Our centre backs for 2015-2016

[HoltbiusMac]

Not necessarily.
A CM 3 would offer far more protection to the defence, and they would also divide the CM tasks among them far more effectively than Mason/Bentaleb do. That would instantly address loads of the issue we see today. A more protected defence would bring out the best in all of them, and the defensive shortcomings would be drastically reduced.

Ironically, I'm not Mason's biggest fan, but in a CM 3, I would include him easily. But also Dembele, Capoue, Paulinho, Stambouli and even Eriksen could easily fill roles in CM 3.

Further up the pitch, you'd have a really decent attacking 3, with acceptable understudies. Soldado would easily fit in as Kane's back up in 433, and Lamela, Townsend, Chadli & Eriksen would alternate as the wide forwards. A possible strengthening could be a new and shiny wide forward, otherwise we are generally set for a new season, if reassembling a 433-team based on present senior and junior players.

4-3-3 isn't going to make Soldado be able to finish again, Capoue able to get on with Pochettino, Dembele able to actually use his ability to good use or Townsend make good decisions.

It might help a bit and I completely get the argument for how it might have been good to use this season to mitigate some of the issues we have had but it's not a wonder cure for all the ills in our squad.

 

[Shea]

Yeah he's a brutish ****, there's no denying that, but we could do with some more nastiness, leadership, and resolve; and ultimately I don't think he's a poor defender. Furthermore, Shawcross hasn't been delivering crippling injuries in years, so it's possible he's a) matured and b) improved the timing of his tackles such that it isn't as much of a problem.

I think shawcross is in his comfort zone at stoke and the team are set up to play to his strengths defensively

I think he would be exposed as a real donkey if he came to us

 

[DaSpurs]

I think shawcross is in his comfort zone at stoke and the team are set up to play to his strengths defensively

I think he would be exposed as a real donkey if he came to us

Possibly. I think he's vocally commanding enough that with a more disciplined midfield ahead of him in a high press, he could do plenty well enough, but that's my own speculation.

 

[Shea]

Possibly. I think he's vocally commanding enough that with a more disciplined midfield ahead of him in a high press, he could do plenty well enough, but that's my own speculation.

Well certainly vocal leadership qualities are something we lack

No one takes responsibility or organises the back line

He does seem captain material and he does seem like the time who would be able to Marshall them and create a unit at the back

Though I'd like to think we could find similar qualities in a better player - I don't think he would make the step up well

He reminds me of a throw back defender to the days of the Wimbledon crazy gang who were strong as a unit with their mentality and spirit but not cut out to play at teams with higher ambitions and pressures

We play a different game to Stoke and teams apply different tactics against us for the most part - I think he would be a terrible match for us and get left looking slow and crass without only saving qualities like Dawson had without the class of Michael

I'd personally rather look elsewhere but I don't dismiss your suggestion or profess to be a scouting expert who knows more than you - I just have a different opinion on the likelihood of this player being a success for us than you do

Realistically I can't see it happening anyway so probably moot

 

[DaSpurs]

Well certainly vocal leadership qualities are something we lack

No one takes responsibility or organises the back line

He does seem captain material and he does seem like the time who would be able to Marshall them and create a unit at the back

Though I'd like to think we could find similar qualities in a better player - I don't think he would make the step up well

He reminds me of a throw back defender to the days of the Wimbledon crazy gang who were strong as a unit with their mentality and spirit but not cut out to play at teams with higher ambitions and pressures

We play a different game to Stoke and teams apply different tactics against us for the most part - I think he would be a terrible match for us and get left looking slow and crass without only saving qualities like Dawson had without the class of Michael

I'd personally rather look elsewhere but I don't dismiss your suggestion or profess to be a scouting expert who knows more than you - I just have a different opinion on the likelihood of this player being a success for us than you do

Realistically I can't see it happening anyway so probably moot

Yeah, you're right though, very unrealistic hope.

Where else could we find such a player there? I think we're desperate for more communication from our back line, and especially a bellowing character who can clearly communicate with the midfield ahead of him. We also need a captain now, and are out of time hoping a new one would develop, as it's costing us games IMO.

So I look around and don't see another available English speaking player with such mental and leadership qualities unfortunately. I can't deny what you say about the possibility of him being exposed, as he's certainly not quick, but personally I think he's a better defender than he gets credit for and I place great emphasis on the benefit of having more communication from the back line in a full press high line system. I think not only would it improve our general play, but compensate considerably for any weaknesses along the back line.

 

[rabbikeane]

More important than what individuals that will be selected, is that they are more protected by the midfield in front of them,
and that they are a duo allowed to play together every game. This rotation of centre backs is no way to build a team upon, Ferguson never rotated his core (goalie, CBs, Keane) as that was the backbone of the team and needed to be settled.
Vertonghen and Fazio, for all their faults, had a great record when they were allowed to play together over time (was it 10 games that went really well untill we had to use Dier and break them up).
As said by others, Fazio remind me of Mertesacker and his start at Arsenal. Can see him being very solid next season if played regulary with Vertonghen, and if we bring in Schneiderlin (and perhaps also Cambiasso for depth) in the summer

 

[lukespurs7]

Actually like to get rid of Jan don't think he's good enough.
keep:
Fazio
Dier
Wimmer?
New signing for 1st team.

 

[bryanabutler]

Stones
Dier
Schar
Wimmer

 

[Gbspurs]

I happen to think people who don't think Jan is not good enough for us are stupid.

He has been pretty good ever since he joined us, but this year he has struggled under new instructions with an ever changing CB partner.

This is a player who made team of the year in his debut season.

Chances are he just isn't used to the intensive training, our incredibly long season and was already tired after the World Cup.

I think the time to judge all our players is next season and I fully expect Jan to be a standout performer next season.

 

[dontcallme]

Vertonghen, Fazio, Dier and Wimmer. We then need one extra who is ready to step in immediately.

Alderweireld looks decent. Wonder if Vlaar is an option.

Like others have said it's more important to protect the defence form midfield more rather than thinking the individuals in centre back are the problem.

With their relegation and financial problems it wouldn't surprise me if we got Caulker back on the cheap.

 

[kanes]

@Greenspur Since you dissagreed with me, why would you keep Vlad? Do you think he will come good?

 

[Greenspur]

@Greenspur Since you dissagreed with me, why would you keep Vlad? Do you think he will come good?

It's hard to say. There's definitely a lot of skill in there, and I'd like to see him given another chance.

 

[double0]

I happen to think people who don't think Jan is not good enough for us are stupid.

He has been pretty good ever since he joined us, but this year he has struggled under new instructions with an ever changing CB partner.

This is a player who made team of the year in his debut season.

Chances are he just isn't used to the intensive training, our incredibly long season and was already tired after the World Cup.

I think the time to judge all our players is next season and I fully expect Jan to be a standout performer next season.

For those that can't see what a liability Jan Vertonghen is makes me wonder... You'll alway hear the same bloody argument that he made the team of the season in his debut season, there's were the rationale been distorted and the sentiment gets in the way to the realisation. Verts made that team (and stats play a big part) playing mainly at left back..We can argue Vertonghen is probably a better left back.

Other excuses have been made to defend Superman like the constant attacks on Mason particularly and Bentlaeb, not protecting our CB's then it's all the different partnership.... Imo Jans not cut out to be a dominant CB in this league other league maybe.

 

[Dharmabum]

For those that can't see what a liability Jan Vertonghen is makes me wonder... You'll alway hear the same bloody argument that he made the team of the season in his debut season, there's were the rationale been distorted and the sentiment gets in the way to the realisation. Verts made that team (and stats play a big part) playing mainly at left back..We can argue Vertonghen is probably a better left back.

Other excuses have been made to defend Superman like the constant attacks on Mason particularly and Bentlaeb, not protecting our CB's then it's all the different partnership.... Imo Jan's not cut out to be a dominant CB in this league other league maybe.

I agree with you, and I think he was found out in his second season. He lacks toughness and pace (although many top notch CB lack pace). But that he is a talented CB there is no doubt; more talented than, say, Terry. But, however unlikableTerry is as a person, one can't doubt his non-nonsense attitude, leadership qualities and toughness on the field (I won't start a discussion about his off field antics lol) has made im one o the best CB in the history of the EPL. Vidic was another example.
I think Jan would do very well in the Bundesliga, Seri A or La Liga where the pace is a bit slower.

 

[Dharmabum]

Actually like to get rid of Jan don't think he's good enough.
keep:
Fazio
Dier
Wimmer?
New signing for 1st team.

You prefer to keep Fazio over Jan? Have you seen Fazio play?
PS! Thus said, if some club offer Spurs £18-20M for Jan and Spurs can get a top-notch CB replacement for an "affordable" price I won't mind that.

 

[prawnsandwich]

http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015...enham-hotspur-target-kevin-wimmer-is-leaving/

It is reported by Kicker that FC Koln media spokesman Frederic Latz has confirmed a clause in the deal which makes it so the deal cannot be announced until after Tottenham's final game of the season.

It is believed Tottenham did not want any of their current defenders to think they didn't have a future at the club, in order to have them playing to their full potential until the end of the campaign. Based on recent performances, that theory has not worked.

It seems Wimmer is 1st choice at Koln(?) so I can't see him coming here to play second fiddle to Verts (?)

 

[THFCSPURS19]

http://hereisthecity.com/en-gb/2015...enham-hotspur-target-kevin-wimmer-is-leaving/

It is reported by Kicker that FC Koln media spokesman Frederic Latz has confirmed a clause in the deal which makes it so the deal cannot be announced until after Tottenham's final game of the season.

It is believed Tottenham did not want any of their current defenders to think they didn't have a future at the club, in order to have them playing to their full potential until the end of the campaign. Based on recent performances, that theory has not worked.

It seems Wimmer is 1st choice at Koln(?) so I can't see him coming here to play second fiddle to Verts (?)

But we are a lot bigger than Koln and have better players, so of course he would come. It's done anyway.

 

[THFCSPURS19]

I probably should have put this in here...

Our good friend Lyall has told me that we are looking at CBs apart from Wimmer, indicating that we want another first-choice CB.

Lyall Thomas ‏@LyallThomas 46m46 minutes ago
Koln spokesman:"Wimmer will be sold but for contractual reasons we cannot say where he's going. The new club don't want that." (It's #THFC)

Yidforlife19 ‏@THFCSPURS19 35m35 minutes ago
@LyallThomas Do we want another CB? I believe you have said before that we are interested in Alderweireld.

Lyall Thomas ‏@LyallThomas 32m32 minutes ago
@THFCSPURS19 There is interest there but a deal uncertain. Wimmer is inbound, Kaboul + Chiriches highly likely to leave.

Yidforlife19 ‏@THFCSPURS19 19m19 minutes ago
@LyallThomas Cheers. Do we have other options apart from Toby?

Lyall Thomas ‏@LyallThomas 17m17 minutes ago
@THFCSPURS19 of course. The list is long.

 

[prawnsandwich]

Arunspurs watched Wimmer play his last game for Koln today:

Wimmer looks QUALITY from this 45 minutes I have watched him.

Vertonghen starting place will be under threat by him - that's guaranteed.

 

[Frozen_Waffles]

I honestly think Vertonghen flatters to decieve, he is a fantastically gifted footballer and a goodleft back, but a bit poor defensively at CB for the PL. I have lost count the amount of times he has not been directly at fault but should have done better for goals. I think the word I am looking for is weak. I can see why Poch wanted to pair him with someone like Fazio.

I have high hopes for Dier next season, I would be tempted to bring in an experienced CB to help out as well. Other than that someone mentioned John Stones as well which would be a good addition (doubt we would get him though).