Spurs Youth Thread 23/24

[eddiebailey]

Is it me? Or are there far more injuries this season?
And not just to us but across the board, including the women's game too.
It's a bit concerning.

Academy had a lot of injuries last season. It’s normal as developing bodies are subject to the stress of professional sport. Obviously this can be managed down but it’s not as bad as a it was in the 2000s when I swear we were training on concrete pitches. So many good prospects with career ending injuries (though on the bright side it has given us a constant supply of excellent young coaches).

 

[eddiebailey]

Ange has said bts Dier and PEH specifically have no long term future here. I really don't care if "they are fuming". It's nonsense the three you mention Dier, Skipp or PEH are more suited to the current style that some of our youngsters, that doesn't mean the youngsters are better players(yet) btw, but they are 100% more suited to Ange's way of playing and will get better. Ange keeps saying it's about the long term vision, not the now and all he's interested in is progress. Well playing players you hope won't be here past January is not long term thinking it's short term appeasement for the square pegs.

Our academy has been very very poor for a long time. One of the main reasons for that is that kids would leave very early on to other better run clubs, or they just wouldn't choose us in the first place because we had no visible progression plan in place for them. These are facts by the way, we really struggled to bring in the better youngsters over many of the other local clubs because of this very problem. We are now at a point where our academy is flourishing mostly down to FP and his vision for the youth set up and integrating them into the first team. We are at a point now where many of the older boys are being looked at by a host of clubs. It's simple really we can choose to ignore them and they can leave or we can show them there could be a future here after youth football. If we dobn't show there is a pathway we could very quickly return to the point where the kids just don't come, and that would be a catastophe imo.

The Rest Is Football podcast did an interesting segment on the dangers for coaches in freezing out popular senior pros, particularly when results start to go against you.

I think Ange has got the balance about right. He was brave in his selections at the start of the season, and after the Wolves game was brave again against Villa.

And to be honest I’m not sure any of our youngsters are ready. Donley I expect will get minutes soon, but Dorrington has a lot of mistakes in him - he needs a loan.

Others haven’t trained much with the first team under Ange, so he’s not going to trust them yet. But Conte liked Sayers, Nuno liked John and I like Soonsup-Bell, so with the injury situation as it is I hope Ange has them training regularly with the first team going forward.

I would add that the player I would feel most confident of coming in and doing a steady, professional job is Lyons-Foster. Still pissed he wasn’t given a squad place.

 

[Trix]

The Rest Is Football podcast did an interesting segment on the dangers for coaches in freezing out popular senior pros, particularly when results start to go against you.

I think Ange has got the balance about right. He was brave in his selections at the start of the season, and after the Wolves game was brave again against Villa.

And to be honest I’m not sure any of our youngsters are ready. Donley I expect will get minutes soon, but Dorrington has a lot of mistakes in him - he needs a loan.

Others haven’t trained much with the first team under Ange, so he’s not going to trust them yet. But Conte liked Sayers, Nuno liked John and I like Soonsup-Bell, so with the injury situation as it is I hope Ange has them training regularly with the first team going forward.

I would add that the player I would feel most confident of coming in and doing a steady, professional job is Lyons-Foster. Still pissed he wasn’t given a squad place.

I agree with this mate I just hope it's not a case that they are padding the squad out so that we can have competitive training sessions and they don't all get sent back down once we have had another transfer window and players are back from injury.

 

[RickyVilla]

Devine starts for Vale against Derby

 

[Locotoro]

A meritocracy isn't just about hard work, it's about the merits of one person being placed above another. That includes hard work, but also includes suitability for the role, outright talent, fitness, form, etc. etc. If, to use your example, Ange decided that our team was going to be better with Donley in it than PEH, playing Donley absolutely is meritocratic.

You're right that senior players might not like it, but it's the way the world works. They will all have been on the other side of it too - not sure who Dier will have kept out of the team when he got into it, but no doubt someone who will have felt agrieved that he was losing his place to a youngster.

I appreciate that point

If a youth player is better suited to a role than the senior player then there's a reason why he's in the team. Whilst I'm in favour of giving youth players time on the pitch to develop I don't believe it should be for the sake of it.

 

[EQP]

Tyrese Hall, Jude, Max Robson and BLF all trained with the 1st team yesterday.

Tyrese Hall Tottenham Hotspur Editorial Stock Photo - Stock Image | Shutterstock Editorial

Find the editorial stock photo of Tyrese Hall Tottenham Hotspur, and more photos in the Shutterstock collection of editorial photography. 1000s of new photos added daily.

www.shutterstock.com

Jude Soonsup-bell Tottenham Hotspur Editorial Stock Photo - Stock Image | Shutterstock Editorial

Find the editorial stock photo of Jude Soonsup-bell Tottenham Hotspur, and more photos in the Shutterstock collection of editorial photography. 1000s of new photos added daily.

www.shutterstock.com

Max Robson Tottenham Hotspur Editorial Stock Photo - Stock Image | Shutterstock Editorial

Find the editorial stock photo of Max Robson Tottenham Hotspur, and more photos in the Shutterstock collection of editorial photography. 1000s of new photos added daily.

www.shutterstock.com

 

[Ghost Hardware]

Devine starts for Vale against Derby

Anyone know how he was?

 

[kd2000]

Anyone know how he was?

3rd best rated Port Vale Player, 6th most touches in their team, 1 shot on target, one key pass. Passing accuracy of 76.7%

 

[Lilywhite Rose]

France U15 Call up for #thfc schoolboy player Melvin Emmanuel Karbongolo. Was in the last England U15 squad.

International battle for the talented youngster

 

[EQP]

Watch Under-21s take on Manchester United live on SPURSPLAY on Saturday | Tottenham Hotspur

Watch live Premier League 2 action on SPURSPLAY this Saturday as our Under-21s take on Manchester United at Hotspur Way (kick-off 1pm UK).

www.tottenhamhotspur.com

U21 game against Manchester United will be on Spurs play tomorrow.

Will be interesting to see which players start tomorrow considering we need cover on the bench for our game on Sunday.

 

[Romulus]

im sure they'll all play, considering Ange has shown no commitment to giving them any minutes

 

[Silky Skills]

im sure they'll all play, considering Ange has shown no commitment to giving them any minutes

Fully behind Ange but this is the one thing that irritates me, throwing the energy of a Donley on against Wolves may have seen us get a point but we will never know - waiting to be cruising at 3-0 up until you bring on the youth may never happen

 

[eddiebailey]

 

[Locotoro]

To those that watch the youths could someone answer objectively. Are any of these players currently good enough or is it a case that they aren't but have the potential to be good enough?

I heard on a podcast that Dorrington and Phillips are good but definitely a step down in quality from Dier, at this moment, even in this system that he seems unsuited for

 

[Spurzinho]

To those that watch the youths could someone answer objectively. Are any of these players currently good enough or is it a case that they aren't but have the potential to be good enough?

I heard on a podcast that Dorrington and Phillips are good but definitely a step down in quality from Dier, at this moment, even in this system that he seems unsuited for

If he wasn't injured then I think Santiago would have made the bench. I don't see him establishing himself with us long-term but he's a very decent squad option for the next 12 months. I think he offers more than the very one dimensional and frustrating Solomon, and I don't think he'd get bullied the way Bryan Gil does. Still, squad player at best. Donley is ready now, he can score goals for fun and he's really clever with his movement and passing. Yes, he'll not be as consistent as Maddison, but Maddison is at his peak. Donley is 100% going to get better and better and should be given plenty of opportunities between now and the end of the season. Its on us. If Donley doesn't kick on, its not because the talent wasn't there, its because we wasted it. I agree with the podcaster that Dorrington and Phillips are not quite there yet but there's huge potential. They would both benefit from spending the second half of the season out on loan so they're ready to compete next season. Beyond those players I'm not sure anyone else is ready to become a regular squad member. In a pinch I'd be more than happy to have Matthew Craig covering at number 6 in the Biss/PEH role but I don't think he's going to improve enough to displace them. Other than Devine, who we all know about, everyone else still has a fair bit to do to convince me they are ready to be involved.

 

[Locotoro]

If he wasn't injured then I think Santiago would have made the bench. I don't see him establishing himself with us long-term but he's a very decent squad option for the next 12 months. I think he offers more than the very one dimensional and frustrating Solomon, and I don't think he'd get bullied the way Bryan Gil does. Still, squad player at best. Donley is ready now, he can score goals for fun and he's really clever with his movement and passing. Yes, he'll not be as consistent as Maddison, but Maddison is at his peak. Donley is 100% going to get better and better and should be given plenty of opportunities between now and the end of the season. Its on us. If Donley doesn't kick on, its not because the talent wasn't there, its because we wasted it. I agree with the podcaster that Dorrington and Phillips are not quite there yet but there's huge potential. They would both benefit from spending the second half of the season out on loan so they're ready to compete next season. Beyond those players I'm not sure anyone else is ready to become a regular squad member. In a pinch I'd be more than happy to have Matthew Craig covering at number 6 in the Biss/PEH role but I don't think he's going to improve enough to displace them. Other than Devine, who we all know about, everyone else still has a fair bit to do to convince me they are ready to be involved.

Your comments on Santiago are interesting.
Why do you think he's a good option but only short term? Especially if he's potentially a better option than both Gil and Solomon

 

[lincspurs]

Every time I’ve seen him I’ve been impressed with BLF, whether he’s been played in midfield or CB, he always seems to have composure, strength & pace. However it seems that it’s not a popular opinion as whenever prospects are mentioned he very rarely is.

 

[HarryKane]

He's been mentioned for a long time as one to watch but I think he's had a lot of injury problems, must be at least 2 or 3 big injuries keeping him out for extended periods over the last 5+ years? When he's fit and doing well he's been called a "Rolls Royce" defender, but looking it up he's 23 now. For perspective he's 6 months older than VdV, 2 years older than Udogie and Sarr, 6 months younger than Deki, 4.5 years older than Dorrington and Phillips etc

Would be great to see him be a regular here but he has to be playing senior football week in week out to keep progressing now. Next season he's too old to play U23s as an actual U23, he'll be one of the 3 allowed seniors in the squad if he does play and that's not the level he should playing

 

[Spurzinho]

Your comments on Santiago are interesting.
Why do you think he's a good option but only short term? Especially if he's potentially a better option than both Gil and Solomon

I think we have to be planning on bringing in a high-level left winger in order to balance the team out and push on. I don't think Santiago is going to get to that level but he might offer more from the bench than Bryan and definitely Solomon, who are both going to continue to struggle in the Premier League, imho.

 

[Krafty]

There must be an element of ‘you only get better by playing a better opponent’. It’s an interesting question as to whether young players do actually show they are premier League quality/ready when in an U23/youth match.

When considering other clubs and the youth that has come through, did they look head and shoulders their teammates and opponents in the U23 matches? Or did they get a chance in the first team and that’s where they proved it (or not)?

Playing it the other way, if Dier or PEH or Solomon played in an U23 match, would there be a clear sizeable difference in performance between them and the youngsters around them? Maybe, maybe not so much.