Next Manager Watch

slartibartfast · Apr 9, 2023

Metalhead said:
I'm at a loss with that kind of thing. Were Ranieri's tactics contemporary when Leicester won the title? I've no idea but they certainly worked for that period of time.

Just my two pennith but I think its more important to have good players, get the best out of those players, keep it simple and get them onside believing in what you are trying to get across, more than the style you play.
Be a stubborn git and only play a certain way regardless of the players strengths those players will struggle, you'll lose the dressing room and everyone will be miserable.
Lot of stubborn coaches about these days it seems. Lot of over analysing as well. Look deeply enough you'll convince yourself Kane taking corners is a good idea.

Timberwolf · Apr 9, 2023

mpickard2087 said:
As I've said previously, I wouldn't be against Poch coming back at some point but if it was to happen then I'd want and expect PochBall on steroids. 100% all in, aggressive, urgent, furious, suffocating, in the oppositions faces. Press, press, press a bit more, and the flowing football and tempo of our ball work always came on the back of what we did out of possession.

Fans, and Poch himself maybe, can piss and moan about "he wasn't backed!!!!" , but the overwhelming reason why it went wrong was that when the team couldn't or wouldn't press any more and hold the high standards of off the ball work we saw previously he didn't know what to do about it. The show was kept on the road enough to sneak some top four finishes still, we had the freaky/fluky cup run in the CL, but at the base level we never got close to restoring any standards to our play.

For anyone who says oh he could adapt.... I watched at least a dozen of his PSG games, and every one was a bit of a shambles tbh. Compromise to the max. where the rest of the team was set up to carry the three forwards, really disjointed and just winging it on individual talent, and Poch always looking a bit miserable and like he was going through the motions on the touchline. I don't want that thanks.

But yeah, tough decisions would have to be made at the top of the pitch for starters if you had any hope of instilling his brand of energy and football. Who'd have the bollocks to do it?

While I agree with the overall point, I do think the lack of pressing and inability to hold the team to high standards is inherently linked to him being unable to adequately refresh the squad.

Poch said it himself, and was apparently explicitly advised in his meeting with Fergie, about the importance of keeping things fresh, keeping the the players on their toes and moving players on at the right time.

We didn't do any of that until it was already far, far too late, so I don't think it's a huge surprise the squad looked weary and lacked pressing intensity towards the end.

Overall think it would be a bad idea to bring him back, though, and Levy should not give in to fan pressure. Poch can't take us back in time and the fantasy that upon his return he'll magically make everything right is exactly that - a fantasy. In reality, Poch will never even come close to living up to the highs of his first tenure and I think this will, in itself, be a huge downer for fans as there won't even be the excitement around a new project once the initial honeymoon period is over.

Westmorlandspur · Apr 9, 2023

Arnie Slot in action on Thursday night 5,45pm kick off
Feyenoord v Roma. Europa lge.
should be interesting how he takes on a Mourinho team.

Bluto Blutarsky · Apr 9, 2023

beats1 said:
They are run by an investment company with the sole purpose to increase the club value for sale in 15 years,

Archibald-CPH · Apr 9, 2023

Ghost Hardware said:
I think it was Thursday night? Maybe Friday (can’t remember which now) all the ITKs were about and one said he wasn’t on the list and that Levy had talked to him a number of times but he was concerned about him only managing in SA and felt he needed to come here first. The other two itk’s didn’t contest the info so I’m assuming it’s true. Would really really suck tho if it is the case as I still think he’s by far the best choice and certainly no more risky then Slot and Postecoglou who, again according to ITK, are our top two choices.

Im just hoping this changes in the coming weeks.

Thanks

Any of Gallardo, Slot, Poch would do for me.

thebenjamin · Apr 9, 2023

Maybe Poch was difficult on transfers because when he didn't insist on specific players he was given alternatives like Njie, Nkoudou, Wimmer etc

nailsy · Apr 9, 2023

YiddoInPoland said:
I just don't see how Poch coming back is a good idea, it never ends well.

The never go back thing is a myth. Jose went back to Chelsea and won the league. Carlo Ancelotti went back to Real and won the champions League. Dirty Den went back to EastEnders and was murdered in the Queen Vic... maybe that last one doesn't support the argument

nailsy · Apr 9, 2023

thebenjamin said:
Maybe Poch was difficult on transfers because when he didn't insist on specific players he was given alternatives like Njie, Nkoudou, Wimmer etc

I think most people understand why he was difficult, but he wasn't helping anyone by refusing to compromise at all.

worcestersauce · Apr 9, 2023

superted4 said:
except it’s well known it was Joe Lewis who pushed for Poch

At time we were finalising Van Gaal and then United sacked, Moyes I think it was, and took Van Gaal off us so we went for Poch.
A near thing as I remember.

thebenjamin · Apr 9, 2023

nailsy said:
I think most people understand why he was difficult, but he wasn't helping anyone by refusing to compromise at all.

Agree, but if you compromising and trusting the club has previously resulted in them buying clearly second-rate, bargain basement players and potentially cost the chance to win the title on two occasions, I could understand it.

Metalhead · Apr 9, 2023

slartibartfast said:
Just my two pennith but I think its more important to have good players, get the best out of those players, keep it simple and get them onside believing in what you are trying to get across, more than the style you play.
Be a stubborn git and only play a certain way regardless of the players strengths those players will struggle, you'll lose the dressing room and everyone will be miserable.
Lot of stubborn coaches about these days it seems. Lot of over analysing as well. Look deeply enough you'll convince yourself Kane taking corners is a good idea.

Well observed - certainly I think that is what made that season so effective for Ranieri. In fairness, that was also effective for Harry. Probably why people thought that getting him in for the remainder of the season would help. Not because it would be a tactical masterclass - just because it might liberate the players a bit.

Ossie85 · Apr 9, 2023

H-SF said:
I can't believe everyone is saying this. We've just watched his team absolutely batter us for 90 mins and people are no longer interested because he got into an argument with our interim manager. Who cares? The best managers are often nutters, lets not act like Conte and Jose haven't been involved in their fair share of bust ups, two managers everyone was happy with us appointing. Arteta is a **** on the sideline but he's probably leading Arsenal to the title. People need to grow up, De Zerbi is an amazing coach and exactly what we need.

He just continued what Potter did to the club. And to be honest, both Potter and him benefit from what the club set up. It's not only the manager. de Zerbi has had no input in the players they bought.
On top of that he started the day making it all about himself with that argument with Stellini. And then he got sent off leaving his team without a manager.
Arteta has nothing to do with this muppet. I don't think there's any point where they can be compared. And who cares about Arteta anyway.

And after all, BHA controlled possesion, but they lost. Against a team that had been playing like shit and gave up points in the last minutes against 2 of the worst teams in the league. Everything he's shown yesterday is exactly what we don't need.
I agree we need to change to an offensive coach, but not every coach that is offensive is good enough. There's a lot of this offensive coaches like de zerbi that are perpetual losers.

Timberwolf · Apr 9, 2023

nailsy said:
The never go back thing is a myth. Jose went back to Chelsea and won the league. Carlo Ancelotti went back to Real and won the champions League. Dirty Den went back to EastEnders and was murdered in the Queen Vic... maybe that may one doesn't support the argument

I mean you can find examples to suit both arguments.

Keegan and Dalgleish both flopped in their second spells.

Personally I think that Poch's first appointment was like lightning in a bottle, given the way Kane, Walker, Rose, Alli, Dembele, Vertonghen and Eriksen all emerged and/or flourished, then we signed a world class player in Son.

He was the perfect manager to work with that young group and get the best out of them with his high-pressing and paternal managerial style.

Our current squad doesn't have the same level of talent while Poch seems to have moved on from his super high-pressing style. The league is also a lot more competitive than it was back in 15-16, 16-17 so it would be much harder to match what we did back then.

He'd probably do fine, but unless he had instant big success whatever he were to do it would feel tinged with disappointment as he'd never be able to live up to the heights of his first tenure.

Japhet · Apr 9, 2023

Hotspur88 said:
As much as I love Poch, people easily forget the last year he was in charge. I'm telling you now, the place was toxic towards the end. Many of those players are still at the club and I think we need a completely new manager in, a different voice. All three managers I mentioned play attacking football, it's not only Poch who plays this kind of football. Add to this how stubborn Poch was over transfers and some very good players we missed out on because of that. I'll say it again, I love Poch, but then weighing everything up, I don't think now is the time for him to return. Maybe in 5-10 years when we have a completely different playing staff and the club has hopefully progressed further. Not everyone will agree with me thinking a Poch return now isn't the best move and that's natural, I may be completely wrong and his return could be brilliant, I just personally feel one of the managers I mentioned should be who we are pushing for.

Maybe not the best idea but certainly not the worst. I reckon a CB to go with Romero and an attacking mid like Maddison and there's the makings of a good team. My concerns would mainly centre around whether he'd accept a DoF. Would love to see what he could do with a midfield centred around Bentancur and Bissouma with Sarr and Skipp as backups. By the time he was done we were down to mainly Sissoko and Winks and he seemed to lose hope then.

Metalhead · Apr 9, 2023

Timberwolf said:
I mean you can find examples to suit both arguments.

Keegan and Dalgleish both flopped in their second spells.

Personally I think that Poch's first appointment was like lightning in a bottle, given the way Kane, Walker, Rose, Alli, Dembele, Vertonghen and Eriksen all emerged and/or flourished, then we signed a world class player in Son.

He was the perfect manager to work with that young group and get the best out of them with his high-pressing and paternal managerial style.

Our current squad doesn't have the same level of talent while Poch seems to have moved on from his super high-pressing style. The league is also a lot more competitive than it was back in 15-16, 16-17 so it would be much harder to match what we did back then.

He'd probably do fine, but unless he had instant big success whatever he were to do it would feel tinged with disappointment as he'd never be able to live up to the heights of his first tenure.

Fair points. I know that realistically Levy can and will ride out any appointments that go wrong but imagine if he got Poch back and it quickly went downhill again? I could only imagine the atmosphere.

Timberwolf · Apr 9, 2023

Metalhead said:
Fair points. I know that realistically Levy can and will ride out any appointments that go wrong but imagine if he got Poch back and it quickly went downhill again? I could only imagine the atmosphere.

That's exactly my fear.

It might genuinely feel worse than it does right now given how high people's hopes would be for Poch. Especially if the old frustrations (poor in-game management, same old press conferences, the fucking diamond) began to reemerge.

I think the expectations would be so unhealthy and there would be so much baggage that we're be better off going elsewhere and looking for something fresh.

TheChosenOne · Apr 9, 2023

Ossie85 said:
He just continued what Potter did to the club. And to be honest, both Potter and him benefit from what the club set up. It's not only the manager. de Zerbi has had no input in the players they bought.
On top of that he started the day making it all about himself with that argument with Stellini. And then he got sent off leaving his team without a manager.
Arteta has nothing to do with this muppet. I don't think there's any point where they can be compared. And who cares about Arteta anyway.

And after all, BHA controlled possesion, but they lost. Against a team that had been playing like shit and gave up points in the last minutes against 2 of the worst teams in the league. Everything he's shown yesterday is exactly what we don't need.
I agree we need to change to an offensive coach, but not every coach that is offensive is good enough. There's a lot of this offensive coaches like de zerbi that are perpetual losers.

2nd red + 4 yellows this season

Ossie85 · Apr 9, 2023

Darth Vega said:
I'm worried our fans are blinded by love. Pochettino just isn't at an elite level tactically. That isn't to say he's bad but even at his peak he got outclassed tactically by the likes of Pep, Klopp, Allegri and others - that doesn't mean he never beat them, but he's clearly not on the level of the best. What he is is an outstanding manager that can get the most out of the sum of the club's parts and unite everyone. That sounds just like what we need but I simply don't subscribe to the idea that there isn't another manager that could also get us playing brilliant football but is more modern tactically than Pochettino is - on paper Arne Slot seems to tick a hell of a lot of these boxes, plus he's bald and Dutch which is immediately endearing.

Back to Poch, the game has moved on a lot even from the time he took over, which is coming up to a decade ago now. Poch's secret weapon was how much we used to suffocate teams with the press but even middling clubs do that now, it isn't reserved for just the top sides. Ironically it was something we struggled to deal with when we faced it ourselves, which is partly why we sucked away at the other top clubs when he was here. There's talk about managers having 10 year cycles and while I don't think it's that arbitrary, I'm worried he's at the wrong end of his.

Well, all of the top coaches got outclassed tactically by someone at some point. Guardiola has been countless of times, by very limited managers.

I don't think the game has changed since he left. What changed? What does someone like Arne Slot has that he doesn't? I think that's just idea that keeps going around without any proof of it. I honestly don't a thing about Slot, and I'm quite certain 90% of this forum doesn't either. I'm not against him, but it feels to me some just want him because he's new and shiny. Not because he is more modern tactically.

My only concern with Pochettino is that a lot of players who were not good enough when he left, are still here. Like Dier, Davies, etc.

I would be happy with Poch or Slot. What I don't understand is the dissing of Poch as if he were someone who stopped coaching 30 years ago. A lot of you were happy with Mourinho who had already shown he was totally outdated

spursfan77 · Apr 9, 2023

Ossie85 said:
He just continued what Potter did to the club. And to be honest, both Potter and him benefit from what the club set up. It's not only the manager. de Zerbi has had no input in the players they bought.
On top of that he started the day making it all about himself with that argument with Stellini. And then he got sent off leaving his team without a manager.
Arteta has nothing to do with this muppet. I don't think there's any point where they can be compared. And who cares about Arteta anyway.

And after all, BHA controlled possesion, but they lost. Against a team that had been playing like shit and gave up points in the last minutes against 2 of the worst teams in the league. Everything he's shown yesterday is exactly what we don't need.
I agree we need to change to an offensive coach, but not every coach that is offensive is good enough. There's a lot of this offensive coaches like de zerbi that are perpetual losers.

Brighton are just flavour of the month. They’ll slip back to mediocrity before the end of the decade unless they’re bought by oil money.

Timberwolf · Apr 9, 2023

Ossie85 said:
He just continued what Potter did to the club. And to be honest, both Potter and him benefit from what the club set up. It's not only the manager. de Zerbi has had no input in the players they bought.
On top of that he started the day making it all about himself with that argument with Stellini. And then he got sent off leaving his team without a manager.
Arteta has nothing to do with this muppet. I don't think there's any point where they can be compared. And who cares about Arteta anyway.

And after all, BHA controlled possesion, but they lost. Against a team that had been playing like shit and gave up points in the last minutes against 2 of the worst teams in the league. Everything he's shown yesterday is exactly what we don't need.
I agree we need to change to an offensive coach, but not every coach that is offensive is good enough. There's a lot of this offensive coaches like de zerbi that are perpetual losers.

Hmm, they played us off the park, should've had a pen and lost in large part due to an absolute worldie from Son. If you play that game 10 times, Brighton probably win about 6 or 7, and we win 1.

Guy's clearly a hot-head and a bit of a knob, but I don't think we should write him off based on his weirdness yesterday.

Based on what he did at Sassuolo, I don't think De Zerbi is only succeeding because of Potter's foundations (although they helped) and I think he'll continue to do well there. I think he's easily one of the best 2-3 options we could pick to take us forward, and we wouldn't mind his passion/anger half as much if it was on our bench rather than the opposition one.

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