The Daily ITK Discussion Thread - 7th and 8th June 2014

[$hoguN]

Absolutely agreed. Townsend's biggest obstacle is that he made the mental leap to glory far too prematurely, and AVB said himself Townsend wasn't even really ready for a call-up. It, and all the subsequent media attention, heavily affected his game.

Nine loan stints, some not at all successful (Watford), gets a Prem loan, does well, Spurs starter, England darling, injured, comes back to a tactical mess in which inverted wingers aren't really even used. All this in the span of 18 months after all those loans. I don't care who you are or what you know, that kind of psychological ride will fuck with any head.

No his biggest obstacle is what is missing between his ears. The amount of times this season we were in good attacking positions only for him to cut inside and whack a shot from 30 yards that threatened the crowd more than the goal was ridiculous. People are just making excuses for him. Last season he did nothing of note for us other than being a very direct runner. If you compare him to the likes of Oxlade-Chamberlin and Sterling you can see just how bad his end product is.

I really want him to succeed but if I am honest with myself I think he needs too much development to be a good option for us. We have better prospects such as Pritchard and Kane who merit squad places over him. I think it is a bit like the Caulker deal, yes we would like to develop him, but if we get a good offer it makes plenty of sense to move him on.

 

[ilikeost]

So did JJ get abducted or something? His last tweet was made on the 29th.

 

[DaSpurs]

No his biggest obstacle is what is missing between his ears. The amount of times this season we were in good attacking positions only for him to cut inside and whack a shot from 30 yards that threatened crowd more than the goal was ridiculous. People are just making excuses for him. Last season he did nothing of note for us other than being a very direct runner. If you compare him to the likes of Oxlade-Chamberlin and Sterling you can see just how bad his end product is.

Very well then, let's compare him to those two. Were their careers on such an accelerated pace in 18 months?

 

[$hoguN]

Interesting that Pochettino would like Schneiderlin. I wonder if he wants to play with 2 DMs, which would make Dembele the most likely man out the door or if he wants to replace a DM meaning it could be Sandro

 

[SpurSince57]

I tell you what really didn't help Townsend. Scoring that long ranger for England. It compounded the notion in his head that he can be the next Bale. A dynamic, goal scoring winger who can pile drive them in from 30 yards. Bale started attempting those later in his career once he'd learnt how to play football first.

All Townsend needs is some proper coaching. Not so much technical or physical, but mental coaching. He has the raw skills and talent but doesn't use his brain enough. Sterling, another young, English starlet is a great example. Has pretty much the same raw talents as Townsend, but is far ahead of him in terms of a footballing brain. Got to credit Rodgers for that, not sure if he'd be the same player under different leadership.

Or, just has a brain? And can run and shoot without looking at his feet? Sterling has looked a couple of classes above Turnip from the off (a better comparison would be between Sterling 2013-14 and Lennon 2005-06), so I'm not sure what Bodgers had to do with it.

Sorry, Turnip gets A for effort, but, as B-C posted a while ago, it's hard to remember a player who's put in so much effort for so little end product. Lennon is monumentally, maddeningly frustrating and deserves and needs a massive boot up the arse, but still has far more strings to his bow.

 

[$hoguN]

Very well then, let's compare him to those two. Were their careers on such an accelerated pace in 18 months?

That such a bullshit argument. Plenty of players get thrust into the limelight and have plenty of success. Just picking PL players over the last 3 years we can say that Sterling has, Barkley has, Shaw has and many more.

 

[DaSpurs]

I really want him to succeed but if I am honest with myself I think he needs too much development to be a good option for us. We have better prospects such as Pritchard and Kane who merit squad places over him. I think it is a bit like the Caulker deal, yes we would like to develop him, but if we get a good offer it makes plenty of sense to move him on.

And how is it you propose that you can possibly make such a judgement upon Pritchard vs Townsend given he's played all of five minutes in the Premier League?

 

[DaSpurs]

That such a bullshit argument. Plenty of players get thrust into the limelight and have plenty of success. Just picking PL players over the last 3 years we can say that Sterling has, Barkley has, Shaw has and many more.

If this is your manner of conducting a debate, I think we're done here. I don't waste time with the deliberately close-minded. Hope you enjoy the rest of your evening though.

 

[Drexl]

Where's the ITK that says he's disruptive?

http://www.spurscommunity.co.uk/ind...eats-5th-june-2014.109662/page-9#post-4061369

 

[Qualsonic]

http://www.spurscommunity.co.uk/ind...eats-5th-june-2014.109662/page-9#post-4061369

Fair enough, hadn't seen that.

That's good ITK, the best random kind.
Not sure how kosher, but good nonetheless.

 

[spursfan77]

I tell you what really didn't help Townsend. Scoring that long ranger for England. It compounded the notion in his head that he can be the next Bale. A dynamic, goal scoring winger who can pile drive them in from 30 yards. Bale started attempting those later in his career once he'd learnt how to play football first.

All Townsend needs is some proper coaching. Not so much technical or physical, but mental coaching. He has the raw skills and talent but doesn't use his brain enough. Sterling, another young, English starlet is a great example. Has pretty much the same raw talents as Townsend, but is far ahead of him in terms of a footballing brain. Got to credit Rodgers for that, not sure if he'd be the same player under different leadership.

Townsend himself has said earlier this year he hasn't been coached on his game for 2 years. All they've done at the clubs he's been at is prepare for games with no individual training. It looks like it doesn't it?

 

[markieboy]

The really interesting thing is that apparently Poch's first choice was Schneiderlin, But was told no way. Which has had me thinking all day is there smoke to the Sandro rumours, maybe doesn't fancy him. Seems to be a lot of dialogue between both clubs though. Strangely it seems Lovren is ok to leave before the new manager is appointed, where as the owners are quite adamant that they need to hire the new boss before decisions on Shaw and Lallana are made.

Its no surprise to me, Schneiderlin is an excellent player and better than any DM we currently have.

 

[loaderspurs]

Its no surprise to me, Schneiderlin is an excellent player and better than any DM we currently have.

Hmmm, don't agree myself. Capoue > schneiderlin

 

[Shadydan]

I think there are legitimate concerns around our DM position.
Sandro hasn't yet shown he has recovered either form or fitness from his knee blowing out, Capoue has been plagued by fitness issues and attitude rumours whilst Paulinho isn't a pure DM and Dembele has also had injury problems and isn't really a DM either

Schneiderlin is just that: a pure DM and has no injury issues. Poch being a defender will know that solidity is key to his possible success and may well want to get someone in. Schneiderlin at 24 has good years ahead of him.

Ironically, and I appreciate this is Kryptonite to some, the player that most resembles Schneiderlin based on last season is Bentaleb. Pull their stats apart and they are nearly identical in what they did in albeit VERY different systems.

I agree, said the same thing on here last week and some poster sneered at it...

Bentaleb has all the tools to become a regista with us, I don't know why some fans can't see it.

 

[Madcatman1977]

This thread is shit now...what's happened to it?

 

[Gbspurs]

This thread is shit now...what's happened to it?

It's Sunday bruv.

 

[allatsea]

This thread is shit now...what's happened to it?

You posted in it ? ;

 

[Dr Know]

You had a shit in it ? ;

Fixed

 

[StanSpur]

Hmmm, don't agree myself. Capoue > schneiderlin

It's all opinion but the French manager doesn't agree with you

 

[StanSpur]

As far as the talk about lovren goes. I was very impressed with him this season. Seems to have all the attributes of a top cb. Loves to tackle (although sometimes a bit borderline sliding in) has good feet and can move forward with the ball, distribution isn't bad but can be prone to the odd Dawson-esque diagonal ball and of course he gets goals from set pieces (but then our current lot could if the Tottenham corner curse didn't affect all the talent we bring into the club!). As a partner for verts at the back I think he'd be great with chiri as backup (I'm also hoping the talk of labours demise is premature and he gets back to 90% pre injury standard and then we have 4 top quality CBs for the season)