Does Harry have the winning mentality?

[Sanj]

Yes another Harry thread......
and before i start let me state my position on Harry, to show this isn't a vendetta against Harry.

i didn't want Harry to manage Spurs when he first came, but - by and large Harry has won me over and we can't argue with his achievements since joining - yes we will all have differences of opinion when it comes to team and formation selection, but we cannot argue with his achievements and he has given us a great deal of joy in the league last season and this seasons champions league with results and the style of play.

However i do question harry's attitude at times. He is very defeatist in the press at times (how can we finish 4th when city and pool spend so much etc...) bigging up other teams and doing our players a dis-service.
In addition to that, after a disgraceful performance by the lino today he comes out with passive comments excusing the officials of all blame and letting officials know that they can shaft the spurs and they will get away with it.
This is even more galling when we play the big teams and the refs can give the 'big' teams decisions knowing they will not be lambasted by spurs about their incompetence, but also knowing if they don't give 50:50 / 40:60 decisions to the 'big' teams they will be criticised.

I used to be proud of the fact that we gave officials so much respect, but it seems to be that if you don't intimidate the refs you get no decisions from them.

Does this show a lack of a winning instinct by Harry? or is it just that he does things the 'right way'?
should he be intimidating refs to ensure we get decisions, or should he let them go about their job with no intereference from spurs even tho opposition managers will try and influence them?

I am disappointed by Harry's passiveness today and wonder if this is something he needs to work on if we want parity from officials or if i am over-reacting to yet another couple of 'unlucky' incidents for us?

Thoughts?

 

[jonathanhotspur]

I was delighted when he arrived. I knew he would put the fire out.

 

[striebs]

The two incidents were 50/50's , it's pointless making excuses on that basis and I'm glad Harry has more grace .

If these decisions were made in the first half of the season nobody would pay any attention to them but as it is they are a red herring - the real issue is our failure to be able to score against dogged sides .

What has Levy done to back Harry in the transfer window other than when he thought there was a serious chance of us going down ?

Gallas is about it . Very few other decent managers would be prepared to work with our board .

Perhaps if Levy was held to account on these boards we would see his performance improve or better still him move out the way and give the football men their head .

 

[jonathanhotspur]

Give them what?

 

[Bill_Oddie]

Not sure about the comments you make but his defensive tactics and lack of any form of shift in approach, including baffling substitutions show that, no, he is not a "winning" manager. Strange, as his drive to make us win games was so impressive last season.

He went for the draw and got what he deserve.

 

[Mullers]

I think the whole club doesn't have a winning mentality, not just Harry. That is one of the reasons why we lose our best players to Man United I'll never forget what Michael Carrick said' At spurs your not expected to win every game but at Man United you're expected to win every game'.

About the Europa league Redknapp has said it's one of those competitions that clubs don't want to be in. He obviously doesn't take it seriously, the Europa cup is a difficult competition to win but with the side we have we are capable of winning it. Look at Liverpool, five times European cup winners but they take that competition seriously.

We can't afford to toss aside competitions that we can realistic win. When our fans say they would rather get fourth place in the league and no trophy, it's bullshit and shows football is going in the wrong direction.

We have a side capable of winning almost any trophy, the playing personal might need a small tweak but the biggest thing missing is still that belief and winning mentality that will take us to the next level.

Rant over.

 

[Stavrogin]

I think the whole club doesn't have a winning mentality, not just Harry. That is one of the reasons why we lose our best players to Man United I'll never forget what Michael Carrick said' At spurs your not expected to win every game but at Man United you're expected to win every game'.

Yeah, but that's reflective of the facts, not our mentality. Man Utd are expected to win every game, we're not, if people said otherwise they'd be seen as mad.

That Man Utd attitude is built out of years of success. We can't develop an ingrained killer instinct or the abilty to deal with pressure over night. Although (despite this season's results) I think we're getting better.

A few years ago we were expected to beat lowly sides but frequently we wouldn't even turn up. In the past couple of years we've been more effective in these games, we play better, create more chances etc. those 'dud' games are less frequent.

That's not to say an exceptional manager can't come in and transform the mentality of a squad... but usually, when that does happen, the team in question were already in pole position.

 

[rsmith]

I just read a post on arrycommunity.co.uk in which Joe Jordan asks if Spurs fans have a winning mentality.

Can we merge the two threads?

 

[Mullers]

Yeah, but that's reflective of the facts, not our mentality. Man Utd are expected to win every game, we're not, if people said otherwise they'd be seen as mad.

That Man Utd attitude is built out of years of success. We can't develop an ingrained killer instinct or the abilty to deal with pressure over night. Although (despite this season's results) I think we're getting better.

A few years ago we were expected to beat lowly sides but frequently we wouldn't even turn up. In the past couple of years we've been more effective in these games, we play better, create more chances etc. those 'dud' games are less frequent.

That's not to say an exceptional manager can't come in and transform the mentality of a squad... but usually, when that does happen, the team in question were already in pole position.

All top players and sides from the management up should go into matches believing and expecting to win, if you go into a match with an half arsed attitude more often than not you lose. It's not just Man utd who have that winning mentality, Chelsea have it and Arsenal and Liverpool have it. The latter two haven't won anything for a while.

The current side we have is the best I can remember for a long time, but we only have short window of opportunity to win things or challenge before our top players leave. We should be trying to win every competition we enter rather than just going for fourth place.

 

[Viva la Tottenham]

Harry just told the truth today as most people at the game said it looked a goal, I'd much rather him give an honest answer in that situation than throw a complete Mourinho style sore loser wobbler

fact is it looked a goal in real time and goal line technology should already be in use

Harry has been badly let down by our strikers this season, they've all been shit and we need a clear out in that department summer time

 

[DEFchenkOE]

I think he does have a winning mentality, nobody questioned this when we beat Arsenal last year or this year, when we beat City away in that important game, or when we beat either of the Milan's.

I think tactically he get's quite a few things wrong and maybe he has trouble identifying targets to improve us but I wouldn't say that means he doesn't have a winning mentality.

Surely it's better for him to win than to lose, it's obvious he wants the ENgland job and he will only get it if we remain near the top of the table.

 

[Gilzeanking]

Hmm Bill is getting quite militant these days . This is significant..if Bill is down on Harry then the manager needs to be concerned .

Whatever his shortcomings...I was impressed by the motivation of the team yesterday..we largely matched an in form ,full strength Chelsea . Is that a winning mentality ?....If we had purchased more striker options..we may have been winning more games like these .

Yes but what you're on about is the gamesmanship that all top 4 manager's seem to use to get a slight advantage by influencing officials ...Something I think Dalgleish said ' Refs listen to those who shout loudest '....er maybe it was an ex ref who said this...

Anyway , I agree with the OP, I think we need to be as ruthless and cynical as our top 4 competitors sadly . This includes manager tirades against refs and mobbing the ref for any reason at all .I do feel we are a soft touch for officialdom and this is a dangerous reputation to have if we have ambitions to join the elite .

 

[double0]

just surround the refrees on any decision for and against, roll about on the fall, swear you never saw it during interviews. We have to join the club Barcelona do it, there all at it.

 

[dontcallme]

Yeah, but that's reflective of the facts, not our mentality. Man Utd are expected to win every game, we're not, if people said otherwise they'd be seen as mad.

That Man Utd attitude is built out of years of success. We can't develop an ingrained killer instinct or the abilty to deal with pressure over night. Although (despite this season's results) I think we're getting better.

A few years ago we were expected to beat lowly sides but frequently we wouldn't even turn up. In the past couple of years we've been more effective in these games, we play better, create more chances etc. those 'dud' games are less frequent.

That's not to say an exceptional manager can't come in and transform the mentality of a squad... but usually, when that does happen, the team in question were already in pole position.

True but we should also look at what SAF did when he first took over Utd. He bought captains and players with captainlike qualities. He bought the likes of Bruce, Pallister, Robson etc.

HR has tried to buy Bellamy, Parker and Neville and receives mostly ridicule and criticism from fans as a result.

HR understands that a manager can't simply instill a winning and strong mentality into a club. It comes from the players personalities as well. It's just a shame that fans don't get this.

 

[There's always next year]

It's not the winning mentality but the winning experience that Redknapp is missing.

 

[Spurs_Bear]

True but we should also look at what SAF did when he first took over Utd. He bought captains and players with captainlike qualities. He bought the likes of Bruce, Pallister, Robson etc.

HR has tried to buy Bellamy, Parker and Neville and receives mostly ridicule and criticism from fans as a result.

HR understands that a manager can't simply instill a winning and strong mentality into a club. It comes from the players personalities as well. It's just a shame that fans don't get this.

That....is a top, top post.

 

[There's always next year]

True but we should also look at what SAF did when he first took over Utd. He bought captains and players with captainlike qualities. He bought the likes of Bruce, Pallister, Robson etc.

HR has tried to buy Bellamy, Parker and Neville and receives mostly ridicule and criticism from fans as a result.

HR understands that a manager can't simply instill a winning and strong mentality into a club. It comes from the players personalities as well. It's just a shame that fans don't get this.

Bruce, Pallister and Robson were brought into Man Utd at their prime, not at the twilight of their careers like Bellemy, Parker and Neville.

 

[Black]

The only person with a winning mentality at our club is VDV

 

[ackie]

I think NOT investing in January HAS cost us 4th.
Chelsea have invested and they are 2nd...Liverpool have too and they are 5th...
I only reproach Harry and the board about uncertainties to new signings and trusting current strikers which are not putting the ball at the back of the net!

 

[Stavrogin]

All top players and sides from the management up should go into matches believing and expecting to win, if you go into a match with an half arsed attitude more often than not you lose. It's not just Man utd who have that winning mentality, Chelsea have it and Arsenal and Liverpool have it. The latter two haven't won anything for a while.

The current side we have is the best I can remember for a long time, but we only have short window of opportunity to win things or challenge before our top players leave. We should be trying to win every competition we enter rather than just going for fourth place.

I'm not sure expecting to win is the right word. If we had players expecting to win every game they'd quickly go insane.

What I would say now is that we go into big games trying to win by being better than the opposition - which is a step up. And as dontcallme's excellent post explains we're signing players with an aggressive desire, who want to win every game.

A lot of our players are quite meek, but I'd say there's some improvement to this end.