Gift Orban

[barry]

Yeah there's a reason it's extremely rare for young Championship/lower league players to make the jump straight to top 6 clubs and do well.

Usually they need a stepping stone club in between to get the minutes at the top level and develop.

Beyond Alli I struggle to think of many Champ/League 1 players that went straight to a top club and made an instant impact (not including players loaned). And even we were a Europa league team in a much weaker prem when Alli joined.

Even if the talent is there most top clubs simply don't give them enough minutes so they get sold on.

And sadly, the reason Orban might actually work out at Spurs is cos we're now an 8th placed team willing to punt on an unproven player and we're actually in a position to give him minutes. If we were in the top 4 he'd be much less likely to get into the side.

Caicedo

 

[Revo19]

I literally said in my post that it’s worth a punt at reasonable price. The thing I’m opposed to is those saying they’ve seen a potential next superstar from a 10 minute YouTube video, it’s absolute nonsense. By all means sign Orban but he shouldn’t have anything to do with our plans to replace Kane, a much higher calibre and more proven level of player is required

Agree with this completely. How anyone can truly asses his level and make statements as though he is a generational talent or a player we cannot miss out on is speculative at best. In fact, he looks quite raw and unrefined in some aspects in the YouTube clips - he doesn’t look like a bad punt but that’s exactly what it will be given the level he is currently playing at. Elye Wahi looks slightly more refined with better technical ability and can contribute to the build up but again some of his finishing is untidy.

Of course there is potential and scope for improvement in these young players but if you’re looking to replace a world class centre forward with a punt from the Belgian league we will be disappointed more often than not. Kolo Muani would be a better profile and fit despite not being a goal machine. There are more examples of failures from the lesser leagues than successes. Karim Adeyemi is another example although again he looks more refined and the hope is he overcomes his injury issues and has an improved season. Daka is another one.

 

[barry]

Yeah there's a reason it's extremely rare for young Championship/lower league players to make the jump straight to top 6 clubs and do well.

Usually they need a stepping stone club in between to get the minutes at the top level and develop.

Beyond Alli I struggle to think of many Champ/League 1 players that went straight to a top club and made an instant impact (not including players loaned). And even we were a Europa league team in a much weaker prem when Alli joined.

Even if the talent is there most top clubs simply don't give them enough minutes so they get sold on.

And sadly, the reason Orban might actually work out at Spurs is cos we're now an 8th placed team willing to punt on an unproven player and we're actually in a position to give him minutes. If we were in the top 4 he'd be much less likely to get into the side.

Probably everyone at Brighton. Loads did stints in Belgium or worse, now worth 100m

 

[Timberwolf]

Caicedo

Brighton are the stepping stone though...they were a mid table club when they developed those players.

If anything that proves my point.

If Caicedo or MacAllister had gone straight to Chelsea or Liverpool they wouldn't have got a game. Or at least not enough games to develop to the levels they are now.

 

[barry]

Brighton are the stepping stone though..

Ahhh..I get you. Then I agree. Booze related stupidity

 

[mill]

Yeah there's a reason it's extremely rare for young Championship/lower league players to make the jump straight to top 6 clubs and do well.

Usually they need a stepping stone club in between to get the minutes at the top level and develop.

Beyond Alli I struggle to think of many Champ/League 1 players that went straight to a top club and made an instant impact (not including players loaned). And even we were a Europa league team in a much weaker prem when Alli joined.

Even if the talent is there most top clubs simply don't give them enough minutes so they get sold on.

And sadly, the reason Orban might actually work out at Spurs is cos we're now an 8th placed team willing to punt on an unproven player and we're actually in a position to give him minutes. If we were in the top 4 he'd be much less likely to get into the side.

Look at how Zaha struggled at united but ended going to palace and ended up excelling, I’m sure there’s plod other examples too, sometimes players need games and time to develop

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

Given Ange’s quotes on Veliz it makes Orban or another striker arriving much more likely I’d say:

"He's a young guy, it's a fairly different level. He's one we'll invest in in the long-term but I wouldn't expect him to see any minutes in the first part of the season."

 

[Klinsmannesque]

I literally said in my post that it’s worth a punt at reasonable price. The thing I’m opposed to is those saying they’ve seen a potential next superstar from a 10 minute YouTube video, it’s absolute nonsense. By all means sign Orban but he shouldn’t have anything to do with our plans to replace Kane, a much higher calibre and more proven level of player is required

Excuse me I watched the 10min YouTube AND 70 mins of Gent vs Pogoń Szczecin and I’m telling you he’s special

 

[Sandro30]

 

[andy00900]

Tier 1 for me

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

he shouldn’t have anything to do with our plans to replace Kane, a much higher calibre and more proven level of player is required

We just spent £60M on Richarlison - we probably ought to give him a shot to play the position for 5 minutes before deciding we need to replace him, don't you think?

Get a good young striker to back him up - and if Richarlison fails, you still have Son, and then you re-examine next summer.

But, it's just not smart business to put all of your resources into one position. Make the "big" money signing a winger who is fit orange's tactics, and re-visit striker next summer, if needed.

 

[Pekoni]

HERE WE GO

It’s an enormous risk but what the hell, I’m all for it. Get it done.

 

[Flobadob]

We just spent £60M on Richarlison - we probably ought to give him a shot to play the position for 5 minutes before deciding we need to replace him, don't you think?

Get a good young striker to back him up - and if Richarlison fails, you still have Son, and then you re-examine next summer.

But, it's just not smart business to put all of your resources into one position. Make the "big" money signing a winger who is fit orange's tactics, and re-visit striker next summer, if needed.

Richarlison’s ability isn’t the question mark for me, it’s his form and fitness being pretty horrendous. It takes a good 5-10 game run of 90 minutes to properly get in your groove as a striker and he’s managed 3 in a row so far since he signed. If you could guarantee me Richy stayed fit all season long I’d be pretty content with him being our no.1 tbf. Who would you sign as the winger fit for Ange’s system? If we signed a top winger and Orban with the Kane money and used Son as a striker I’d be cool with it. That would likely have enough goals in it and proven experience. I’ve reiterated numerous times that I really like the look of our team now and the main reason I don’t want 3 punts (hypothetically) is because I see no need for it. I see the need to keep ourselves with a very good starting 11 in all positions to give ourselves the chance to get back into the CL (top 5).

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

Who would you sign as the winger fit for Ange’s system?

I’m assuming that if Eze came in, he would play as a winger. Guy who can take people on and get a ball into the box. Not sure he can play on the right though. Also doubt Palace would sell Olise and Eze.

 

[Now it's Spursonal]

Sacha Tavolieri, for those who don't know, is the go-to guy when it comes to the Belgium league or Belgian players.

 

[amathews3416]

Brighton are the stepping stone though...they were a mid table club when they developed those players.

If anything that proves my point.

If Caicedo or MacAllister had gone straight to Chelsea or Liverpool they wouldn't have got a game. Or at least not enough games to develop to the levels they are now.

Unfortunately, we are not competing or have the money to sign players like Caicedo or MacAllister. That’s just the reality of our current leadership. So I think some people, including myself, realize the only way for us to acquire world class talent is to buy them when they are young and hope to develop and hit the lottery on them.

 

[vinsomer]

Superb thread with in-depth analysis on Orban. Hard to not get excited really

 

[Flobadob]

I’m assuming that if Eze came in, he would play as a winger. Guy who can take people on and get a ball into the box. Not sure he can play on the right though. Also doubt Palace would sell Olise and Eze.

WLB just linked us to Kudus in the ITK thread. If you agree with me that a goalscoring winger/attacking midfielder that can beat players for absolute fun is ideal for Ange’s system then he would be an excellent addition. Kudus, Orban and Vlahovic would be the ideal scenario for me. A perfect winger for Ange’s system, an elite (my opinion) striker for the here and now and a young prospect, that would be worthy of sacrificing our best player for me

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

WLB just linked us to Kudus in the ITK thread. If you agree with me that a goalscoring winger/attacking midfielder that can beat players for absolute fun is ideal for Ange’s system then he would be an excellent addition. Kudus, Orban and Vlahovic would be the ideal scenario for me. A perfect winger for Ange’s system, an elite (my opinion) striker for the here and now and a young prospect, that would be worthy of sacrificing our best player for me

Think we still need another CB and probably a CM. Vlhovic Orban and Kudos alone would take more than we got from Kane.

I think one overlooked part of the Kane deal though might have been the structure where it looks like Levy got most of the money up front and not over years. That flexibility could help stretch our budget this year - so more deals can be paid off in later years.

 

[Now it's Spursonal]

Superb thread with in-depth analysis on Orban. Hard to not get excited really

Sorry to disappoint you mate, but this fella is a clown and should be blocked by all spurs fans.

Have a look at his description of Alejo Veliz analysis and you'll realise he's a troll who's making up sensationalist stuff about all spurs news. Whether it's to build a following or as a piss take, I dont know, but he's 100% pedalling shit.

Sidenote: Gift Orban does really seem quite exciting though.