Ratings vs Watford

[Shea]

Can't believe Vinny only got 1 vote for MOTM

Absolutely brilliant again today

He played ok, did a lot of nice hold up and link play

But do you really think he was worthy of the MOTM award? seriously? above Son with his 2 goals and an assist? Above Trippier? Above Dele after his wonder strike?

In all honesty despite his high work rate he was still probably the worst player for us, scratch that, he was more the "least best" than the worst because as I said he played pretty well and showed a lot of heart and effort

I am shocked you're surprised he only gets one vote for MOM, I'm actually surprised he got any votes (not because he was bad but because I feel there were clearly several people more worthy on the day) I can only assume the vote was a sympathy vote or an A for Effort kind of vote

 

[fortworthspur]

The quality and vision of Trippier's passing was simply outstanding. I can't recall the last time I saw a FB produce a display of passing that was so lethal.

heck, he has a prettier cross than most attacking players. its a pleasure to watch and something, quite honestly, that most players should be able to do. like hitting a free throw.

 

[cliff jones]

Another wonderful treat today, with some superb performances.

Watford played well till the goals and we had to keep plugging away at their weaknesses, the main one obviously behind Niang who while a talent has no defensive discipline, but my word Tripps made the most of it.

Good to see Dier regaining confidence and sharpness. Lovely footwork by Alli and how that Success bloke didn't end up in the book I'll never know. Great to see HK back and to see him lay that chance Sons way, proving he's not a totally selfish git.

Shame about young Vince but we can't have everything.

Coys.

 

[tippspur59]

Trip got my vote.

 

[tony0379]

With respect, bollocks. And it's not just you - I say the same to the several people giving me negs for that post. The purpose of this thread is to rate the performance, not to cheerlead.

A representative selection of comments from the match thread in the first 33 minutes:







































Those are not selective comments I've picked out to win an argument - they were the prevailing opinion in real time in that opening third of the game, and they were essentially correct. The fact we ended up winning easily doesn't suddenly make them wrong.

Our attacking play around the D never came together today in the way it usually does. It took outstanding individual work from Trippier wide, and Dembele in the middle to create chances and retain the ball. Toby and Jan also had work to do in that period.

Our goals were not the result of our usual attacking flair, but rather from 3 shots from outside the box. (We only had 6 shots on target all game.) For those goals, Dele brought a moment of individual magic out of nowhere, and the Son & Dier goals came through excellent individual technique, and poor closing down by Watford. And the thing that killed Watford in the end was the triple-whammy of those 3 goals in quick succession. They were broken after that. The fourth goal was again due to great work by Trippier and a stunning finish from Son.

I stand by what I said 100%: not a great team performance, but 100% effort, and individuals - Son, Dele, Dembele, Trippier - with enough quality to see us through. All in all, that makes it an outstanding squad effort, but doesn't mean it was a fluid display.

I made it twice onto that list, I feel honoured.

 

[yankspurs]

Lloris - 7 not much to do
Trippier - 9 - MOTM. Fantastic today.
Toby - 7
Vertonghen - 7
Davies - 7
Dier - 8
Dembele - 7
Son - 8
Eriksen - 7
Alli - 8
Janssen - 5 - Harsh? Eh. Looked decent in spurts but gave the ball away quite a bit too and had multiple chances on goal but fucked them up. We're all desperate for him but sadly, i just dont see it. This isnt like Bobby where he had minimal chances to actually score in his first year. Vince gets quite a bit of chances but just cannot put the ball in the net. His fitness has looked much, much better recently though.

Kane - 6
Sissoko - 3 - what is it you say you do here, Moussa?
Onomah - NET but looked alot better than he has in his prior appearances

 

[southlondonyiddo]

He played ok, did a lot of nice hold up and link play

But do you really think he was worthy of the MOTM award? seriously? above Son with his 2 goals and an assist? Above Trippier? Above Dele after his wonder strike?

In all honesty despite his high work rate he was still probably the worst player for us, scratch that, he was more the "least best" than the worst because as I said he played pretty well and showed a lot of heart and effort

I am shocked you're surprised he only gets one vote for MOM, I'm actually surprised he got any votes (not because he was bad but because I feel there were clearly several people more worthy on the day) I can only assume the vote was a sympathy vote or an A for Effort kind of vote

You've got to be a special type of player to be able to hit the crossbar with your thigh from about 4 yards out

From memory I think Soldado had that knack as well

 

[THFCSPURS19]

He played ok, did a lot of nice hold up and link play

But do you really think he was worthy of the MOTM award? seriously? above Son with his 2 goals and an assist? Above Trippier? Above Dele after his wonder strike?

In all honesty despite his high work rate he was still probably the worst player for us, scratch that, he was more the "least best" than the worst because as I said he played pretty well and showed a lot of heart and effort

I am shocked you're surprised he only gets one vote for MOM, I'm actually surprised he got any votes (not because he was bad but because I feel there were clearly several people more worthy on the day) I can only assume the vote was a sympathy vote or an A for Effort kind of vote

Oh dear.

 

[Shea]

Oh dear.

?

 

[THFCSPURS19]

?

You bit.

 

[Shea]

You bit.

Well equally he wasn't shit enough today for it to be an amusing suggestion

 

[mpickard2087]

For the first 15 minutes this threatened to be a real contest. We started a tad sleepily, and they were causing us a few issues particularly tactically with their 3-4-3. Nothing worthy of panic stations, but a little bit to get jittery about how the match was unfolding.

However after the opening salvo, that was that. The game settled and the script went back to what we are becoming accustomed to. The game largely played in the oppositions half, us controlling the ball and the game, and ending up with yet another resounding and pretty routine victory. Were we at our rip-roaring best, particularly first half, probably not... But the job is pretty efficiently done. When those inevitable moments of time and space are presented they are ruthlessly exploited, as was the case with four very good goals today.

I said in the match thread at the end of the game that we're earning that status as a big club now. Turning up game after game and getting the job (often emphatically) done with a minimum of fuss and earning that fear/respect proving their is a gulf in class between us and the majority of teams in the league. Lets hope they keep working hard, producing, and this continues for a long time to come.

Individually I felt that virtually everyone had at least a really solid game. Trippier was very good but I thought Son was the best of the bunch. It's the collective though that counts, and we're really in the groove at the moment.

On to the next one...


Lloris - Was sharp in the few moments that he needed to be. Better distribution today.

Trippier - bit ropey defensively early doors, after that his attacking game came to the fore. Had a good involvement in the initial build up to the opening goal, had some nice passes and crosses, good runs and positioning, and this culminated in the 4th goal. Probably his best game in a Spurs shirt.

Alderweireld - Mostly untroubled.

Vertonghen - Ditto. Shame his legs went when leading that counter attack.

Davies - Solid game.

Dier - Just went mostly quietly about his work. Thunderous strike for the second goal.

Dembele - Solid and just went about his work in the centre of the park. Some good defensive play when needed.

Eriksen - Did what he does. Kept things ticking, and then the odd really classy moment.

Alli - Very involved first half and worked hard. Wonderful hit for the opening goal.

Son - Also had what was probably his best game in a Spurs shirt. Much, much less erratic today, was involved in build up play, found space, a constant threat, and worked hard. The two cracking finishes were the icing on the cake.

Janssen - Mixed bag. Hold up play was hit and miss, sometimes good but then other times slow or on his heels. As for the chances, first one, after a great turn, I think he should bury, but as I said earlier in the thread I think the second was unfortunate and typical that a player cant get a break when he desperately needs it. I think that second miss affected him though and he drifted out of the game after it.

Subs:

Kane - Good to see him back. Had a couple of chances and nice moments. Unlucky with the freekick right at the end, what a hit that was.

Sissoko - Ok.

Onomah - n/a.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Collective Individuality

Lets start, where we always start, with the selection and starting tactics. It won't surprise anyone to know that 4231 with Dier and Dembele in CM wouldn't have been my choice. We talked a lot in Poch's first two seasons about him needing to show some tactical diversity, and some will laud today (and Swansea's starting debacle) as Poch being "tactically diverse" in changing from the 3421 that we have used much of this season. But I think that argument would be more valid if he didn't just keep reverting to the predictable and much hackneyed fall back 4231. It would also be more valid if it could be argued that he'd tinkered to suit the opposition, but I think against a team playing 2 up front in a narrow-ish 442/433, the 3cb/wing back system is much, much better tactically. Some will point to the end result as validation, that it was all about squeezing Son and Alli (and a CF) into the same 11, but before the game started that result is irrelevant, I question the logic before the result not after.

For the first 30 minutes this game was anything but simple. Watford were tactically matching and even bettering us, their midfield was getting the better of Dier and Dembele, who were moving the ball very laboriously, and they were looking at least as likely as us to score, the massive difference though was what they had in their armoury was a couple blunderbusses, what we had in ours was AK47's, rocket launchers and surface to air missiles. And so, when we finally started to get our foot on the ball and exert some control we were able to reek merry hell on them in a 15 minute salvo that utterly destroyed their early uprising completely. The first 30 minutes possibly was narrowly theirs, the next 25 had proven to be emphatically ours. It wasn't all about our individual attacking talent, we are just not that type of team anymore, whatever we get we get because we do things pretty well collectively, and some of our defending today was very good when it had to be, but this game definitely span, if not 360, then probably 180 degrees around a couple of individual moments, the first wonderful goal by All and the third goal by Son, which effectively killed the game. As Son took possession of the ball before that third goal everyone around me was screaming for him to lay Davies in, as he was about to hit it we were all "no, no, no......yeeeeeeeees". Its one of those moments that if he doesn't score he deserves criticism, but that criticism gets quashed by another wonderful individual piece of finishing. Son then improved on that finish with the technically excellent finish from a wonderful cross by Trippier for the fourth.

Ok, so lets say, with hindsight, I can accept an argument for Poch being vindicated for shoehorning Son, All, Eriksen and a CF onto the pitch, what I found really fucking puzzling and utterly bazaar was his subs. Why the fuck is he risking Kane in a game we are winning 4-0 ? He could get another week of training into him and start him next week, and why fucking yank off Janssen, the kid desperately needs a goal, or at least to not be humiliated, he's the last player that should have come off, Alli, Son or even Eriksen could have been rested for the 35 minutes, or much better he got a free pass to give Onomah (or even Nkoudou) 35 minutes of proper football, risk free. Kane isn't the type to need 30 minutes in a game like this, he's always good to go, it's who he is. And the demoralisation of Janssen is palpable. He'd played well, and really didn't deserve the kick in the nuts. Poor psychology IMO. Then we get fucking Sissoko for Dembele, not Onomah. Just pointless, where those extra minutes could have been massive in the development of Onomah, a chance to play in his proper position, and cost Poch nothing. Instead we get Sissoko out of position. What does Ononah get, 3 fucking minutes as an Am. Pointless.

I thought Son was excellent today, not just his goals, but his all round play, he was buzzing around, drifting out and cutting in, being direct, had a hand in a couple of goals and scored the other two. I also think All had a very good game, he played a glorious pass down the right flank for Trippier, not something we've seen him do often (that long raking pass) and was far more involved than he often is in general play (42/51 passes, one of his season highs I think). Trippier of course deserves much credit, he showed once again that he's definitely better technically in the final third than Walker, he could have equalled Walker's season assists today alone. It's not just the crosses and the technically challenging ability to hit things first time (which Walker invariably doesn't have the confidence in his technique to do) it's also the little passes he plays - like the one that set Son through when he hit the bar.

As we have seen away from home this year, you can sometimes play very well and not get the breaks, today in a 15 minute phase either side of half time, everything we touched turned to gold. Even the blaster from Dier found the net, those kind of shots usually go anywhere but. And the rest of the game felt like a pre season friendly, played in balmy pre season weather. We didn't try to hard too embarrass them and they didn't try too hard to make a fight of it, why would they, they have nothing to fight for.

Individual

Lloris - Not loads to do.

Trippier - Outstanding game offensively. How Kane doesn't get on that cross I have no idea.

Alderwerield - Good when needed.

Vertonghen - Very good. nearly went on a Super-Jan run.

Davies - OK. Offensively pretty nul.

Dier - Struggled for 30 minutes, thereafter put his slippers on, lit his pipe and snuggled into his comfy armchair. Took his goal well, payed a couple of nice rangy balls, but was also a bit careless a couple of times, from 30 minutes onwards though was generally comfortable.

Dembele - Credit to him, he actually did that rare thing and burst forward in the build up to the first goal. Like Dier, struggled early on, and actually nearly played their guy clean through, but the rest of the game he was very comfortable.

Eriksen - Good game, fed Trippier well throughout.

Alli - Very good game, delicious goal.

Son - MOTM today, goals with both feet, both very different but technically excellent. What I love about Son is his two footedness - he can trip over it with both, and score wonderful goals with both. But he was excellent today, his movement was good, he was sure footed, had a hand in every goal I think. Great game.

Janssen - Another decent game, showed good movement, a nice spin, nearly played a couple of clever through balls (like the Swansea one) very unlucky not to score, but he's doing the right things. Really stupid of Poch to take him off.

Kane - Did well to set up Son, but should have nodded in Trippier's cross.

 

[Shea]

Janssen - Another decent game, showed good movement, a nice spin, nearly played a couple of clever through balls (like the Swansea one) very unlucky not to score, but he's doing the right things. Really stupid of Poch to take him off.

.

My dad said the same, although perhaps more because he thought it was stupid to risk Kane against a physical outfit in a game that was won

I thought it was the right thing to do as Kane could benefit well from the minutes and ease himself back in to action before being called upon for harder games

Although I guess it wouldn't have hurt to take Dele or someone less in need of a confidence boost off and just played Janssen and Kane together

 

[DanielJohnCosta]

The whole team has a dangerous look in its eye at present. It's the opposite of what happened late last season. We're just grinding opposing teams up at the moment, wearing them down with pressure and possession and then winning the matches with moments of individual class. The effect is relentless.

Watford played well. At half time, their performance merited being 2-1 or 1-0 down, not 3--0 with the game gone. But after the first 10-15 minutes, our defence throttled nearly all of their approach play before it could generate a chance, as it did with Swansea's and Burnley's and Southampton's.

Counting the Millwall match when he got injured, we played nearly all of 5 matches without Harry Kane. We won them all, including 2 away, and the tally was 17 goals scored and 2 conceded. Without our star striker. As the manager keeps saying, it's a team.

Perhaps we can also put to rest the "Son is not a striker" discussion. He's a striker and he can plainly score goals playing anywhere across the front line. He just needed the customary year to get accustomed to English football.

As has Janssen, who took 10 minutes today to do exactly what I was saying he has not been doing, which is to spin off a defender and shoot. As for the substitution, it took place precisely on 60 minutes and that suggests it was pre-planned, to give Kane a half-hour to stretch his legs.

Lloris: 7 Good distribution and fleet movement to snuff out chances before they became chances.

Davies: 6.5 Reliable in defence, slightly conservative in attack.

Alderweireld: 8 One moment when he tracked into the box to intercept a threatening Watford attack was especially effortless: King-esque.

Vertonghen: 8 Probably should have scored instead of falling over, but we'll cut him a break if he keeps defending like that.

Tripper: 8.5 Nearly MotM. Great passing, a rain of killer crosses, an assist and solid defensive work. A greatly improved player this season and a real asset. It's good to be able to choose from the two different styles that Walker and Trippier provide.

Dembélé: 7.5 Magisterial and controlling. He made it look easy. That's probably why he doesn't get the credit from fans that he deserves. At one point, on the edge of the box there was a ball that cried out to have his left foot put through it. But he controlled it and kept the pressure up instead. That's Dembélé.

Dier: 7.5 Very controlled passing and a goal. Looks comfortable in midfield.

Eriksen: 7 Not as dominating as against Swansea, but still busy and creative.

Alli: 8 Ridiculous goal. A menace all afternoon.

Son: 8.5 MotM, by a small margin over Trippier. Not just for the goals. His team play and first touch were also of a high standard today. And he can score from just about anywhere. I think we tend to underestimate the value of Son being two-footed. It's not just that he can use his left nearly as freely as his right, it's that he can strike hard with it and bend the ball with it. It makes him extremely hard to defend, especially when he's shifting the ball around on the edge of the box.

Janssen: 7.5 Good work and everything but the goal. Before we scored, he was dropping back in search of the ball. After we were ahead, he haunted the box, looking for gaps. Better vision than usual.


Kane: 7 Got involved immediately and could easily have scored.

Sissoko: 7 Also got involved and made some forceful, direct contributions.

Onomah: NET

How'd you get janssen a 7.5 !!?!?

 

[southlondonyiddo]

How'd you get janssen a 7.5 !!?!?

The only thing I can think of is that DM wasn't rating Vinny out of 10!!

 

[Gaz_Gammon]

How'd you get janssen a 7.5 !!?!?

That was reached by adding both the midweek and todays game and rolling it into one combined score...........

 

[Colonel_Klinck]

Saw 2/3rds of it live and then MOTD tonight. Wow this team is superb. We've had technically more gifted players in the past but never a team like this for the last 38 years I've supported Spurs. The belief and togetherness Poch has instilled in this group is incredible. We seem to have learnt the lessons from last years campaign. I don't think Chelsea will drop 7 points but if we can beat them in the semi, get to the final where I think we can take either Citeh or Arsenal and keep a maximum of 7 points behind them to the finish, it will have been an amazing season.

Trippier MOTM for me. If only Walker could deliver a ball like he does. Especially his first time efforts. Hope he gets some more starts and doesn't leave the club.

 

[isaac94]

Can't believe Vinny only got 1 vote for MOTM

Absolutely brilliant again today

Is this a joke?, he was okay, but nowhere near MOTM performance

 

[southlondonyiddo]

Is this a joke?, he was okay, but nowhere near MOTM performance

No idea what game you were watching mate. I thought he was absolutely brilliant. A cross between Berbs and Klinsmann at there best