!). And 9th for capacity (behind Villa). NO wander we're not seen as a big club or indeed a top six club. You can be sure this was not the case in our glorious days.

    Both increased capacity and improved transport links are very doable on the existing site. If only we can get the local authority to support the cause (How hard has it been to invest in the new training ground?) ridiculous, bureaucratic madness. Lets face it any investment in the WHL area is going to be a good investment. As much as I breath THFC I get depressed walking down the 7 sisters, it's horrible! And also pretty damn dangerous at night if you get stuck there as I did after the Bill Nich Hall of Fame night. When top security man at WHL managed to get me a cab to go South of the river. He said there had been many shooting and stabbing incidents in the area etc

    Thats by the by, but there are existing UNUSED railway lines that can feed the crowds to and from the Lane. What the LAuth were not approving was the building and funding of a new Tube Station (probably because they'd have to spend thousands on changing their underground maps).

    Levy is doing all he can and checking out every angle. In my mind we should bite the bullet and offer to pay for the new tube station. Whats 10mill relative to a complete new stadium? Obviously its not as simple as that you've also got the residential problems of removing existing tenants as the stadium expands, but compulsory purchases aren't a new thing, happened in both NewQ and Man U, they get paid double the value of their house and off they go. Who would want to live next door to a ground anyway?

    I'm belching tangents now, but in a nut shell. Redevelop the Lane, Regenerate the area. Everyone wins.
  11. Quinton Spur
    I am hoping we can push on second half of the season and go past Portsmouth at least and hopefully Bolton given our cup progress this season (with more to come) to be fifth again would represent progress.

    If we win a cup I'd settle for seventh in the league . . .

    I think setting that sort of mark would make us very, very attractive to new players and ensure we keep the quality we already have.
  12. johna
    What we do need is to stop wasting money on players who are just not up to it. To me Zokara as been very dissapointing for the wad we splashed out on him. We are still short of a midfielder who can take the game by the balls and stand up and be counted. So lets get it right on the pitch first then the worry about new stadiums etc..
  13. justfookinhitit

    Hey - I agree. I don't want an oligarch to turn up either. the transformation that has taken place over the past couple of years has been really pleasing. I'm a huge fan of bringing in good english talent and developing them into great prem & international players.

    I'd much rather build from where we are, develop the existing ground to closer to the 50k capacity. My point was just that spurs is an obviously attractive target should anyone with a pot of cash wish to buy an English club.
  14. psturdy
    WHL or a new ground?

    This is actually quite a tricky question, before the emotional pull of staying at the Lane is taken into account.

    Don't forget that literally shed loads of cash is being pumped into East London for the Olympics. I don't pretend to know how that is to be financed (Central Government/London/Local Authorities/Sponsorship) - one thing is sure this big project will crowd out/choke off transport/sport related funding to areas like Tottenham. Just a fact of life.

    With this background lasting until 2012, it is unlikely we will get any finance for improved stadium/transport links until then. Even in these circumstances, the club could extend the ground on the current "footprint" to around 45-50,000 by redeveloping the West stand/car park etc.

    This was the appeal of the "Golden Bullet" solutions of moving to the Olympic stadium (rightly discounted by Comolli in my view) or even Wembley - both newly developed grounds with purpose built transport facilities.

    The question is how large capacity do we need? We should be aiming to exceed the Ar$e (no point in aiming too low) so my vote goes to Wembley in the long term unless we can improve transport to WHL, which I don't expect in the short term.
  15. topaz
    I’m glad people are focusing again on the necessity of a bigger stadium – and also that people tend to be coming down on the side of expanding <st1:Street><st1:address>White Hart Lane</st1:address></st1:Street>. Quite apart from our inevitable concerns over losing the heart of the club if we moved from the Lane, the Tottenham area badly needs us. As I understood it, the houses in Paxton and <st1:Street><st1:address>Park Lane</st1:address></st1:Street> have already been bought and outline planning permission gained for an extension of the East Stand (some kind of stilted structure over the road, wasn’t it?). Like 2bearis2do I have often wondered whether the solution might not be for the club to pay for the new Victoria Line tube station – or at least contribute so much towards it that it becomes an offer that the authorities can’t refuse. But could a station really be built for £10 million?<o:p></o:p>
  16. welshspurs
    new stadium

    my thoughts on the new stadium are to knock down WHL and completley rebuild a 65,000 state of the art new ground on the same site therefor saving money on a new plot of land. we can play our home games at wembley until it is built so we are happy all round.CANT WAIT TO GET CARDIFF AT THE LANE COYS!!!!!:shake:
  17. justfookinhitit
    Can't believe a new underground station would only cost $10m - surely it would be far more.
  18. chiveliyid
    Redevelopment would be great, but the main problems remain in the transport links. I agree with whoever said it, that Levy etc are working as quickly as they can and as far as I can see they are doing a fantastic job. Anyone know if there have been any developments on the training ground? Last I heard we were having to reassess because of some bats.
  19. elDiablo
    In response to onthe2's post.........

    The whole idea about selling players, the champions league, etc etc, is that its quite a catch 22. Last season, arguably our most consistent performer was the reason we reached the dizzy heights of 5th place. He got poached in a deal that was good for everyone, and in my opinion possibly jumped a little bit above his station to soon. Now this season we have struggled (although DMatz.. statistics dont suggest this) and now we are in a position where we all know we need to consolidate our position in europe. This is where the possible catch lies - particularly for our older players. For us to qualify, our main men have to perform...i.e the likes of defoe, keane, dawson, and jenas when he returns. If these players dont perform, and we finish 9th, down to the fact that our main players have played poorly, will there be as much interest? will we sell defoe for £7m........i really dont think we would. On the other hand, if our players play out of their skins, and we achieve 5th, we would secure europe and the promise (or hope) of continual improvement, our players will be happy, and although there would be alot of interest we wouldnt have to sell. The only problem with this situation is our youngsters. If we finished 9th, then the vultures will be circling around lennon et al, but thankfully we have tied them down for along time.

    Basically in quite a long winded argument, dont expect our team to just break up if we dont get europe again. Maybe one or two may leave, but we have the foundations to keep growing from strength to strength.

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