Greatest player of the last twenty years..

[Green Valley]

So this tells me that your views are somewhat influenced by a pre-formed opinion of someone who plays football.

I know what you are saying, and I think we agree, it's just the way you came across originally was almost not acknowledging any kind of natural talent.

Possibly, although I've read/seen other cases as well e.g the Ronaldo, Fat Lampard and a poster mentioned Nani a few posts ago, etc...

I know what you are saying, and I think we agree, it's just the way you came across originally was almost not acknowledging any kind of natural talent.

I have poor writing skills, as I had no interest in English lang/literature at school. And a lot of the time it is hard for me to explain myself properly online.

yay for spellcheckers

 

[WhiteStripe]

I can understand why strength, stamina, intelligence etc evolve and improve and obviously one day somebody will run faster than Usain Bolt.

But football ability is immeasurable and why does natural ability need to evolve? The Maradona, O'Sullivan and Jordan's of this world are simply born with incredible natural ability to do something and all of the coaching, training, kicking a ball every day does no more than hone that natural ability. Without the gift in the first place you can try as you might but you will never get to the level.

These guys are born with gifts that seperate them from all of their peers, their years of participation in the sport only hones there natural ability.

I believe if Maradona had never kicked a football in his life and you threw him one today he could instantly feel it in a different way, he could instantly do things with it that people who've played for years couldn't. The same with O'Sullivan if he hit a snooker ball for the first time ever today he would find it very very easy and automatic, he sees angles differently, distance differently, can instinctively apply spins. It's pure natural talent.

Good post.

Firstly, if, as some are saying, it is impossible to have a natural gift, then that is depressing. I like to think that some of these people are trully special, yes they have workled hard, but they also have a unique attribute that nobody else has.

Secondly, When I first played golf, I started playing with a number of mates. We all picked up a club for the first time, we all swang at the ball, and we all hit the ball. A few went trickling along the ground, some went straight right or left, and mine went 70 yards down the range, straight and true. We continued playing regularly, we all improved to some degree, but I always found it easier than them to play. Now 20 odd years later, me having had a child, and getting nowhere near the amount of practice they do, we play, and I am still the best, even though I hardly play at the moment, and they practice every week.

 

[WhiteStripe]

Possibly, although I've read/seen other cases as well e.g the Ronaldo, Fat Lampard and a poster mentioned Nani a few posts ago, etc...



I have poor writing skills, as I had no interest in English lang/literature at school. And a lot of the time it is hard for me to explain myself properly online.

yay for spellcheckers

I know this feeling so well mate. How infuriating the interweb can be for explaining a point of view. So many times I have felt like typing..."YOU KNOW WHAT, FUCK OFF AND SHUT UP!!" over the years :lol:

 

[InOffMeLeftShin]

I can understand why strength, stamina, intelligence etc evolve and improve and obviously one day somebody will run faster than Usain Bolt.

But football ability is immeasurable and why does natural ability need to evolve? The Maradona, O'Sullivan and Jordan's of this world are simply born with incredible natural ability to do something and all of the coaching, training, kicking a ball every day does no more than hone that natural ability. Without the gift in the first place you can try as you might but you will never get to the level.

These guys are born with gifts that seperate them from all of their peers, their years of participation in the sport only hones there natural ability.

I believe if Maradona had never kicked a football in his life and you threw him one today he could instantly feel it in a different way, he could instantly do things with it that people who've played for years couldn't. The same with O'Sullivan if he hit a snooker ball for the first time ever today he would find it very very easy and automatic, he sees angles differently, distance differently, can instinctively apply spins. It's pure natural talent.

But what you are classing as 'natural talent' is still scientifically quantifiable. Some people are born with certain genes that means they are going to be tall, if they eat right and treat their body right they will likely be taller than if they didn't. Yes the human body is evolving, one day somebody will run faster than Bolt because they have a physical advantage.

It is the same for Maradona, O'Sullivan etc, just it is not so obvious to see because it is related to the brain and the nervous system. It is the link between the brain and the body movements that makes them good at what they do. It isn't magic. Sure they were born with that, but it is something that will still continue to evolve. I don't see what isn't to understand there.

 

[Partizan]

Good post.

Firstly, if, as some are saying, it is impossible to have a natural gift, then that is depressing. I like to think that some of these people are trully special, yes they have workled hard, but they also have a unique attribute that nobody else has.

I think it's far more depressing when you see other people have a natural gift or a unique attribute for something when you don't have any. :-(

 

[Legend10]

But what you are classing as 'natural talent' is still scientifically quantifiable. Some people are born with certain genes that means they are going to be tall, if they eat right and treat their body right they will likely be taller than if they didn't. Yes the human body is evolving, one day somebody will run faster than Bolt because they have a physical advantage.

It is the same for Maradona, O'Sullivan etc, just it is not so obvious to see because it is related to the brain and the nervous system. It is the link between the brain and the body movements that makes them good at what they do. It isn't magic. Sure they were born with that, but it is something that will still continue to evolve. I don't see what isn't to understand there.

Listen mate, I'm not the brightest and I don't want you to ruin my perception of true greatness with intelligent reasoning and argument!

 

[InOffMeLeftShin]

Listen mate, I'm not the brightest and I don't want you to ruin my perception of true greatness with intelligent reasoning and argument!

:grin: OK, it is true greatness they are born with. I was just trying to argue that we are likely to see even better players in the future.

 

[Green Valley]

Could you imagine if Zidane was the size of Maradona?

Zidane's height hindered his dribbling abilities - that's a quote from Maradona himself. :razz:

 

[llamafarmer]

Could you imagine if Zidane was the size of Maradona?

Zidane's height hindered his dribbling abilities - that's a quote from Maradona himself. :razz:

It was quite handy when IIRC he scored two headed goals in the world cup final though. :wink:

 

[Green Valley]

It was quite handy when IIRC he scored two headed goals in the world cup final though. :wink:

for sure

 

[Legend10]

:grin: OK, it is true greatness they are born with. I was just trying to argue that we are likely to see even better players in the future.

Thank you, and if there is to be even better players in the future I will refuse to acknowledge them as such.

 

[InOffMeLeftShin]

Thank you, and if there is to be even better players in the future I will refuse to acknowledge them as such.

Would it help if one of them ended up playing for us?

 

[ever]

cant ignore technology in this argument

balls, kits and boots have all got lighter and are generally all better than the equipment that players have previously used

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Iniesta.

This little fella doesn't pull doves out of a top hat but he is poetry in motion. He is a hybrid footballing mathematician/symphony conductor.

Either him or Zidane.

 

[llamafarmer]

Iniesta.

This little fella doesn't pull doves out of a top hat but he is poetry in motion. He is a hybrid footballing mathematician/symphony conductor.

Either him or Zidane.

Iniesta is certainly my player of the year, close call between him and Xavi.

 

[Green Valley]

cant ignore technology in this argument

balls, kits and boots have all got lighter and are generally all better than the equipment that players have previously used

Ad pitches to the equation as well. The pitches nowadays are immaculate, yet even 10 years ago in the winter they would become bogs around where the players move more e.g six yard box, today this isn't the case.

 

[Legend10]

Iniesta.

This little fella doesn't pull doves out of a top hat but he is poetry in motion. He is a hybrid footballing mathematician/symphony conductor.

Either him or Zidane.

He is a fabulous player and as Llama said would be my player of this year.

 

[Legend10]

Would it help if one of them ended up playing for us?

Possibly!

 

[yusrisafri]

Zidane, by miles.....not just the last twenty years, probably the greatest player ever from Europe IMHO.

 

[markiespurs]

Zidane would win it for me.

Ever and Green valley do make excellent points though in that technology and the state of the pitches give modern players a great advantage.