The Deadline Day ITK Discussion Thread - 1st September

[Gpnash84]

Glad the window is over. Signing players is fun but the window does have a dementing effect on us as fans. Personally think we’ve done ok. Would have loved a centre back and hojbjerg > Gallagher trade up but the rebuild is well underway and all the major signings we’ve made have had a clear impact on upgrading the first team. We only have 17 games until the next window so hopefully we can avoid key key injuries and add a few more in Jan.

 

[mr ashley]

Why does it being an ongoing problem mean that it's bs? That doesn't make any sense. Even if other clubs don't have the same problem, it doesn't mean it's not a problem for us. The same players have gone out on loan and not been able to secure permanent deals for multiple seasons in a row. That isn't bs, it's clearly happening. There are a multitude of reasons that factor into that, maybe the players aren't that good, attitude isn't good enough, wages are too much for lesser clubs, they don't want to go to the options permanently that are on offer, we are asking too much. It could be a mix of all those things, but so many just assume it's all about us asking too much. Which sometimes I'm sure is true, but we also know that we've accepted deals for a number of these players to then reject the moves.

Part of the reason we have it so bad, is that we had a period of time where the club had no direction and we were just picking up players for the sake of it. We are now paying the price for it. The thing that astounds me is that people can see that, but then want us to just get ANYONE in on the final day, even though that's just going to cause the same problems to repeat. I don't believe the needing to sell before we buy is about the finances, it's about squad management and trying to not get into this position again in the future.

I have full faith in Davies or Sanchez doing a job for an extended amount of time, if it's just one of them, in an otherwise well oiled machine. Davies has been nothing but a solid and dependable player for us, can cover LCB and LB, and Sanchez was destroyed by Jose and Conte. Sanchez is a good defender, but if you make him sit on the edge of the penalty box and give him the ball with no options he, like many other players, will look BAD.

I don't know that there were any clear reports that we were interested in Bella-Kotchap, I assume he was being offered first team football with PSV? And I get the sense that all of our attempts at bringing a CB in yesterday, were, like Gallagher, dependent on a player going out to free up the space.

I think it’s important to understand that claims of Davies being able to function at cb are optimistic at best.
playing LCB in a defensive back 3 is vastly different to being playing LCB in a pressing back 4.
so let’s be clear- he’s never done it.
huge risk to expect it to work

 

[Albertbarich]

It seemed like he was going to Atletico all summer, problem is they needed to get their business done, and didn't til yesterday.

£30m for Højbjerg is really cheap. I know loads of people here don't like him, but look at how much midfielders have been going for this summer.

No it's cheap in your opinion., that's all it is , your opinion.

The market would dictate otherwise as it was the highest bid we have and the team that wanted him the most refused to pay anywhere near it.

At the start of the summer I suggested like you he was worth 40 odd million and got shot down so I'm not offering my opinion on the player as it's irrelevant. He is worth what someone is willing to pay and at the end of the day the best offer he had was Fulham and that's in a market where Bayern, Liverpool and Man United were all desperate for defensive midfielders so you can't put it down to Europe being skint.

Unless someone matches that 30 million in January which is hugely unlikely as he probably isn't going to play then he will have a year left and will be a year older having barely played so his value will really drop.

My point is it wasn't compromise if we felt it was cheap it was desperation to accept as we were in last chance saloon.

 

[Albertbarich]

I think it’s important to understand that claims of Davies being able to function at cb are optimistic at best.
playing LCB in a defensive back 3 is vastly different to being playing LCB in a pressing back 4.
so let’s be clear- he’s never done it.
huge risk to expect it to work

My hope is Romero can do a job there which would allow Sanchez to play right side where he is nowhere near as bad.

 

[mr ashley]

add Sessegnon and Gil to the list

Not sure I agree with this. Can see sessegnon being useful at lb and being asked to play similarly to udogie.
just needs an arm round the shoulder it would appear.
Hopefully ange will man-manage him better.

 

[coy-spurs1882]

Sess yes but Gil needs time with Ange and then see after that.

iirc there was ITK (POK?) saying that Gil could leave in this window

 

[mr ashley]

My hope is Romero can do a job there which would allow Sanchez to play right side where he is nowhere near as bad.

Any injury to vdv puts us under considerable pressure.
we either have to rejuvenate our defence, play people out of position or rely on academy players.

 

[coy-spurs1882]

Not sure I agree with this. Can see sessegnon being useful at lb and being asked to play similarly to udogie.
just needs an arm round the shoulder it would appear.
Hopefully ange will man-manage him better.

His fitness is a huge concern though

 

[SirHarryHotspur]

Am I missing something, I keep reading about the failed PEH move to Fulham , surely that was dependent on Palhinha going to Bayern which collapsed , one transfer collapses and others follow suit, can't blame anyone at Spurs for that or can you?

 

[mr ashley]

I’ve got to be honest I don’t know why we bothered selling Kane.
If we aren’t spending the money we got for him we should have just kept him
That way we’d have better performances this season and a reason for not signing people.

 

[mr ashley]

His fitness is a huge concern though

Well yeah duh he’s injured right now. Playing back up to udogie puts a lot less pressure on him

 

[tottenhamlad]

There's a balance.

I think it's ridiculous to say we're not geared up for success.

We threw massive salaries at Jose and Conte to try and bring success.

We've spent A LOT of money on players over the past few windows.

This window we've spent £40m on Maddison, close to another £40m on VDV, almost £50m on Johnson. It's not like we're not doing anything.

There's a balance.

I think it's ridiculous to say we're not geared up for success.

We threw massive salaries at Jose and Conte to try and bring success.

We've spent A LOT of money on players over the past few windows.

This window we've spent £40m on Maddison, close to another £40m on VDV, almost £50m on Johnson. It's not like we're not doing anything.

We like the idea of it but it isn't at the core ethos of the club.

Perfect example of this is sacking Mourinho before a cup final as you don't want to pay him a bonus if he wins it.

That just highlights the ultimate concern all the time.

We did OK in the transfer window like I said. We did sell Harry Kane mind for 100 million and are sticking two transfers we made in January into the equation to give us any net spend.

Chelsea on the other hand have gone and dropped a billion quid to try and compete. Aimlessly may I had but at least they are trying to compete. Arsenal as well are really pushing with success on the pitch the main driving factor.

I don't hate the ownership as much as some on here but we need to accept the way it is going to be until they are gone.

 

[mil1lion]

It was always going to take multiple windows to sort the squad out. No wait, we started multiple windows ago. I think this is the same logic as counting Porro and Kulusevski as signings across multiple windows. So do we keep saying this at every window? Just need another 2 or 3 windows starting now.

This was the window to finish the rebuild. Selling Kane gave us the injection to seriously do that. We could have got another CB sorted (it shouldn't be that hard to improve on Sanchez or Dier) and a centre forward. The signings were good before we sold Kane. I could even live with selling Kane if we spent the money on a centre forward and a centre back. I can even live with some players still here as we don't have Europe and shouldn't need a full 25 man squad to be used.

It was a relatively good window. The first team looks strong but still question marks over the centre forward position. I like our options at full back, central midfield and wide attack. I worry about the depth at CB most and Kane sized hole up front. Centre forward could be ok though given our attacking nature. We could do what City did so well before selling Haaland without a true centre forward. Still having Dier and Sanchez for centre back cover is crazy though.

To make it a great window and to really push us on we needed at least 1 more CB, replacement for Hojbjerg with a better fit and a centre forward. Now I would say for next year I would look to get 2 CBs and let Sanchez and Dier run their contract out. Replace Davies unless he does well this season in this system. Replace Hojbjerg with someone who fits better. Possibly a centre forward depending how Richarlison and Son do up top.

 

[Vwbottom]

I think the Saudi’s will break the transfer record this window…….


…..on N’Dombele………

….. but it’s probably worth noting that I am rather mad.

 

[glacierSpurs]

Well yeah duh he’s injured right now. Playing back up to udogie puts a lot less pressure on him

Unfortunately he always has this pressure put onto himself. So many time I have forgotten about him until someone mentioned him. Pinning hope on Sess shows what's wrong with us on so many levels - medical department, scouting department, transfer decision making etc. How many times have we said Sess will be like a new signing when he's already here for like what, 3-4 years?

 

[Rosco1984]

says a lot that 3 players Lloris, Dier and Hojbjerg who were on the "leadership committee" previously would rather sit around collecting a wage than find football elsewhere. no wonder we have been a shit show with leaders like that involved. luckily the contracts of most of the worst deadwood are all up next summer. Maybe a few months of no football will convince them to exit sharpish in January and we can kick on again. It was never going to happen in one window but players choosing high wages and our nice comfortable training ground surroundings over playing games being the reason we couldnt strengthen more is very frustrating.

 

[kythg]

Am I missing something, I keep reading about the failed PEH move to Fulham , surely that was dependent on Palhinha going to Bayern which collapsed , one transfer collapses and others follow suit, can't blame anyone at Spurs for that or can you?

The Palhinha deal collapsed because Fulham couldn’t replace him, so Hojbjerg not going collapsed that deal

 

[only1waddle]

There's a balance.

I think it's ridiculous to say we're not geared up for success.

We threw massive salaries at Jose and Conte to try and bring success.

We've spent A LOT of money on players over the past few windows.

This window we've spent £40m on Maddison, close to another £40m on VDV, almost £50m on Johnson. It's not like we're not doing anything.

I agree with this to an extent but I think it's more nuanced, overall ENIC aren't interested in the football side at all, it's all about the pot of gold, because of this Levy can't delegate the football side and it brings out his control freak nature so we've never had any kind of knowledgeable CEO between him and the football side, so we're left with a Chairman making decisions about a game he has no interest in and doesn't really understand, because he needs to protect the pot of gold.
The independent review was essentially an admittance he'd lost his way, had no understanding of how to adapt to the modern game.
System based football means you can't go and pluck players out of the sky, his reactive approach to transfers simply won't work now and you need a plan, good scouts, continuity and consistency.

 

[nicdic]

I agree with this to an extent but I think it's more nuanced, overall ENIC aren't interested in the football side at all, it's all about the pot of gold, because of this Levy can't delegate the football side and it brings out his control freak nature so we've never had any kind of knowledgeable CEO between him and the football side, so we're left with a Chairman making decisions about a game he has no interest in and doesn't really understand, because he needs to protect the pot of gold.
The independent review was essentially an admittance he'd lost his way, had no understanding of how to adapt to the modern game.
System based football means you can't go and pluck players out of the sky, his reactive approach to transfers simply won't work now and you need a plan, good scouts, continuity and consistency.

And yet in the last two season that has clearly been changing in terms of our recruitment, no?

 

[cjsimba]

I just don’t get what our strategy was with trying to sell Sanchez.

- We know we have to sell this window or he will go free next summer
- So we know we may have to sell for less than our valuation or risk not selling at all. Selling for £5m below our valuation is still better than selling for £0 next summer.
- Yet we still drag it out until the last day to try squeeze those extra couple million out of buying clubs
- But doing that means we can’t buy the replacement as the selling club don’t have enough time to replace them. With no replacement we can’t sell Sanchez.
- So trying to squeeze the extra couple million out of the Sanchez deal means we have lost the full amount for him and will have to let him go for free next summer

I just don’t get it, it’s another classic example of Penny wise, pound foolish from our supposedly financially/business savvy chairman.

Can someone shed light on this as it makes zero sense to me.