Lets all laugh at Newcastle

[Gbspurs]

Have you got any facts to back this up.

From the brief research I've done it would suggest that as things stand Ashley is significantly out of pocket so far and has far more into Newcastle than he has taken out.

And I don't get you saying he hadn't invested in players. Every summer they seem to be buying some decent players whilst Ashley has been there. Last summer they had a net spend of 25m. I know they have an average net profit but that is as a result of fluctuating windows, some net losses and some good windows of net gains. They have invested most summers though, and made some pretty acquisitions that have sold on for good profit.

Football fans seem to have this idiotic idea that owners should sanction spending way more than clubs can earn, or that owners should not run football as sustainable businesses, or make a net profit from transfer dealings.

When Pardew resigned Newcastle were comfortably in mid table and had from being newly promoted built a very solid model with an average place of 12th inc if they finish 17th this year.

I don't think Pardew's a great manager but if he hadn't have left that average would be higher and they wouldn't be in trouble now.

For me, the biggest failing is of the board to publicly keep fans informed of their strategy, make them more aware of the realities of their model and how it has to be until an idiot with more money than brains comes along.

Whilst I agreed the fans need to be kept better informed I suspect the reason they aren't is because there is no model.

This article is a good example. On the face of it everything is excellent but there is so much left ambiguous in their finances which begs the question why?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...re-been-a-rise-of-25m-in-operating-costs.html

The article even highlights that the rise is profits is mostly attributed to the tv deal and player sales, so why if they aren't buying players, or paying back his "loan", or he isn't taking money aren't they making more profit? Where is the money going?

You can understand why the fans would have concerns as there are no answers and no clear strategy.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Whilst I agreed the fans need to be kept better informed I suspect the reason they aren't is because there is no model.

This article is a good example. On the face of it everything is excellent but there is so much left ambiguous in their finances which begs the question why?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...re-been-a-rise-of-25m-in-operating-costs.html

The article even highlights that the rise is profits is mostly attributed to the tv deal and player sales, so why if they aren't buying players, or paying back his "loan", or he isn't taking money aren't they making more profit? Where is the money going?

You can understand why the fans would have concerns as there are no answers and no clear strategy.

The article says profits are up due to TV, commercial and the sales of players. Which is exactly how football clubs make money.

Those figures were for 2014. In summer 2014 Newcastle invested 25m net on players.

I'm pretty sure they will spend again this summer. They've got horrendous injury problems and players like dejong and Cisse and tiote have been missing for long spells and others were having their first season.

I think they do have a strategy and it's a very sound one.

I think Newcastle have played the transfer market pretty well in recent seasons, players have been acquired cheaply and developed, improved and sold on to better clubs.

Newcastle fans just cannot grasp the reality of their situation and place in football's fish pond now.

Every team below ManC and Chelsea (and ManU) is a feeder club for bigger sharks and the days of idiot owners bankrupting clubs to give fans a five minute thrill is declining.

 

[cookiemonster]

That tongue licker actually thinks that nobody took his challenge to leave the room means that they are all behind him

 

[DJS]

To be fair whether he's a **** or not Ashley does seem to have shelled out on the players.

They've purchase Cabaye, Debuchy, Janmaat, Goffran, Cisse, de Jong, Anita, Sissoko, Santon, Cabella, Tiote, Haidara, to name a few.

All varying fees and some more successful than others but Ashley has put the money in.

Some of them have been sold but they usually move in and get someone else pretty quick (they do seem to have an odd obsession with the French though lol).

The only thing that lets Ashley down is his bizarre managerial / DOF choices, player-wise they get backed quite well.

 

[beats1]

The article says profits are up due to TV, commercial and the sales of players. Which is exactly how football clubs make money.

Those figures were for 2014. In summer 2014 Newcastle invested 25m net on players.

I'm pretty sure they will spend again this summer. They've got horrendous injury problems and players like dejong and Cisse and tiote have been missing for long spells and others were having their first season.

I think they do have a strategy and it's a very sound one.

I think Newcastle have played the transfer market pretty well in recent seasons, players have been acquired cheaply and developed, improved and sold on to better clubs.

Newcastle fans just cannot grasp the reality of their situation and place in football's fish pond now.

Every team below ManC and Chelsea (and ManU) is a feeder club for bigger sharks and the days of idiot owners bankrupting clubs to give fans a five minute thrill is declining.

Im dumbfounded by this,

Firstly you overlooked the point made earlier to you, which was that they spent the money they had got from the Cabaye sell and it wasnt £25m net. It was £17m

The last 5 seasons they spent £99m and got back £98m, so quit the bullshit about spending money since only one club has spent less money(us, though we have cleared the debt and building a stadium)
http://www.transferleague.co.uk/pre...tables/premier-league-table-last-five-seasons

Their transfers have been horrible bar Janmaat and Colback this season

As for Injuries, they had alot but they had around the same as Stoke, Everton and West Ham

They have sold Debuchy, Cabaye, Ba and Enrique(700k profit). 4 players who been sold for a profit(one barely a profit and another was sold very cheap as he had a clause).

I don't like Newcastle fans but you thinking that they think they should be at the top, they don't, they feel they shouldn't be taken for a ride which they are!

You say the days of idiots bankrupting the club is declining but overlook the fact that Newcastle isn't getting the money they have invested back in to the club.

Just look at the Rangers situation, for 8.92% of the club he got a deal for sports direct to take 49% of the profits from the clubs shop and naming rights for Ibrox. Then scrapping the naming rights for advertising hoards and then increasing the profits from retail to 75% for an interest free loan for £5m.

Interesting there dealings like the wise fiasco which show how badly run that club was back then. Kevin Keegan threw a fit at Wise and quit because he wanted to sign(and did it seemed) a player that no one at the club had seen play but brought as a favour to two south american agents they knew.

I can go on but anyone who says he spends money is talking a load of bollocks

 

[beats1]

To be fair whether he's a **** or not Ashley does seem to have shelled out on the players.

They've purchase Cabaye, Debuchy, Janmaat, Goffran, Cisse, de Jong, Anita, Sissoko, Santon, Cabella, Tiote, Haidara, to name a few.

All varying fees and some more successful than others but Ashley has put the money in.

Some of them have been sold but they usually move in and get someone else pretty quick (they do seem to have an odd obsession with the French though lol).

The only thing that lets Ashley down is his bizarre managerial / DOF choices, player-wise they get backed quite well.

No he hasn't their net spend over the last 5 years is around £0.5m

The only club who spent less is us, we have however cleared all our debts, brought all the land around the stadium, built a new training ground, built two new schools, built a sainsbury's and are about to build a stadium FFS whilst maintaining a position around 5th place.

 

[allatsea]

No he hasn't their net spend over the last 5 years is around £0.5m

The only club who spent less is us, we have however cleared all our debts, brought all the land around the stadium, built a new training ground, built two new schools, built a sainsbury's and are about to build a stadium FFS whilst maintaining a position around 5th place.

Doesn't that prove 1) we have been doing something right on the playing and coaching staff and 2) you don't need to spend more than you take in from player sales to do reasonably well in the PL ?

 

[Marty]

Would've loved them to go down. But seeing Gutierrez scoring to seal the win for them was heart-warming.

 

[SpursManChris]

We're lucky Levy booted Paul Kemsley out when he did, as him and Ashley were plotting a takeover at the time, which fell through and Ashley bought Newcastle. I look at the state of the barcodes since and it's almost like 'look at what we could have won'.

We were close to getting Ashley? Fuck me.

 

[SpursManChris]

Why do fans think they are entitled to have someone prepared to just piss hundreds of millions of their own money away for their (fans) enjoyment ?

Would YOU be happy if our owner put the same amount of money as Ashley into us?

 

[SpursManChris]

​

 

[SpursManChris]

Would've loved them to go down.

Why? I thought you said the fans deserve better.

 

[SpursManChris]

Only one failing?

He hired Dennis Wise as DOF against the manager's wishes.

He hired Joe Kinnear twice.

He has stabilised the financial side of the club but they are not really reinvesting. Their net spend over the last 6 seasons is minus £24m.

He has filled the club's stadium with billboards advertising his own company, which the club does not get a penny from. That alone is so disgusting I'd be surprised to find a single Newcastle fan who doesn't hate Ashley passionately.

...and hired John Carver as the manager. - the worst failing of them all. Not to mention, they were relegated before under his watch, albeit with the club in a worse state financially, but all these years on, coming THAT close to being relegated again, is also a failure in my eyes. His ambition is to merely stay in the league and he very nearly didn't even achieve that.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

No he hasn't their net spend over the last 5 years is around £0.5m

The only club who spent less is us, we have however cleared all our debts, brought all the land around the stadium, built a new training ground, built two new schools, built a sainsbury's and are about to build a stadium FFS whilst maintaining a position around 5th place.

That's exactly what the net spend of club that until last has made very little profit and has debt.

You ignore the fact that Ashley had to put his hand in his pocket to buy the players that then realised profit that equated to that net level spend. If he doesn't risk his money in the first place then the players aren't there to develop and increase in value and recoup spend.

@SpursManChris

This is exactly why many of us defend the way our club is run. Because it's an almost impossible task to run a football to please idiot fans who seem incapable of grasping that football is a business that has to live in the real world of business.

The problem is for many years idiots were allowed to own and run clubs as play things and because of their place within communities, terrible administration was sanctioned by everyone concerned (Banks, The FA etc), which is why what happened to Leeds (and Forest, Sheff Wed, etc) was inches away from happening to us before Sugar came along and bailed us out.

MIke Ashley is a very good businessman. Newcastle were in a fucking terrible mess and could easily have become another sunk behemoth if he hadn't come along. I think his intention was to actually flip the club quickly, but since then he's loaned the club 130m of his own money on interest free basis.

Chairman need to communicate better the fiscal realities of the business, but the problem is so few fans want to hear them. They want to stick their heads up their arses and whistle dixie, believing that because they challenged for a title ten years ago, and nearly bankrupted themselves doing it, they are entitled to exist like that forever.


Fans need to understand that unless you're ManU, Barca or RM, then debt is even more of a threat to your status than having to hover in mid table for a few years.

And even for ManU, Barca and RM that debt may one day catch up with them.

 

[SpursManChris]

Fans need to understand that unless you're ManU, Barca or RM, then debt is even more of a threat to your status than having to hover in mid table for a few years.

...or in Newcastle's case last season, on the brink of relegation. Surely he could do a little bit better. Sure he's saved them, but he could at least have brought in a proper manager.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

...or in Newcastle's case last season, on the brink of relegation. Surely he could do a little bit better. Sure he's saved them, but he could at least have brought in a proper manager.

They shouldn't have ever been in that situation, that was more about Carver's utter ineptitude (they were comfortably mid table when he took over) than Ashley's fault.

 

[SpursManChris]

They shouldn't have ever been in that situation, that was more about Carver's utter ineptitude (they were comfortably mid table when he took over) than Ashley's fault.

because they were mid table at the time it means they should have stayed there even with Carver in charge? If you hire a man with Carvers experience, a relegation fight is very easily what you can get in return. Im not quite sure what point you're trying to make.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

because they were mid table at the time it means they should have stayed there even with Carver in charge? If you hire a man with Carvers experience, a relegation fight is very easily what you can get in return. Im not quite sure what point you're trying to make.

Carver's been coaching a very long time and knows that club inside out. Didn't seem like the worst interim decision at the time, we did the same with much less experienced Sherwood and Swansea did with Monk.

 

[lenny7]

We were close to getting Ashley? Fuck me.

Yes we most certainly were, and NO TA!

 

[Marty]

Why? I thought you said the fans deserve better.

Ashley doesn't though.