The beginning of the end...

[stevenurse]

You can paint whatever context you wish, but he somehow kept an injury-devastated squad together, had to navigate us through the Wembley move, still managed top 4, CL final...yeah sure, the papering over the cracks argument! Them's some big fucking cracks!

Also, Poch's "philosophy and approach" to the game has also seen us play some of the most "attractive football" we've ever played. Think we need just a little patience right now.

The fall started with selling Walker. Not saying we shouldn't have, but that felt like a big moment. Especially as it completely changed our whole way of playing. We've played horrible football for the most part for the last 2 seasons. When was the last time you watched spurs (against anyone half decent) and went "wow, that was incredible"?

The last season at the lane was the last time for me. Since then it's been mostly shite. Despite getting results, the football has been rubbish

 

[Joeyboey]

This is my major frustration. We spend the first 20 mins with no tempo, aggression or purpose. Happy to tippy tap it side to side in our own half racking up possession %

Brendan Rogers would get more out of this team right now. What an awful thing to say. But it's true. The year he nearly won the league at Liverpool they must have scored in the first 10 minutes a dozen or more times. They absolutely flew out of the blocks. Please someone do the stats and see how many goals in the first 15 we've scored in the last 2 seasons. You could maybe even extend that to the whole of the first half.

When you piss about doing that, and don't defend properly ala villa and Newcastle, you've thrown away 20 mins and suddenly everything becomes rushed/frantic/desperate. Not saying we could so that every week, but Newcastle at home is as winnable as they come in this league

Completely agree. No energy, intensity, urgency. Where has the press gone? The desire the win the ball back and do so in dangerous areas.

I don’t recognise the football we’re attempting to play at the moment and feels like we’re genuinely having a huge identity crises.

 

[Phomesy]

I don’t remember anyone asking those questions when we won in Amsterdam. Call me cynical but I doubt any of this thread would have been said if we won yesterday by a few goals. So bottom line while everyone seems to be reflecting on long periods of disappointment this is nothing other than a knee jerk reaction to a single loss.

Yeah I'm a bit wary of this "lost the dressing room" angle. It's possible of course - but it's not reflected in yesterday's game. It wasn't lack of adherence to team rules that did for us yesterday. It was lack of inspiration and perhaps a drop off of %5 in pressing effort to create real panic in their backline. Which could be explained by heat and complacency.

We have problems but watching the game I never thought "These guys don't want to play for Poch or play his way any more".

I might be wrong but onions etc...

 

[Tonio]

You can paint whatever context you wish, but he somehow kept an injury-devastated squad together, had to navigate us through the Wembley move, still managed top 4, CL final...yeah sure, the papering over the cracks argument! Them's some big fucking cracks!

Also, Poch's "philosophy and approach" to the game has also seen us play some of the most "attractive football" we've ever played. Think we need just a little patience right now.

Just out of interest, when would your patience run out? What would have to happen?

 

[DCSPUR]

Take. A. Breath.

Ali Gold's article should really be the viewpoint to grasp on to right now. It makes complete sense and gives an insight into the mind of Pochettino. We know that in his time here, you're either all-in or all-out. If you aren't completely with the "project," you are quickly ostracized, even if it's at the detriment to the overall quality on the pitch. Pochettino is a firm believer in the sum being greater than the parts. A team in unison, working towards the same goal, will always outperform individual performers.

Looking back since January 2019, there's some obvious reasons for the drop in form. We lost Harry Kane for 17 games last season, beginning in January 2019. Dele, one of our top 3 goal scorers typically, missed 16 games from January on and was always struggling to get 100% fit. Eric Dier and Harry Winks, two players I'm sure Poch was relying on heavily in midfield, missed at least 12 games each over that span. It doesn't just stop there, though. The knock-on effect sees players like Sissoko, Son, Moura, Eriksen, etc. all relied upon to play minutes that far exceed what should be typically necessary. Add in to that a Champions League Final run, that always took precedence (and rightfully so) in Poch's mind, our League form suffered as a result.

Add in to that difficulty with maintaining even acceptable quality of play at RB and zero (0, zilch, nada) investment in the squad over the whole year, people are still surprised we struggled mightily?

I'm with Poch until the end. I don't know any other manager/coach that could have really weathered the storm that was last season and still put us in a position to be one quality performance away from the most coveted trophy in club football and Top 4 (weak opposition, or not).

WINNER

 

[Lighty64]

The most concerning thing is our lack of intensity, pressing and movement.

It's been going on since the turn of the year and doesn't look like changing.

If we keep going the way we're going we'll be in the bottom half of the table for most of the season.

Nevermind players settling in, it's the same core of players who look way too lethargic as a collective unit.

That's with Poch to fix. But it's not sustainable.

you would struggle to press when there is 10 men behind the ball. I agree with movement, and feel when we are wide we don't try and get to the byeline and get crosses in

 

[fortworthspur]

we havent started the same 11 in consecutive games since I cant remember. We havent had Dele and Kane in the same side for months save the CL final. On top of that we have 3 first teamers that may be off before the window closes. I dont think its hard to understand why we are struggling ATM and believe it will get better once Poch knows what he has to work with week in week out and our acquisitions settle in. My only concern is how dependent we are on Eriksen.

 

[shelfboy68]

This is the most frustrating thing, but I suppose being a spurs fan you kinda have to expect it. So much promise, for there ALWAYS to be something to get in the way and derail it. This season should have had nothing but positively about it. Basically breaking our transfer record twice, first full season in the new stadium, players having a proper break and preseason, yet 3 games in its all seemingly going to shit already. Time will tell but if the rumours about Poch are true, the best thing to do would be pull the trigger now.

I'd never have considered that a year ago, and always said he was the one person we couldn't afford to lose. The way its become, and the size we are/the infrastructure we have would make me confident we could attract nearly anyone we wanted. We are a near perfect job when you think about it. Poch needs to give his head a wobble and realise how lucky he is to be at Spurs.

For all the progress we've made, and I see that far more importantly that winning trophies (at least over the last 4/5 years) he still hasn't won anything, and has failed when the opportunity arose to do so we have flattered to decieve. His record recently against the big sides is poor too. Maybe he's believing the hype that isn't really that justified in the 'top tier manager' bracket yet

Agree with this we have one step forward and it's always three backwards as for poch leaving I don't think it will happen but if anything was to go down quickly then I suppose the international break would be an opportunity if that was the case.
As for poch being a top tier manager I think the criteria for that is a CV of success usually at different clubs in different countries, he has never won fuck all yet so can't be considered top tier imo.

 

[Metalhead]

Klopp is so much lighter around the situation.
Poch gets heavy at times and this creates tension. Sure a win helps but quality of play is so much more important for confidence.

Definitely. I think that a lot can be forgiven if the team is playing well.

 

[Tonio]

Im sorry mate but how long do you give it so that its not knee jerk? And Sundays performance did not start then, its just the latest in a long line of poor performances, poor management and strange decisions...shall we give it till Xmas when we may well be 15 points off top 4?

We are no longer a small club for many reasons that we all know, therefore we have to be ruthless and as i said this didnt start Sunday....

This this this this.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

My only concern is Eriksen .

I like your world. It's a sweet place.

 

[shelfboy68]

you would struggle to press when there is 10 men behind the ball. I agree with movement, and feel when we are wide we don't try and get to the byeline and get crosses in

Well Appa mate we put 38 in yesterday and didn't get on the end of one that is damming along with embarrassing and unbelievable something is clearly not right.

 

[Phomesy]

Even if we accept the CE situation, believe that Jan is injured and what ever else, why the fuck are we playing like we are and struggling at home to Villa and Newcastle???

We didn't struggle against Villa. We absolutely dominated them from start to finish.

And we dominated Newcastle too. It wasn't effort lacking it was inspiration. That is as much down to Poch's team selection I suppose but not evidence of players "not playing for him".

In that time we've also got results against City and some European giants.

Once we're injury free we can assess. But I can't be the only one perturbed by how easily we are torching a manager who has got us to where we are.

Maybe it's the supporters letting the team down. There was no "12th man" at WHL yesterday. Can't imagine what Lo celso made of it...

 

[Primativ]

we havent started the same 11 in consecutive games since I cant remember. We havent had Dele and Kane in the same side for months save the CL final. On top of that we have 3 first teamers that may be off before the window closes. I dont think its hard to understand why we are struggling ATM and believe it will get better once Poch knows what he has to work with week in week out and our acquisitions settle in. My only concern is how dependent we are on Eriksen.

We aren't just struggling at the moment though, we have clearly been struggling for a year! Do you not remember the piss poor performances nearly every single week last season?

 

[Tonio]

Then why didn't you said this before then. Why wait until sunday result? We are bigger cub thanks to Poch not levy. I don't think so we will be in this scenario which you are saying.

Sorry but this post is bollocks. We are not a bigger club thanks to Poch. Is it because of Poch we have a 62 thousand seat stadium?

 

[Pauleta01]

I don’t think it is Poch, other than maybe his unrealistic position over recruiting. When you look at the team yesterday, the problems start with the full backs, KWP is not good enough and never will be and Rose is simply not the player he was. This coupled with a failure to replace Dembele who always broke the lines for us and beat a man to create space for Ali and Eriksen means we are now so much more one dimensional. The team is also older and less pace. We just have not replaced and replenished. I am actually frustrated from afar with Levy for not supporting player trading more, all good teams regenerate before they need to, we have not!

In saying all that, travelling home from the match yesterday I had this overwhelming feeling of a chapter coming to the end, and that I don’t think we are going to be very good this year.

 

[Primativ]

We didn't struggle against Villa. We absolutely dominated them from start to finish.

And we dominated Newcastle too. It wasn't effort lacking it was inspiration. That is as much down to Poch's team selection I suppose but not evidence of players "not playing for him".

In that time we've also got results against City and some European giants.

Once we're injury free we can assess. But I can't be the only one perturbed by how easily we are torching a manager who has got us to where we are.

Maybe it's the supporters letting the team down. There was no "12th man" at WHL yesterday. Can't imagine what Lo celso made of it...

Sorry but that is fanciful. We dominated Newcastle? 3 shots in 90 minutes, 2 on target? If we dominated Newcastle, what on earth did City do to us last week?

You don't think there was a lack of effort? I thought there was a clear lack of effort, particularly movement. The team had no faith, no confidence. There was also a clear lack of strategy, idea, game plan, fluidity, technique, creativity, and a dozen other things you need to win football matches.

Funny how people can see such different things.

 

[Lighty64]

Well Appa mate we put 38 in yesterday and didn't get on the end of one that is damming along with embarrassing and unbelievable something is clearly not right.

to be honest when they had on average of 6-8 bodies in the area every time a good chance they will get to most of them. we might of had 38 crosses but only 3 possibly 4 went to our players who failed to connect

 

[Coco-1101]

Sorry but this post is bollocks. We are not a bigger club thanks to Poch. Is it because of Poch we have a 62 thousand seat stadium?

So west ham is bigger than Liverpool and City and Everton e.t.c

 

[ohtottenham!]

The fall started with selling Walker. Not saying we shouldn't have, but that felt like a big moment. Especially as it completely changed our whole way of playing. We've played horrible football for the most part for the last 2 seasons. When was the last time you watched spurs (against anyone half decent) and went "wow, that was incredible"?

The last season at the lane was the last time for me. Since then it's been mostly shite. Despite getting results, the football has been rubbish

The fall's also related to blank transfer windows and lack of funds to reinforce sorely needed squad deficiencies - players getting run into the ground as a result.

We actually have Ndombele and Lo Celso now, Sess too. I'd have loved a right back signing, but maybe next window. There is actually some cause for optimism, but it'll take a little time if Poch's given the chance, which he deserves.