Yids chants

[Dinghy]

I answered your question and your anology isn't relevant to be honest.

The analogy was perfect for what you were claiming.

You keep claiming that because someone has previously said or done something that is racist (the speeding on the NC) they should (and everyone else) be charged for the Yid chants (the driving within the speed limit on The High Road).

The Yid chants are not racist no matter who is chanting them, unless you can make them fit the criteria I gave above. To date you have continuously swerved answering that which is why I made the analogy. You swerved the analogy too. You cannot make the argument which is why you keep swerving the pertinent questions. I can only think that this is purposeful now.

 

[parklane1]

Go back and read the posts and you will see my answer.

You really are full of shit,

 

[Wiener]

That must be why the club have out of the blue decided to meet with Kick It Out.

I can't see how what the CPS said is correct though. "Yid" is a perfectly legitmate Yiddish word in the same way "monkey" is a pergectly legimate English word. It's how it is used that is the deicdes whether it'slegal or illegal. The CPS would need to prove we are deliberately trying to offend Jewswhih surely wouldn't happen. The Met said the same thing in their statement as well.

I wouldn't draw that conclusion at all. In fact I think the club is trying to take the initiative and make it a sensible debate that addresses the root of anti-social and unacceptable behaviour and attitudes in football. It needs to a wider debate not just about our calling ourselves "yids" but about practical measures that can change this type of behaviour and attitude.

The CPS thing sounds like a wild rumour. Having said that you never know as they seem to be staffed with the same sub-standard legal minds Herbert seems to possess. Waste of money and not guilty verdicts seem to be their speciality.

 

[Wiener]

Well I think you are but I don't want to /can't be bothered to get into a tit for tat obtuse battle.

How about a tit tit for tat battle. You are being exceptionally obtuse. And constantly asking someone to re-read one of your opaque posts under the pretext that the answer lurks within it, is truly weak and arrogant.

 

[MR_BEN]

Stop arguing.

Agree to disagree.

STFU

 

[the watson]

I'm only 19, but living in London with a few Jewish mates / neighbours I don't think I've ever heard the term 'Yid' mean anything other than Tottenham fan.

 

[Wiener]

I thought that maybe I was being the obtuse poster for a second there!

Moment of weakness no doubt. You have made an admirable attempt to inject reason into Herbert's self-serving, illiberal and soft-headed approach to a serious issue. You can't polish a turd.

All we can do now is see what Herbert's next move is. I will be at WHL on the 25th and will be keeping an eye out for Herbert's goons.

 

[3Dnata]

Been told today by someone who would know...

Apparently the CPS have deemed all Yid chants offensive. The club are considering their position and will make a statement in the coming days.

I'm sorry I'm not sure how the system would work like this.
Have the police asked the CPS is someone chanting Yid Army offensive and have the CPS then advised it is without anyone being interviewed about any offence they were supposed to have committed?

 

[beats1]

And we are back with this beauty but his last line now says if a jewish person says yid, it doesnt matter

The Society of Black Lawyers will hold talks with the Metropolitan Police before pressing ahead with a complaint about Tottenham fans chanting 'Yiddos'.

Peter Herbert, the organisation's chairman, said today he is fully prepared to go ahead with a complaint but will first meet police in the borough of Tottenham before the end of next week.
Herbert told Press Association Sport: "We have been in touch with the Metropolitan Police and we will meet them as the next step.
"Ideally, as a result of that they will speak to Tottenham and the Football Association about these anti-Semitic chants.
"We are prepared to make an official complaint if we feel action is not being taken."
Tottenham, who have an historic Jewish connection, have defended their fans, saying they have "taken ownership" of the phrase to stop it being used as an insult by opposing supporters.
Herbert insists that argument is still not acceptable.
He added: "It does not make a difference if it is Tottenham fans doing the chants or away fans. There has to be zero tolerance and if that catches out Spurs then so be it."
Asked about Jewish fans themselves singing the chant, he said: "That's not acceptable either."​

 

[sendô]

For my part this is one of the most ridiculous cases of finding offence for the sake of finding offence I've ever heard. Spurs fans have always as far back as I can remember referred to themselves as the Yid Army, and other clubs have long referred to Tottenham as the Yids. I see no reason why this should suddenly change because some no mark with no link to the club is suddenly "offended" on behalf of other people.

 

[Wiener]

And we are back with this beauty but his last line now says if a jewish person says yid, it doesnt matter

The Society of Black Lawyers will hold talks with the Metropolitan Police before pressing ahead with a complaint about Tottenham fans chanting 'Yiddos'.

Peter Herbert, the organisation's chairman, said today he is fully prepared to go ahead with a complaint but will first meet police in the borough of Tottenham before the end of next week.
Herbert told Press Association Sport: "We have been in touch with the Metropolitan Police and we will meet them as the next step.
"Ideally, as a result of that they will speak to Tottenham and the Football Association about these anti-Semitic chants.
"We are prepared to make an official complaint if we feel action is not being taken."
Tottenham, who have an historic Jewish connection, have defended their fans, saying they have "taken ownership" of the phrase to stop it being used as an insult by opposing supporters.
Herbert insists that argument is still not acceptable.
He added: "It does not make a difference if it is Tottenham fans doing the chants or away fans. There has to be zero tolerance and if that catches out Spurs then so be it."
Asked about Jewish fans themselves singing the chant, he said: "That's not acceptable either."​

The only thing Herbert has zero tolerance for is the law. It actually requires a degree of reason and nuance, neither of which he seems capable of. Given a little time his bleatings be forgotten.

 

[nightgoat]

I wonder whether or not when David Baddiel insists that Spurs fans chanting "Yid Army" perpetuates the Jewish association and therefore encourages anti-semitic chants against us he has this in the back of his mind.



Because he'd hate for people to keep thinking of Spurs as a Jewish club.

 

[dorsetyid]

Also he made Omid Djalleli (sp?) a spurs fan in the infidel, some sort of foreshadowing apparently for the jew he would become.

Baddiel has made a lot of money recently for being an athiest obsessed with a religion he does not believe in

 

[onthetwo]

Dear Society Of Publicity Seeking Lawyers (as a Jewish non-racist, im ambivalent to your colour) - please go help the Italian police with any help they might need in dealing with their MASSIVE racism problem that a few of our fans nearly died due to in Rome the other evening. When you've solved that problem, we'd be happy to discuss any cases of at worst, casually racist chants that appear to offend no-one other than yourselves. Friday, SC.

Anyone know their address?

 

[DubSpurs]

In fairness I'm amazed this managed to get the attention it did. Who is this group? Sounds like a few ambulance chasers looking for their 15 minutes.

Not one respected figure in football has taken them seriously. FA just shusshed them as had Liverpool and Spurs

Just look at their website! Stinks of amateur, they'll all be forgotten about in a few weeks

 

[Hoopspur]

My take on it though, is that if any individuals are offended by this chant then we shouldn't do it. Simple as that. And no one has the right to tell them that they should or should not be offended.

I understand the general arguments and realise that guy from the SOBL or whatever they're called is a knob, but my original point stands. Doesn't it?

 

[talkshowhost86]

My take on it though, is that if any individuals are offended by this chant then we shouldn't do it. Simple as that. And no one has the right to tell them that they should or should not be offended.

I understand the general arguments and realise that guy from the SOBL or whatever they're called is a knob, but my original point stands. Doesn't it?

Does that apply to all chants then? Surely some people are going to be offended by all sorts of chanting? What about songs about the scousers for example?

 

[Hoopspur]

Does that apply to all chants then? Surely some people are going to be offended by all sorts of chanting? What about songs about the scousers for example?

Funnily enough I choose not to sing those songs anyway. But, that is something they can kind of do something about if the wish and is not about their race, colour, creed, religion or whatever - of course they might say or think different. Do the majority of the people from Liverpool sign on or eat rats. I think I'm educated enough, and I'm sure they are to, to realise that this is a stupid joke.

As it happens I'm Cornish and total prats have a go about me being a yokel or driving a combine harvester, although I've been in London for many more years than I've ever lived in Cornwall. I don't like it, but I can handle that.

I'll repeat, that if it genuinely upsets or causes offence to someone - one of our own or otherwise, then in my opinion it should not be done. My sons come with me to WHL every home match and have done for many years and I have asked them not to sing such songs.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Funnily enough I choose not to sing those songs anyway. But, that is something they can kind of do something about if the wish and is not about their race, colour, creed, religion or whatever - of course they might say or think different. Do the majority of the people from Liverpool sign on or eat rats. I think I'm educated enough, and I'm sure they are to, to realise that this is a stupid joke.

As it happens I'm Cornish and total prats have a go about me being a yokel or driving a combine harvester, although I've been in London for many more years than I've ever lived in Cornwall. I don't like it, but I can handle that.

I'll repeat, that if it genuinely upsets or causes offence to someone - one of our own or otherwise, then in my opinion it should not be done. My sons come with me to WHL every home match and have done for many years and I have asked them not to sing such songs.

Whilst I respect that point of view, I think sometimes people simply have to accept that they are going to be offended by some things.

For me it's very different if something is being done as an act of deliberate provocation/abuse (such as the Lazio racist taunts for example) but in this situation that is clearly not the case and similar to your words above, I'd like to think that most Jewish people are educated enough to realise that it's not racist but in fact a reclaiming of the word.

It's a fine line I admit but in this instance I genuinely don't think we should be forced to stop singing it.

 

[onthetwo]

My take on it though, is that if any individuals are offended by this chant then we shouldn't do it. Simple as that. And no one has the right to tell them that they should or should not be offended.

I understand the general arguments and realise that guy from the SOBL or whatever they're called is a knob, but my original point stands. Doesn't it?

David Badiel seems to be the only one, mainly due to the fact that its easier to pick on us than the racist scumbags that he sits next to each week at his own club!