If you had to sell one CM...

[SpurSince57]

Before Poch took over Southampton, Capoue was considered to this a lot better than Schneiderlin did, so I see no reason why Poch can't improve Capoue to do this better than Schneiderlin does now.

Schneiderlin's been at Southampton since 2008, but I don't recall seeing his name mentioned on SC until this season.

I'd like to see existing players worked on/with; have we really got as much as we could out of Livermore, for example?

 

[mpickard2087]

Before Poch took over Southampton, Capoue was considered to this a lot better than Schneiderlin did, so I see no reason why Poch can't improve Capoue to do this better than Schneiderlin does now.

I meant to mention Capoue actually with another post about how the midfield will shape up. If we play the same as Southampton, or how Poch ideally wanted to set up with Wanyama and Schneiderlin which he couldn't for long spells of the season, then its going to be a pair of the sitting player who conducts things (that I was talking about) with a ball winner/destroyer type who keeps it simpler. I see Sandro and Capoue as the ball winners. I know Capoue can pick a pass and in France got forward a bit more than we have seen, but for me someone like Schneiderlin is superior with his range of passing and having play go through them and can connect the play from our third into the final third better. He's a real all-rounder. I think Capoue could play this role and I definitely see a future for him, but I think I see him as the ball winner (with more than that in his locker than just breaking up play) paired with someone else.

 

[spurs9]

It's a difficult one.

Sandro - Absolute beast, was the beast in Europe for interceptions before his injury, has better passing than people give him credit for and great at starting attacks with his bursts forwards. Has had injury issues, however, due to poor coaching, lots of players suffered from injury problems and it will always effect players coming back from long term injuries more. Hopefully we have a coach in Poch that understands this and we will suffer from less injuries this year and allow players like Sandro to get fully fit and back to his best.

Capoue - A better version of Schneiderlin (before Poch took over), so he could be very valuable to the team and exactly what we need in some games. Again he had injuries last season (after previously have next none most of his career), but with the right coaching could be a beast for us.

Paulinho - Not a great season, but was his first in the EPL and wasn't in the most ideal of circumstances. Despite that, scored a few goals and showed glimpses of what he can do and also attacks the box/gets into great positions very well. His runs into the box could be vital when trying to break down stubborn defence's, taking defenders away from the other attackers. Also, he presses well for Brazil and could thrive under Poch.

Dembele - On the face of it, he is the player that fits Poch's system the least, mainly as he holds onto the ball too long and doesn't look up when on the ball, missing players movement ahead of him. I don't know how much his hip injury is affecting him or how much is style of play and equally if it is able to be trained out of him. However, if it is down to style of play and can he can be trained to only take 2 touches most of the time and he can play with his head up, we could have some player on our hands here. I wonder if it would be worth keeping him, getting him to have a hip opp and allowing him to fully recover (we have enough CM's to cope), then see what Poch can do with him. Even if he isn't able to change his game, selling a fully fit Dembele in Jan or next summer might net us enough money more than we could get this summer to make it worthwhile.

 

[Rocksuperstar]

I don't see the Jenas option.

Always Jenas.

 

[spurs9]

I meant to mention Capoue actually with another post about how the midfield will shape up. If we play the same as Southampton, or how Poch ideally wanted to set up with Wanyama and Schneiderlin which he couldn't for long spells of the season, then its going to be a pair of the sitting player who conducts things (that I was talking about) with a ball winner/destroyer type who keeps it simpler. I see Sandro and Capoue as the ball winners. I know Capoue can pick a pass and in France got forward a bit more than we have seen, but for me someone like Schneiderlin is superior with his range of passing and having play go through them and can connect the play from our third into the final third better. He's a real all-rounder. I think Capoue could play this role and I definitely see a future for him, but I think I see him as the ball winner (with more than that in his locker than just breaking up play) paired with someone else.

I think Poch will face a lot more "parked buses" with us than he did with Southampton, so I think one of the 2 CM's will need to be more attacking in most games. Even if we didn't, Capoue's range of passing was considered superior to Schneiderlin a year ago, so if Poch can improve him that way, Capoue could be even better.

 

[bookhouseboy]

Sandro has managed a season's worth of games in three and doesn't score much either. It may surprise some to learn that Dembélé's also a more effective ball-winner.

Dembélé hasn't anywhere near the defensive awareness as Sandro and Dembélé's ballwinning-efforts are normally more risky all-inn tackles with less care about protction for his back four.
Sandro is a lot less prone to sell himself and he wins more from interceptions and smarter and more controlled tackles.

That's just from observations – from stats alone their numbers in PL for us are following (based on WhoScored-stats and FPL-minutes played):

Dembélé:
'13/14:
Tackles: 65
Interceptions: 18
Mins: 1818
Mins / T+I: 21.9

'12/13:
Tackles: 81
Interceptions: 41
Mins: 2377
Mins / T+I: 19.5

Sandro:
'13/14:
Tackles: 24
Interceptions: 30
Mins: 827
Mins / T+I: 15.3

'12/13:
Tackles: 72
Interceptions: 80
Mins: 1772
Mins / T+I: 11.7

11/12:
Tackles: 84
Interceptions: 43
Mins: 1411
Mins / T+I: 11.1

10/11:
Tackles: 70
Interceptions: 41
Mins: 1079
Mins / T+I: 9.7

Capoue:
'13/14:
Tackles: 25
Interceptions: 30
Mins: 685
Mins / T+I: 12.5

Paulinho:
'13/14:
Tackles: 65
Interceptions: 32
Mins: 2374
Mins / T+I: 24.5

Bentaleb:
'13/14:
Tackles: 39
Interceptions: 26
Mins: 1071
Mins / T+I: 16.5


So a downward trend for Sandro this season, but coming from a longterm-injury he's been more rusty – so hopefully a full preseason will see him back to his awesome best again were he totally crush Dembélé inn minutes between each ballwinning (tackle or interception) – and even last season he was considerably better also statwise, and not just in giving a lot more protection for his back-four.

 

[SpurSince57]

It's a difficult one.

Sandro - Absolute beast, was the beast in Europe for interceptions before his injury, has better passing than people give him credit for and great at starting attacks with his bursts forwards. Has had injury issues, however, due to poor coaching, lots of players suffered from injury problems and it will always effect players coming back from long term injuries more. Hopefully we have a coach in Poch that understands this and we will suffer from less injuries this year and allow players like Sandro to get fully fit and back to his best.

Capoue - A better version of Schneiderlin (before Poch took over), so he could be very valuable to the team and exactly what we need in some games. Again he had injuries last season (after previously have next none most of his career), but with the right coaching could be a beast for us.

Paulinho - Not a great season, but was his first in the EPL and wasn't in the most ideal of circumstances. Despite that, scored a few goals and showed glimpses of what he can do and also attacks the box/gets into great positions very well. His runs into the box could be vital when trying to break down stubborn defence's, taking defenders away from the other attackers. Also, he presses well for Brazil and could thrive under Poch.

Dembele - On the face of it, he is the player that fits Poch's system the least, mainly as he holds onto the ball too long and doesn't look up when on the ball, missing players movement ahead of him. I don't know how much his hip injury is affecting him or how much is style of play and equally if it is able to be trained out of him. However, if it is down to style of play and can he can be trained to only take 2 touches most of the time and he can play with his head up, we could have some player on our hands here. I wonder if it would be worth keeping him, getting him to have a hip opp and allowing him to fully recover (we have enough CM's to cope), then see what Poch can do with him. Even if he isn't able to change his game, selling a fully fit Dembele in Jan or next summer might net us enough money more than we could get this summer to make it worthwhile.

Are Sandro's injuries down to poor coaching, or to his tendency to recklessness? He's a huge fan favourite, and therefore almost impossible to criticise without risking a general flaming, but although he gets stuck in he comes away with the ball less often than you might think. Those forward bursts do start off attacks, but it's also possible to argue that he lacks the discipline to be the sitting DM.

Capoue's injuries last season were due to his getting clogged, and really can't be blamed on coaching. We need to see more.

Paulinho disappointed but was hardly a disaster area.

Dembélé: after his first few games everyone was asking, 'How long can we keep him?' Now, it's 'How can we get rid of him?' If he's staying, I think we need to get him back to full fitness and then nail down his role.

 

[SpurSince57]

Dembélé hasn't anywhere near the defensive awareness as Sandro and Dembélé's ballwinning-efforts are normally more risky all-inn tackles with less care about protction for his back four.
Sandro is a lot less prone to sell himself and he wins more from interceptions and smarter and more controlled tackles.

That's just from observations – from stats alone their numbers in PL for us are following (based on WhoScored-stats and FPL-minutes played):

Dembélé:
'13/14:
Tackles: 65
Interceptions: 18
Mins: 1818
Mins / T+I: 21.9

'12/13:
Tackles: 81
Interceptions: 41
Mins: 2377
Mins / T+I: 19.5

Sandro:
'13/14:
Tackles: 24
Interceptions: 30
Mins: 827
Mins / T+I: 15.3

'12/13:
Tackles: 72
Interceptions: 80
Mins: 1772
Mins / T+I: 11.7

11/12:
Tackles: 84
Interceptions: 43
Mins: 1411
Mins / T+I: 11.1

10/11:
Tackles: 70
Interceptions: 41
Mins: 1079
Mins / T+I: 9.7

Capoue:
'13/14:
Tackles: 25
Interceptions: 30
Mins: 685
Mins / T+I: 12.5

Paulinho:
'13/14:
Tackles: 65
Interceptions: 32
Mins: 2374
Mins / T+I: 24.5

Bentaleb:
'13/14:
Tackles: 39
Interceptions: 26
Mins: 1071
Mins / T+I: 16.5


So a downward trend for Sandro this season, but coming from a longterm-injury he's been more rusty – so hopefully a full preseason will see him back to his awesome best again were he totally crush Dembélé inn minutes between each ballwinning (tackle or interception) – and even last season he was considerably better also statwise, and not just in giving a lot more protection for his back-four.

Have you checked successful tackles over the past three seasons?

 

[RButch]

make or break season for Dembele. Think under Poch he could be a revelation. He has so much ability, but, to me, lacks confidence with his attacking ability and passing.

Wouldn't want to sell any of them. But Dembele, currently, is the most frustrating.

 

[Syn_13]

Are Sandro's injuries down to poor coaching, or to his tendency to recklessness? He's a huge fan favourite, and therefore almost impossible to criticise without risking a general flaming, but although he gets stuck in he comes away with the ball less often than you might think. Those forward bursts do start off attacks, but it's also possible to argue that he lacks the discipline to be the sitting DM.

Capoue's injuries last season were due to his getting clogged, and really can't be blamed on coaching. We need to see more.

Paulinho disappointed but was hardly a disaster area.

Dembélé: after his first few games everyone was asking, 'How long can we keep him?' Now, it's 'How can we get rid of him?' If he's staying, I think we need to get him back to full fitness and then nail down his role.

This is the mystery. Just what the hell is his role? He's not got the legs to be box-to-box. He's not got the passing range to be any sort of playmaker. His finishing isn't good enough, nor does he makes late runs into the box, to supply goals from midfield. He's not a bad tackler, not the best but decent enough, so I guess he can sit deep. Once he gets the ball though his only real strength is to carry it forward himself, but I'd rather us move that ball quicker through passing.

He's a bit of a mystery is our Dembele. I've always liked him, and my old man thinks he's one of the first names on the teamsheet, but he just doesn't seem to provide enough of anything substantial. His injuries really don't help him. I wonder how much of a toll that hip problem takes.

 

[spurs9]

Are Sandro's injuries down to poor coaching, or to his tendency to recklessness? He's a huge fan favourite, and therefore almost impossible to criticise without risking a general flaming, but although he gets stuck in he comes away with the ball less often than you might think. Those forward bursts do start off attacks, but it's also possible to argue that he lacks the discipline to be the sitting DM.

Capoue's injuries last season were due to his getting clogged, and really can't be blamed on coaching. We need to see more.

Paulinho disappointed but was hardly a disaster area.

Dembélé: after his first few games everyone was asking, 'How long can we keep him?' Now, it's 'How can we get rid of him?' If he's staying, I think we need to get him back to full fitness and then nail down his role.

I would definitely say Sandro's injuries this season were down to poor coaching on the back of his injury last season. His initial injury against QPR was just bad luck, but you could see when he came back that his fitness wasn't good enough to be playing yet. Hopefully with a full pre-season and Poch's training methods, he can go back to his best.

Also, don't let last seasons performances cloud your memory. The year before he came away with the ball more than most other players in his position and his forward burst never affected the team negatively.

 

[ultimateloner]

all of them aside from Sandro, given the right price.
Maybe Paulinho too but he really needs to up his goals to match expectations.

 

[NEVILLEB]

Dembele needs to sort out his injury asap.

 

[eddiev14]

Unfortunately for all his talent Dembele is the odd one out in this instance. He has a unique set of qualities that I just can't see fitting into the Poch's hard pressing quick passing philosophy.

Liam Neeson disagrees!

 

[NEVILLEB]

We don't know how good Capoue is and to a certain extent Paulinho too. As a CM for Brazil he deserves a 2nd look.

Sandro was poor last season but also deserves another chance.

Dembele needs to fix this hip pelvis problem and get back to his best.

In short then, none of them deserve to leave.

Up to Poch to see in training.

 

[SpursManChris]

23 votes for Sandro? There should be zero.

 

[whitechina]

Mirror suggesting we will demand £16m for Sandro (with intention of scaring them off). As popular he is I could live with him going for that amount considering his injuries. Would need at least that for Dembele to sell him instead IMO.

With that figure I'd sell Sandro. He's one of my favourite players in recent time but the injuries keep coming we're not big enough to keep carrying injured players (or Danny Rose!)

 

[punkisback]

Definitely Paulinho, decent in attack but a complete wuss in defence and lazy tracking back

 

[fatpiranha]

I'd sell Paulinho. He loses the ball far more than the other 3 and rarely tackles. I was very disappointed with him this season because he just didn't seem to be trying half the time. Decent goal threat notwithstanding there are better options in that role.

 

[tttcowan]

55 people would get rid of Dembele and only 12 (so far) would get rid of Capoue ? That is one mind fuck right there.

Most people think we haven't seen the best of Capoue... And after so many seasons in the prem you've got to assume we've seen the best of Dembele. Hence the votes for Dembele.