Was it a penalty?

[Monkey boy]

There's a lot of hate coming my way on my Facebook and Twitter from bitter goons and scousers about how we've cheated again.

I gotta be honest I didn't even appeal at the time but having watched the replays I think it was a pen as his arms were out stretched and stopped the ball going into the box? What do you think?

 

[YiddoInPoland]

It was very very harsh

 

[Danners9]

Yes it's a penalty. Stops a cross in the box with his hand. He can have his hand by his side or just go with his leg up instead of with his hand as well.

The rule isn't whether it the player deliberately handles, it's whether the hand is out and stops a chance.. which it is and does.


Regarding handball they now ask the referee to consider the proximity of the potential offender to the person last playing the ball, the speed of the ball and importantly whether the offender's arms are in a natural or unnatural position.

So the question of intent is now, did the offender deliberately place his arms in an unnatural position to increase the chances of the ball hitting him?

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...stle-got-lucky-Fox-penalty.html#ixzz2izwTSFWt

(don't click the link, no one should view the Mail more than they have to, but this is where it comes from)

The intent on whether he moves his arm up is debatable, much like it is when a player is penalised for 'climbing' or even some elbows when contesting a header - try NOT using your arms for balance or leverage - but that's how they decide.

Without the arm out, does the cross get through? yes.

 

[Shea]

If it had been given against us we'd all be outraged I'm sure

 

[dk-yid]

There's a lot of hate coming my way on my Facebook and Twitter from bitter goons and scousers about how we've cheated again.

I gotta be honest I didn't even appeal at the time but having watched the replays I think it was a pen as his arms were out stretched and stopped the ball going into the box? What do you think?

 

[hodsgod]

Yes it's a penalty. Stops a cross in the box with his hand. He can have his hand by his side or just go with his leg up instead of with his hand as well.

The rule isn't whether it the player deliberately handles, it's whether the hand is out and stops a chance.. which it is and does.


Regarding handball they now ask the referee to consider the proximity of the potential offender to the person last playing the ball, the speed of the ball and importantly whether the offender's arms are in a natural or unnatural position.

So the question of intent is now, did the offender deliberately place his arms in an unnatural position to increase the chances of the ball hitting him?

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...stle-got-lucky-Fox-penalty.html#ixzz2izwTSFWt

(don't click the link, no one should view the Mail more than they have to, but this is where it comes from)

The intent on whether he moves his arm up is debatable, much like it is when a player is penalised for 'climbing' or even some elbows when contesting a header - try NOT using your arms for balance or leverage - but that's how they decide.

Without the arm out, does the cross get through? yes.

Handling the ball

Handling the ball involves a deliberate act of a player making contact with the ball with his hand or arm. The referee must take the following into consideration:

• the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
  
  
• the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
  
  
• the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an infringement
  
  
• touching the ball with an object held in the hand (clothing, shinguard, etc.) counts as an infringement
  
  
• hitting the ball with a thrown object (boot, shinguard, etc.) counts as an infringement
  

that is a quote from the laws of the game, and quite different to the bullshit you spout above. The law is all about, and always has been the intention of the player.

That was never a penalty, it bounced off his leg onto his arm, the ball was quite firmly hit and was totally unintentional.

 

[Dr Know]

There's a lot of hate coming my way on my Facebook and Twitter from bitter goons and scousers about how we've cheated again.

I gotta be honest I didn't even appeal at the time but having watched the replays I think it was a pen as his arms were out stretched and stopped the ball going into the box? What do you think?

Close your accounts

The pen was a bit harsh but having said that, more defenders are ensuring the ref can see they are clearly trying to keep their hands behind their backs when in the box. I feel the pen was harsh because the defender was using his hands for balance.

We have had soft pens given against us in the past so i won't lose sleep over it

 

[dirtyh]

not a chance. there's no movement of the arm and no intent plus the lino called it, not the ref. Not complaining but if it had happened against us i'd be absolutely gutted. should have gone for it in the first 10-15. an early goal against these park the bus teams is the only way to draw them out.

 

[Danners9]

Handling the ball

Handling the ball involves a deliberate act of a player making contact with the ball with his hand or arm. The referee must take the following into consideration:

• the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
  
  
• the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
  
  
• the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an infringement
  
  
• touching the ball with an object held in the hand (clothing, shinguard, etc.) counts as an infringement
  
  
• hitting the ball with a thrown object (boot, shinguard, etc.) counts as an infringement

that is a quote from the laws of the game, and quite different to the bullshit you spout above. The law is all about, and always has been the intention of the player.

That was never a penalty, it bounced off his leg onto his arm, the ball was quite firmly hit and was totally unintentional.

In that case then our Palace penalty shouldn't be given either.

Which means the referees need to be better and the rules should stop being changed, as this is quite a new change. Besides, it's Graham Poll spouting bullshit.. not me.

 

[Fergus]

I think it's moot as both Holtby and Soldado should have been awarded penalties for being held. However, refs never seem to penalise wrestling in the penalty area any more. I know that Law 12 hasn't changed regarding holding, so does anyone know why referees don't enforce it any more?

 

[Curtis Peterson]

It was certainly a bit harsh, but you put the official in a very difficult position when you leave your arm separated from your body and the ball hits your hand.

 

[Flashspur]

dont have your arm raised....he did........end of

 

[Shanks]

Simple answer.

No.

But I'll take it.


How do I come to my conclusion - rather simply really, taking all laws and written text aside, if it happened to us, I'd be shouting that it's not a penalty and that the player actually moved his arm away, rather than towards, and that he had his arm down his side as well.

And thats exactly what people would be saying here, if it was against us.

Therefore, simply put, it wasn't a penalty.

 

[class of 62]

last season we had a number of stonewall pens not given...this season we've already had 3!.. swings & roundabouts.

 

[Kendall]

The guys arm is bent at pretty much a right angle when it hits him. he doesn't move it towards the ball, his position was not unnatural and the ball was pinged at him from about 5 yards.

In every aspect of the rule it's never a pen and yet again AVB gets away with another boring, uninspiring performance.

That said, for people saying Hull were robbed, that they didn't deserve that, that it was cruel etc... FUCK THEM.

The ****s played 5-4-1, with Huddlestone being a member of the 4 and yet still spending most of his time around the edge of their box. That isn't football, it's attempting to rob every fan in the stadium of their hard earned money, and me of my afternoon as I had to down the remaining half I had of York's finest chocolate stout to make it home in time to stream it.

Football should be rejoicing that Cardiff lost in the last minute and Hull lost late. You play with fire and you get burned. Finally it seems that if you play that away, you don't get rewarded as much as perhaps you might have done previously.

 

[Kendall]

last season we had a number of stonewall pens not given...this season we've already had 3!.. swings & roundabouts.

Even the one against Swansea was a bit dodge if I remember rightly, but Shelvey had already been given the benefit of the doubt on a stonewall pen earlier.

 

[worcestersauce]

can't understand why there is a fuss it was a nailed on pen, it wasn't that close it wasn't that hard he had his arms up he was moving to block the ball and he stopped it going towards goal.
I know the argument about ball to hand but the referees have been way too liberal in their interpretation of that recently and they have let far too many go, yes othe similar cases have not been given but they should have been.

 

[spurious1]

Handling the ball
...

• touching the ball with an object held in the hand (clothing, shinguard, etc.) counts as an infringement
• hitting the ball with a thrown object (boot, shinguard, etc.) counts as an infringement

that is a quote from the laws of the game, and quite different to the bullshit you spout above. The law is all about, and always has been the intention of the player.

That was never a penalty, it bounced off his leg onto his arm, the ball was quite firmly hit and was totally unintentional.

I have never seen these two cases occur, like to see that! What if you would launch your boot from your foot and hit the ball?

Oh and this case I am sure there was no intent...no way that was a penalty. So for once those scummer and bin-dipper fb'ers are sort of right. Although we did not cheat, we took advantage of an error in our favour, not really the same. I will never forget when Rivaldo intentionally kicked the ball at his opponent's hand in the box during a WC. Thought that was the most cynical thing I'd ever seen on a football pitch. Surprised it's not a more common stunt, actually, if you would consistently get pens for it. (I am not implying this was the case yesterday!)

 

[Gilzeanking]

If that had happened outside the pen area , there's be no fuss , a shouted appeal and a free kick .

If the ball hits a player's hand ,its generally considered an infringement , no matter what the rules say .

 

[JohanTheYid]

It was harsh, but I dont see how that makes us cheats etc ! These idiots act like theyve never been awarded a dubious penalty.

People forget that the officials get one split second view to make a call, on replays its harsh, but my initial reaction was to shout handball immediately.