ENIC...

[yankspurs]

I miss the Cain Hoy rumors. That optimism lasted a few weeks but the potential we’d finally have been out from under Levy and the man on the yacht was very intriguing. ENIC has taken us far as they are willing. Time for a new owner to take us where we want to go. If we dont progress, we’ll go backward.

 

[Graysonti]

I miss the Cain Hoy rumors. That optimism lasted a few weeks but the potential we’d finally have been out from under Levy and the man on the yacht was very intriguing. ENIC has taken us far as they are willing. Time for a new owner to take us where we want to go. If we dont progress, we’ll go backward.

With respect, the last thing we need is American businessman. See Arsenal - the last thing we need is PowerPoints, buzzwords and charts.

On reflection, I think I’m happy with our owners (you just got to sit in the stadium) with a bit of ‘flexing’ up to our new financial reality.

I think it will be harder to get better to be honest and easy to get worse - much worse.

 

[ginola99]

During Enic's reign Tottenham Hotspur have lost 4 major cup finals in 18 years. Winning just 1 League Cup.

In the 119 years prior to that Spurs had only ever lost 3.

Everything ENIC has done in terms of running the club, infrastructure (Stadium & Training Ground) and leagues finishes (2010s has seen 5 UCL qualifications and top 6 every season) is very impressive, especially give the 90s and competitor's mad spending. In the FA Cup alone however, the club still fails to reach its first final since 1991, losing 5 Semi-Finals (2001, 2010, 2012, 2017, 2018) in the process. Whilst there has been a great increases in competing on the field and off field matters namely revenues, there has been no improvement whatsoever in winning trophies, in fact, it's got worse.

 

[davidmatzdorf]

During Enic's reign Tottenham Hotspur have lost 4 major cup finals in 18 years. Winning just 1 League Cup.

In the 119 years prior to that Spurs had only ever lost 3.

Everything ENIC has done in terms of running the club, infrastructure (Stadium & Training Ground) and leagues finishes (2010s has seen 5 UCL qualifications and top 6 every season) is very impressive, especially give the 90s and competitor's mad spending. In the FA Cup alone however, the club still fails to reach its first final since 1991, losing 5 Semi-Finals (2001, 2010, 2012, 2017, 2018) in the process. Whilst there has been a great increases in competing on the field and off field matters namely revenues, there has been no improvement whatsoever in winning trophies, in fact, it's got worse.

That's a reflection of broad changes in the power structure of English football. Until 20 years ago, the domestic cups were shared around a broad group of competitive large and medium sized clubs.

Have a look at the domination of the FA Cup and League Cup by the very richest clubs. It has tightened and become progressively more exclusive over the last 20 years.

EDIT: I checked the FA Cup (20 years).

Chelsea 6
Liverpool 2
Arsenal 6
Man City 2
Man Utd 2
Portsmouth 1
Wigan 1

League Cup (21 years, so I could include both of ours):

Man City 4
Man Utd 4
Liverpool 3
Chelsea 3
Tottenham 2
Blackburn 1
Swansea 1
Birmingham 1
Leicester 1
Middlesbrough 1

 

[sausage]

During Enic's reign Tottenham Hotspur have lost 4 major cup finals in 18 years. Winning just 1 League Cup.

In the 119 years prior to that Spurs had only ever lost 3.

Everything ENIC has done in terms of running the club, infrastructure (Stadium & Training Ground) and leagues finishes (2010s has seen 5 UCL qualifications and top 6 every season) is very impressive, especially give the 90s and competitor's mad spending. In the FA Cup alone however, the club still fails to reach its first final since 1991, losing 5 Semi-Finals (2001, 2010, 2012, 2017, 2018) in the process. Whilst there has been a great increases in competing on the field and off field matters namely revenues, there has been no improvement whatsoever in winning trophies, in fact, it's got worse.

As @davidmatzdorf has also suggested, this is due to circumstances we can't control. ENICs involvement has coincided with a competitive explosion caused by the injection of eastern funds.

If anything, we should be glad we have been able to get to where we are without that. Imagine the league without City having spent a few billion over the last 10-15 years - we'd have probably won the league at least once.

 

[Wheeler Dealer]

It will be difficult to find a buyer, as the project here is complete, so the cost to buy will be accessible to the a very small group. I suspect ENIC will be looking for around £2bn to buy the club. Add a further £500m required to get a team fit for a PL challenge, then this makes it a a big, big investment for anyone, even an oil state / baron.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

As @davidmatzdorf has also suggested, this is due to circumstances we can't control. ENICs involvement has coincided with a competitive explosion caused by the injection of eastern funds.

If anything, we should be glad we have been able to get to where we are without that. Imagine the league without City having spent a few billion over the last 10-15 years - we'd have probably won the league at least once.

Spot on. Look ENIC & Levy are by no means perfect but given the improvement we have made off the pitch (training ground and stadium) no other club comes close to this during the time ENIC took us over, on the pitch we got it a bit wrong with some transfers and managers but generally our league finishes have consistently got higher and we’ve generally improved pretty much year on year give or take.

Now I don’t know the ins and outs of the club but the only way I see ENIC improving is the football set-up: scouting network, transfers and manager recruitment, it all could be improved and needs to all be aligned very closely. I don’t think it’s terrible but the dream scenario is Man City where regardless of the money they give pep, their Chairman and Director of Football are football people and they have experience of building winning teams at Barcelona and they’ve backed pep 100% football wise to enable them to do that. Now I don’t doubt levy wants to improve us on the pitch especially now the infrastructure etc is in place but can we say for certain that the scouting is top notch and that the transfer strategy is fully in line with the manager, recent window perhaps but it’s not always been like that.

So while I don’t think they’re perfect I think the ENIC moaners need to have a lottle
Fucking perspective about how much they’ve done for us and how far forward they’ve improved us overall as a club.

 

[spursfan77]

We could have always spent more but, for me, it's more to do with the quality of those we have bought in the last three years or so.
30 million on Sissoko, 40 on Davidson Sanchez, 25 on Aurier, 17 on Janssen, 8 on GKN.
Thats 120 million which should have been more than enough to replace an aging Dembele and Jan, a backup for Kane, and a wantaway Walker.
Our first team is not as good as it was three years ago and I feel it has more to do with poor use of the money we had rather than the amount.

Definitely.

I think we operate best with a director of football or head transfer honcho who decides on the players and then they are signed if the manager wants them. Levy likes this too, it’s Poch who apparently wants full control on transfers. Trouble is, it doesn’t seem to be working. I suspect it’s because Levy wants a say too. If there is one person who isn’t the owner directing the transfer ship then we’d be better off. Definitely better of dealing deals anyway, which seems to be our problem.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

Definitely.

I think we operate best with a director of football or head transfer honcho who decides on the players and then they are signed if the manager wants them. Levy likes this too, it’s Poch who apparently wants full control on transfers. Trouble is, it doesn’t seem to be working. I suspect it’s because Levy wants a say too. If there is one person who isn’t the owner directing the transfer ship then we’d be better off. Definitely better of dealing deals anyway, which seems to be our problem.

Spot on. This has always been our downfall with levy, the football set-up. If we got that right we’d have got over the line and won something. This is why man.u are now a mess.

 

[sausage]

Definitely.

I think we operate best with a director of football or head transfer honcho who decides on the players and then they are signed if the manager wants them. Levy likes this too, it’s Poch who apparently wants full control on transfers. Trouble is, it doesn’t seem to be working. I suspect it’s because Levy wants a say too. If there is one person who isn’t the owner directing the transfer ship then we’d be better off. Definitely better of dealing deals anyway, which seems to be our problem.

If anyone can point out the evidence of Poch actually being good at picking a signing, then there's some weight towards it. I suspect, from a cursory thought/memory, that it's far from the truth.

That's if you ignore the general thing where people attribute good signings to Poch and claim all the bad signings are Levy ones, despite all the evidence.

 

[spursfan77]

Spot on. This has always been our downfall with levy, the football set-up. If we got that right we’d have got over the line and won something. This is why man.u are now a mess.

All his DofF’s have been a success to some extent. Arnesen, commolli, baldini.

 

[LeSoupeKitchen]

During Enic's reign Tottenham Hotspur have lost 4 major cup finals in 18 years. Winning just 1 League Cup.

In the 119 years prior to that Spurs had only ever lost 3.

Everything ENIC has done in terms of running the club, infrastructure (Stadium & Training Ground) and leagues finishes (2010s has seen 5 UCL qualifications and top 6 every season) is very impressive, especially give the 90s and competitor's mad spending. In the FA Cup alone however, the club still fails to reach its first final since 1991, losing 5 Semi-Finals (2001, 2010, 2012, 2017, 2018) in the process. Whilst there has been a great increases in competing on the field and off field matters namely revenues, there has been no improvement whatsoever in winning trophies, in fact, it's got worse.

Spurs' last eight FA Cup semi-finals
21 April 2018 - L 1-2 v Man Utd
22 April 2017- L 2-4 v Chelsea
15 April 2012 - L 1-5 v Chelsea
11 April 2010 - L 0-2 v Portsmouth (AET)
8 April 2001 - L 1-2 v Arsenal
11 April 1999 - L 0-2 v Newcastle (AET)
9 April 1995 - L 1-4 v Everton
4 April 1993 - L 0-1 v Arsenal

 

[Donki]

With respect, the last thing we need is American businessman. See Arsenal - the last thing we need is PowerPoints, buzzwords and charts.

On reflection, I think I’m happy with our owners (you just got to sit in the stadium) with a bit of ‘flexing’ up to our new financial reality.

I think it will be harder to get better to be honest and easy to get worse - much worse.

Grass is always greener isn’t it, look at United, a trurely iconic club reduced to nothing more than a cash cow. People laugh but we could easily have been bought buy Lerner. Just fucking imagine where we would be.

 

[Graysonti]

Now with the infrastructure in place, the main value is in trophies and sponsorship spin offs.

I expect the club to now turn their attention to this without other distractions.

 

[hellava_tough]

It will be difficult to find a buyer, as the project here is complete, so the cost to buy will be accessible to the a very small group. I suspect ENIC will be looking for around £2bn to buy the club. Add a further £500m required to get a team fit for a PL challenge, then this makes it a a big, big investment for anyone, even an oil state / baron.

You might get an individual, or investment firm that wants to 'diversify their assets' so to speak, so invest in a fairly stable brand (relative to how much they purchase us for) as a bit of a safe haven for their money.

 

[ginola99]

Spurs' last eight FA Cup semi-finals
21 April 2018 - L 1-2 v Man Utd
22 April 2017- L 2-4 v Chelsea
15 April 2012 - L 1-5 v Chelsea
11 April 2010 - L 0-2 v Portsmouth (AET)
8 April 2001 - L 1-2 v Arsenal
11 April 1999 - L 0-2 v Newcastle (AET)
9 April 1995 - L 1-4 v Everton
4 April 1993 - L 0-1 v Arsenal

Don't worry, I know it's 8 defeats, meant 5 of those have happened under ENIC.

Just to clarify, my post isn't 'ENIC Out' just stating the obvious, everything has been very impressive during their reign, bar one thing, trophies, which has been all but nonexistent.

Whilst competition has been extremely strong it also had its faults (think 2015/16) and the club has sadly failed to take advantage of that like Liverpool have (Man Utd and Man City can still outspend the Merseysiders for a giggle). I think the summer of 2016 was a big missed opportunity, had we signed Mane and batshuayi, instead of N'koudou and Jansen things could've been and be very different. Sadly, we'll never know.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

All his DofF’s have been a success to some extent. Arnesen, commolli, baldini.

Agree with that mate, just that overall our transfer strategy and alignment with manager etc could be better. Also our youth and general scouting could be better.

 

[Wheeler Dealer]

Agree with that mate, just that overall our transfer strategy and alignment with manager etc could be better. Also our youth and general scouting could be better.

I don't believe we are any better or worse than our main competitors. I think all of us have had challenges.

 

[piedpiper]

If anyone can point out the evidence of Poch actually being good at picking a signing, then there's some weight towards it. I suspect, from a cursory thought/memory, that it's far from the truth.

That's if you ignore the general thing where people attribute good signings to Poch and claim all the bad signings are Levy ones, despite all the evidence.

Agree, the moment I heard he had no interest in Tielemans who was available, I stated scratching my head. I've never advocated huge money signings and did get all excited when we paid huge fees for Ndombele or Lo Celso. I'm not opposed to such signings but loved it when we stole a March on our competitors and signed Dele, Dier, Eriksen & Toby for like 20-22 million.

I wonder what's happened to our scouting.

 

[Metalhead]

As @davidmatzdorf has also suggested, this is due to circumstances we can't control. ENICs involvement has coincided with a competitive explosion caused by the injection of eastern funds.

If anything, we should be glad we have been able to get to where we are without that. Imagine the league without City having spent a few billion over the last 10-15 years - we'd have probably won the league at least once.

The season where Leicester won feels like a genuinely missed opportunity. The season where we bought Nelson and Saha to a lesser extent. Apart from that, I feel like we are where we could expect to be based on investment. My worry at the moment, like with all of you is the massive expenditure needed to replace the defence and the fact that we are not exactly looking cohesive. At the end of the day, we should all try and avoid the blame game - the owners and manager and everyone connected to the club all have a greater or lesser degree of responsibility to help make the club a success.