Poor location, Small stadium, what's the future?

[HotTotty]

Just been looking at the updated Goolge earth and it now shows the developments at Stratfords Olympic Park and future home of the Spanners.
It got me thinking about how shit our location is in terms of being a London club, we are the furthest out of the centre of London compared to any of the other top 5 London clubs and have the worst transport links, you can understand from a business point of view why DL wants to move...


With West Ham moving to Stratford we are now arguably located in the shittest area of any of the big London teams. We are now further away from Arsenal than West Ham, stay where we are in a deprived area and in a small stadium it will only take a slip in our footballing standard to leave us languishing.. with potentially Arsenal v West Ham becoming the big North/East London derby.. slightly ironic at the moment but it could be feasible in the next few years if West Hams fan base grows as a result of cheap tickets and Leyton Orient potentially going under.




Trouble is developing the Lane only improves the stadium, still got the problem with the state of the area and bad transport.

I am pro staying at the Lane and options for moving elsewhere seem limited, just seems like we're in a bit of a crap situation, makes staying a top 4 club all the more important..

Sorry to go over old, depressing ground here, but thought the images may put things into some perspective.
Here's hoping our football prevails, as we haven't got much else going for us at the moment - apart from a lovely stadium with a cracking atmosphere and awesome fans of course :grin: why has football become such big business, would be happy to continue at the Lane as it is if it wouldn't cost us :-|

 

[brendanb50]

I can't help but feel you've taken a slightly pessimistic view of our situation...

A slip in any top flight team's footballing standards could them languishing not just us. Us being under pressure to finish fourth is nothing compared to the potential long term issues which could come from West Ham dropping from the premier league.

I'd also like to see how West Ham plan on expanding their fanbase beyond the 35,000 they rarely muster at present. Free tickets is all very well and good but financially what does that do for your bottom line? Especially if in the scenario that they drop - They will no longer command premier league away fans or television fees.

Our current situation hasn't prevented us from pushing on in a football capacity up until now. So what's changed? Nothing IMO. We've identified our next step as moving to a larger stadium and long term I assume that's still the plan. So why the doom and gloom?

 

[HotTotty]

I can't help but feel you've taken a slightly pessimistic view of our situation...

A slip in any top flight team's footballing standards could them languishing not just us. Us being under pressure to finish fourth is nothing compared to the potential long term issues which could come from West Ham dropping from the premier league.

I'd also like to see how West Ham plan on expanding their fanbase beyond the 35,000 they rarely muster at present. Free tickets is all very well and good but financially what does that do for your bottom line? Especially if in the scenario that they drop - They will no longer command premier league away fans or television fees.

Our current situation hasn't prevented us from pushing on in a football capacity up until now. So what's changed? Nothing IMO. We've identified our next step as moving to a larger stadium and long term I assume that's still the plan. So why the doom and gloom?

I'm sure West Ham wont be a threat to us anytime soon, but there may come a time, or of course they may go under, anything can happen in football!

My doom and gloom just came about from looking at Arsenal and West ham all cosy in central locations and with excellent transport links.
I'll try and be positive.. we're still in the top 4 and in with one foot in CL quater finals

 

[brendanb50]

I'm sure West Ham wont be a threat to us anytime soon, but there may come a time, or of course they may go under, anything can happen in football!

My doom and gloom just came about from looking at Arsenal and West ham all cosy in central locations and with excellent transport links.
I'll try and be positive.. we're still in the top 4 and in with one foot in CL quater finals

:grin: That's the spirit! It's Friday after all!

I think despite the mixed feelings about moving to Stratford, in a financial and growth capacity, it would have been a step forward for us.

On the other hand, i think it could still prove a bit of a stumbling block for the spammers. It's all very well and good having what will be, the best transport links in the country but if you don't have the fans to use them, it loses it's value somewhat. That coupled with the fact that half filling a stadium and watching the game from behind a running track will do nothing for the spectator experience there, i think it could prove a negative move for them.

Levy is a sensible chap and despite the WHL redevelopment being off the cards at present, I wouldn't rule it out entirely. Things change.

Although i'd say at present, we're probably still scouting out potential locations, I can't see the transport links being better than what we have at the moment? Both would need some improvement or work should we stay or go?

 

[HotTotty]

I wonder if Levy has considered Dalston/Kingsland as possible area to move.
Up and coming area, good transport links with the East London Line extension at the new Dalston Junction tube and the existing Dalston Kingsland overground, more bus routes than you could shake a stick at.
More positives, it's on the A10 so some continuity being on the same road as Tottenham High rd!
It's much more central, more central than Arsenal even.

Negatives: No space!!! that's a big one :bang:

 

[MattyP]

Charing Cross may be the centre of London, but Totteham is the centre of my world.

I'm glad we're still there and couldn't give a toss about transportation issues.

If any potential fans are put off supporting us because they have to walk 20 minutes from the tube station, then they are hardly likely to come and pay money to watch us play Wigan at home on a cold December evening anyway.

I hope and pray somehow the NDP can come back into the picture.

 

[brendanb50]

Charing Cross may be the centre of London, but Totteham is the centre of my world.

I'm glad we're still there and couldn't give a toss about transportation issues.

If any potential fans are put off supporting us because they have to walk 20 minutes from the tube station, then they are hardly likely to come and pay money to watch us play Wigan at home on a cold December evening anyway.

I hope and pray somehow the NDP can come back into the picture.

I agree, if a walk or a wait at the station is too much a price to pay to watch your team then surely there's something wrong.

I think the key is our season ticket waiting list. If we have a large number of fans willing to pay up front and want to go to as many games as possible, transport is merely a secondary issue.

 

[penfold_99]

I wonder if Levy has considered Dalston/Kingsland as possible area to move.
Up and coming area, good transport links with the East London Line extension at the new Dalston Junction tube and the existing Dalston Kingsland overground, more bus routes than you could shake a stick at.
More positives, it's on the A10 so some continuity being on the same road as Tottenham High rd!
It's much more central, more central than Arsenal even.

Negatives: No space!!! that's a big one :bang:

Why don't they just purchase the kingsland shopping centre, demolish it and then incorporate a shopping centre in to the new design. Its only got 30 shop get rid of matalan and get a massive spurs shop in there.

 

[HotTotty]

Why don't they just purchase the kingsland shopping centre, demolish it and then incorporate a shopping centre in to the new design. Its only got 30 shop get rid of matalan and get a massive spurs shop in there.

Excellent suggestion, that is a truly shit shopping centre, Ridley Market is horrible as well, I'm going to email Levy

 

[JKSpurs]

I like the area, yeah its a bit rough around the edge's but I like that. If we can improve transport links, get a new stadium on the NDP site... i'll be the happiest football fan in the world.

 

[MrWoolley]

Thread title edited. No swearing in the titles please.

 

[Bobbins]

That does look really cack on the pic with the stadiums, ours looks awful :lol:

 

[HotTotty]

Thread title edited. No swearing in the titles please.

Sorry, although edited again, the area isn't s**t or rubbish of course

 

[StanSpur]

Charing Cross may be the centre of London, but Totteham is the centre of my world.

I'm glad we're still there and couldn't give a toss about transportation issues.

If any potential fans are put off supporting us because they have to walk 20 minutes from the tube station, then they are hardly likely to come and pay money to watch us play Wigan at home on a cold December evening anyway.

I hope and pray somehow the NDP can come back into the picture.

That's pretty naive and petty. I think the transport is more of an issue if we were to ever increase our capacity - which is the crux of the debate as we surely have to. 36000 struggle to get home on the bus, train and Tube at the moment but if we double that it really would come unstuck. That is the point about our transport links, not that people won't put up with it now but more the fact that the transport links won't put up with any more of us. I agree that this is a big problem that WHL cannot truely rectify which is why i would have prefered to move - not to say it puts me off going whenever i can, i enjoy the walk from 7 sisters as it is part of my game experience but living in south london i wouldn't want a 60000 sellout CL game on a wednesday night followed by an hour queuing to get into the Tube station in the pouring rain - who would?

 

[jamesc0le]

how about redeveloping whl and building a super sporting complex around it that would be the envy of not just london or europe but the world over.

showcasing state of the art energy rich technologies and building materials, a sports science institute, gyms, pools, academies for a variety of sports

and be able to claim that it's the first entity of its size in the world that is carbon neutral, i.e all the power used in the stadium and complexes is created on site using kinetic energy technologies, aswell as solar and wind.

some athletes could even choose to train using kino-packs, small light back pack batteries charged by light leg and arm straps that create energy kinetically with the running movements, similarly in the gyms energy can be created in various ways.

that would be better than moving location, would it not

who cares about transport links, the harder it is for the prawn sandwich brigade the better



p.s above ground level!

 

[MattyP]

That's pretty naive and petty. I think the transport is more of an issue if we were to ever increase our capacity - which is the crux of the debate as we surely have to. 36000 struggle to get home on the bus, train and Tube at the moment but if we double that it really would come unstuck. That is the point about our transport links, not that people won't put up with it now but more the fact that the transport links won't put up with any more of us. I agree that this is a big problem that WHL cannot truely rectify which is why i would have prefered to move - not to say it puts me off going whenever i can, i enjoy the walk from 7 sisters as it is part of my game experience but living in south london i wouldn't want a 60000 sellout CL game on a wednesday night followed by an hour queuing to get into the Tube station in the pouring rain - who would?

Actually what is naive is people thinking having a tube station within five minutes of the ground makes any difference to the time it takes to get home.

Think about trying to get on the tube after a game at Wembley - instead of walking for 20 minutes to get the tube like at the Lane (which actually breaks up the flow as people walk at different paces, go in shops, pubs etc) all you end up doing is queuing for 20 minutes to get on the tube in the first place.

Appreciably increasing the capacity at WHL would increase the queuing, but at Stratford there'll also be the consideration of sharing the tube with the largest urban shopping centre in Europe. Would be fun on Boxing Day home games.

 

[worcestersauce]

how about redeveloping whl and building a super sporting complex around it that would be the envy of not just london or europe but the world over.

showcasing state of the art energy rich technologies and building materials, a sports science institute, gyms, pools, academies for a variety of sports

and be able to claim that it's the first entity of its size in the world that is carbon neutral, i.e all the power used in the stadium and complexes is created on site using kinetic energy technologies, aswell as solar and wind.

some athletes could even choose to train using kino-packs, small light back pack batteries charged by light leg and arm straps that create energy kinetically with the running movements, similarly in the gyms energy can be created in various ways.

that would be better than moving location, would it not

who cares about transport links, the harder it is for the prawn sandwich brigade the better

p.s above ground level!

Yeah! Fat lot of good they've done Manchester United, what have they won in the last 20 years??

 

[Adam456]

Actually what is naive is people thinking having a tube station within five minutes of the ground makes any difference to the time it takes to get home.

Think about trying to get on the tube after a game at Wembley - instead of walking for 20 minutes to get the tube like at the Lane (which actually breaks up the flow as people walk at different paces, go in shops, pubs etc) all you end up doing is queuing for 20 minutes to get on the tube in the first place.

Appreciably increasing the capacity at WHL would increase the queuing, but at Stratford there'll also be the consideration of sharing the tube with the largest urban shopping centre in Europe. Would be fun on Boxing Day home games.

Fair point about tube stations in general Matty but Stratford is an exception. Huge modern station with the following services:

Central Line
Jubilee Line
DLR
London Overground to West and South
National Overland to Liv Street and Essex
Eurostar (under construction)
Crossrail (under construction)

Hackney Wick and Pudding Mill Lane Stations are also equidistant and Stratford is also a bus and National Express coach hub with National Express services direct to Stansted Airport in 45 mins

The OS has undoubtedly the best transport links of any stadium in the UK and, arguably, Europe

 

[MattyP]

Fair point about tube stations in general Matty but Stratford is an exception. Huge modern station with the following services:

Central Line
Jubilee Line
DLR
London Overground to West and South
National Overland to Liv Street and Essex
Eurostar (under construction)
Crossrail (under construction)

Hackney Wick and Pudding Mill Lane Stations are also equidistant and Stratford is also a bus and National Express coach hub with National Express services direct to Stansted Airport in 45 mins

The OS has undoubtedly the best transport links of any stadium in the UK and, arguably, Europe

I'll reserve judgement until I try it out during the Olympics :wink:

And when I go to West Ham away in 2020 when they are next in the Premier League in their new ground.

 

[PT]

I would like to see WHL rebuilt as a viable 21st century modern stadium capable of multi-communal and sporting usage yet I was pro Stratford, based on my assumption that access would be easier for up to 60000 bodies per match.

If WHL could build a Park and Ride somewhere nearby (or Park and Walk) it would take the strain off having to arrive around two hours early to claim a car park space in some spurious business car park, charging ever increasing fees, the nearer the time gets to the game.

As it is, I travel down from Lincoln, aiming to get to the PowerLeague venue two hours before hand to ensure access to a relatively secure car parking area for a relatively sensible car park charge.

This is my main issue with adding the burden of another 25000 people wanting access to and from the stadium as it is, with the current transport infrastructure.