Harry Winks - Leicester City

[Ronwol196061]

Unfortunately he isn't a Carrick either. Carrick was a tremendous forward passer, could pass between the lines with his eyes closed, read the game exceptionally, always knew exactly where to be to intercept the ball. We are talking about a key CM of multiple title winning United sides. Winks isn't fit to lace his boots.

I wasn't talking about the quality,more the style.

 

[teedee]

A bit of a dip? Please tell me when he had this glorious run of top form which preceded this said dip?

Analysing his spurs career to date, you actually have a bang average academy kid who everyone got excited about and overrated and started comparing to Modric, Poch had a hard on for and of which partly led to him losing his job, he had a ridiculously short peak where he played well in two CL games against good opposition, and now he’s reverted to the average player he is. I’ve never seen Winks put in a top class display against PL opposition, that says it all. Has he even ever won a MOM award for Spurs in 100 appearances in the PL? Of over 100 first team appearances he still dines out on two CL appearances where he didn’t even register an assist or a goal. The number of goals for Spurs he has scored you can count on one hand. He doesn't offer any defensive protection, and he doesn't offer any creativity or goal threat.

He should be at a mid table PL club, he hasn't dipped, this is just his level.

Sit on the fence why don't you?

 

[buckley]

Southgate has stated that Winks is vital to the way England play and so good enough for England but not good enough for Spurs .
For myself I am no having the "not good enough for spurs " stance .
I rate him highly and just hope the Jose can find the way to get the best out of him as playing in a holding midfield position is not his game and playing him further forwards will pay dividends .

 

[dagraham]

Southgate has stated that Winks is vital to the way England play and so good enough for England but not good enough for Spurs .
For myself I am no having the "not good enough for spurs " stance .
I rate him highly and just hope the Jose can find the way to get the best out of him as playing in a holding midfield position is not his game and playing him further forwards will pay dividends .

Well to be fair England’s pool of CM players are the worst in my living memory.

 

[Primativ]

I wasn't talking about the quality,more the style.

Sure, unfortunately for Winks - to be successful as that style of midfielder. I.e. a Carrick, or an Xavi Alonso, you have to be an outstanding forward passer from deep with brilliant vision. You also have to read the game exceptionally well, because in that position players like Carrick actually offered defensive protection because of their positioning, they didn't need to dive in to tackles because they nipped the ball off players and intercepted it. If you don't possess any of those qualities, you just get a Winks. He runs around like a headless chicken in CM, diving into tackles, getting booked, getting passed around easily, when in possession he's limited, making 5 yard sideways passes. He may make the occasional good forward pass to create a chance, but they are extremely rare. Am I being unfair? No, this is what he plays like. A less effective more passive Scott Parker is really what he is.

 

[Havre]

A bit of a dip? Please tell me when he had this glorious run of top form which preceded this said dip?

Analysing his spurs career to date, you actually have a bang average academy kid who everyone got excited about and overrated and started comparing to Modric, Poch had a hard on for and of which partly led to him losing his job, he had a ridiculously short peak where he played well in two CL games against good opposition, and now he’s reverted to the average player he is. I’ve never seen Winks put in a top class display against PL opposition, that says it all. Has he even ever won a MOM award for Spurs in 100 appearances in the PL? Of over 100 first team appearances he still dines out on two CL appearances where he didn’t even register an assist or a goal. The number of goals for Spurs he has scored you can count on one hand. He doesn't offer any defensive protection, and he doesn't offer any creativity or goal threat.

He should be at a mid table PL club, he hasn't dipped, this is just his level.

I guess I can relate to parts of this post. You see the potential occasionally with Winks, but I agree he tends to revert back to average (or even worse than average).

As for the numbers. Has he played 100 games in the PL? As far as I can see he has only played in 79 and only 41 of those he started (whoscored.com). In those 79 games he has only averaged 49 mins per game. All in all in the PL he has played the equivalent of 43 full matches.

I don't know if Winks will take that next step if he plays regularly for a spell longer than just some months - which have been the case so far in his career, but I still think it could happen. He is a hard worker. He is capable of some decent passing both short and through balls. He can run passed players. He is just so timid in his style. Very similar to KWP. As Sherwood pointed out in the analysis for that pass to Kane. Winks didn't hit it right away he had to think about it at least twice before he finally made that pass. He has to be more decisive. I just wish he went all in - and maybe he won't swim, but I believe there might be a player there.

I think Henderson is a decent comparison. For so long he was seen as a sideway passer with not enough smartness in his game. Not suggesting Henderson is brilliant, but it took a lot more than starting 41 PL games before he reached his potential.

 

[Ronwol196061]

Southgate has stated that Winks is vital to the way England play and so good enough for England but not good enough for Spurs .
For myself I am no having the "not good enough for spurs " stance .
I rate him highly and just hope the Jose can find the way to get the best out of him as playing in a holding midfield position is not his game and playing him further forwards will pay dividends .

I would say not right enough to play for Spurs. As a back up CM.Ok. but according to Transfer Mkt he is worth 45 mil. This is a figure that could sit on the bench for Liverpool or City etc. But for 45 mil and add 15 mil say we could get a quality DM (maybe)

 

[Primativ]

I guess I can relate to parts of this post. You see the potential occasionally with Winks, but I agree he tends to revert back to average (or even worse than average).

As for the numbers. Has he played 100 games in the PL? As far as I can see he has only played in 79 and only 41 of those he started (whoscored.com). In those 79 games he has only averaged 49 mins per game. All in all in the PL he has played the equivalent of 43 full matches.

I don't know if Winks will take that next step if he plays regularly for a spell longer than just some months - which have been the case so far in his career, but I still think it could happen. He is a hard worker. He is capable of some decent passing both short and through balls. He can run passed players. He is just so timid in his style. Very similar to KWP. As Sherwood pointed out in the analysis for that pass to Kane. Winks didn't hit it right away he had to think about it at least twice before he finally made that pass. He has to be more decisive. I just wish he went all in - and maybe he won't swim, but I believe there might be a player there.

I think Henderson is a decent comparison. For so long he was seen as a sideway passer with not enough smartness in his game. Not suggesting Henderson is brilliant, but it took a lot more than starting 41 PL games before he reached his potential.

With regards to your Henderson comparison, Henderson had played 79 games by the age of 21. He also managed full seasons without injuries, again Winks suffers lots of injuries. Henderson managed 5 PL goals in his first 79 PL games.

Winks has played a really low number of games for his age. He's nearly 24 years old and 79 appearances is quite poor. 2 senior goals in 79 games is also really poor.

Of course, there is always the possibility of a late bloomer and that Winks could improve remarkably, but we don't have the luxury of giving Winks another 50 starts to see if he does make it or not, we need top quality in CM now. As ever it is down to the manager, but personally I think under Mourinho, Winks will find game time limited and he won't see many starts and will probably have to move on or be happy with being a squad player. I think he needs 38 starts a season if he is to develop and he won't get it at Spurs. Time will tell but let's be honest, does anyone see our central midfield next season being Winks and Ndombele? It doesn't work, they don't compliment each other.

 

[Stamford]

I thought he would have kicked on by now, I've always advocated for him starting but he's not a kid anymore. Needs a sharp upturn in form to justify his selection

 

[parj]

Why are people counting the number of goals and assists that Winks has? We usually have 4 or 5 attackers on the pitch with him, and with attacking full backs Winks is the type of player to keep feeding those 6 or 7 attacking options.

Harry Winks is not the final third player, he is the player that gets the ball into the middle third and release one of the attacking "options". The only reason he looking poor is because only Son has been giving him options consistently over the last 12-18 months.

I seen comparisons to Henderson and he was about for quite a while until klopp played to his strengths.

For us to play to Winks strength, he needs options but also needs players moving quickly for him. Our attacking problems are not Harry Winks, they are the team not moving. Anyone who thinks he is a DM needs their head examining, however, with 2 quality CBs behind him and energetic full backs he could do that role and allow us an extra attacker. Remember, Dier and Dembele were at their best when we had Walker and Rose playing at their best.

 

[Havre]

With regards to your Henderson comparison, Henderson had played 79 games by the age of 21. He also managed full seasons without injuries, again Winks suffers lots of injuries. Henderson managed 5 PL goals in his first 79 PL games.

Winks has played a really low number of games for his age. He's nearly 24 years old and 79 appearances is quite poor. 2 senior goals in 79 games is also really poor.

Of course, there is always the possibility of a late bloomer and that Winks could improve remarkably, but we don't have the luxury of giving Winks another 50 starts to see if he does make it or not, we need top quality in CM now. As ever it is down to the manager, but personally I think under Mourinho, Winks will find game time limited and he won't see many starts and will probably have to move on or be happy with being a squad player. I think he needs 38 starts a season if he is to develop and he won't get it at Spurs. Time will tell but let's be honest, does anyone see our central midfield next season being Winks and Ndombele? It doesn't work, they don't compliment each other.

Always a difficult thing this. Should a player be given time or not? I am not sure if it was worth it with Sissoko, but another example of a player that quite suddenly "got it". If Winks can improve only a fraction of how Sissoko improved he will be very very useful.

Are the injuries a case of him not being able to handle the PL or has he just been unlucky? I couldn't tell, but if it isn't the former it is a bit odd using the injuries against him.

Personally I would love to see him alongside N'Dombele for the rest of the season. I don't think we will find a better CM in this window and to me they are our best CMs (because I don't think Eriksen, Lo Celso and Sissoko are CMs) and I think Winks will benefit greatly having someone next to him that can pass the ball and still hold his ground defensively. Winks is not good enough to carry players like Dier and Sissoko in possession and not solid enough defensively to cover for someone like Eriksen. Very few players are good enough for those things - it has to be said.

 

[rsmith]

Agree with Hevre. I'm calling it now that Winks and Newdembele will click into one of the best midfields in the country.

 

[Havre]

I don't want to hammer on about players that have after a fairly long time suddenly taken steps. I am not arguing that every player will become good if they are just played enough - that is obviously not the case, but look at Sanchez. Might argue it is slightly different for a CD, but only a couple of months ago I had almost given up on him. I am sure he will still have proper poor games again, but his demeanor is just completely different lately. Not good on the ball, but in those one on one situations defensively he moves like he is in control. He doesn't look like that scared animal that could suddenly rush into tackles or give away a penalty at any moment any longer. I am sure he still will do those things occasionally, but to me he looks changed.

I hope to see that same change in demeanor from Winks, but I don't think that will just suddenly happen - he needs to play a lot more on a regular basis than he ever has in his career so far - like Sanchez.

 

[Syn_13]

Agree with Hevre. I'm calling it now that Winks and Newdembele will click into one of the best midfields in the country.

I genuinely don't know if they will work together as a 2 man midfield. Neither are defensively astute or will put in the shift to break up play throughout the 90 minutes. If we're playing Winks and Ndombele together then we need a Fernandinho type to do the dirty work for them.

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

Always a difficult thing this. Should a player be given time or not? I am not sure if it was worth it with Sissoko, but another example of a player that quite suddenly "got it". If Winks can improve only a fraction of how Sissoko improved he will be very very useful.

Are the injuries a case of him not being able to handle the PL or has he just been unlucky? I couldn't tell, but if it isn't the former it is a bit odd using the injuries against him.

Personally I would love to see him alongside N'Dombele for the rest of the season. I don't think we will find a better CM in this window and to me they are our best CMs (because I don't think Eriksen, Lo Celso and Sissoko are CMs) and I think Winks will benefit greatly having someone next to him that can pass the ball and still hold his ground defensively. Winks is not good enough to carry players like Dier and Sissoko in possession and not solid enough defensively to cover for someone like Eriksen. Very few players are good enough for those things - it has to be said.

This is a very sensible post. If NDombele can up his work rate then he and Winks could be bar far our best CM duo.

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

I genuinely don't know if they will work together as a 2 man midfield. Neither are defensively astute or will put in the shift to break up play throughout the 90 minutes. If we're playing Winks and Ndombele together then we need a Fernandinho type to do the dirty work for them.

Not necessarily. Winks has shown he can play a disciplined role when the team is functioning well. If Aurier continues to abandon his defensive duties and the front players only make halfhearted attempts to press then yes any CM duo will have problems.

 

[ardiles]

What we need is a proper top DM. Once we get him, our midfield will click.

 

[Wheeler Dealer]

Southgate has stated that Winks is vital to the way England play and so good enough for England but not good enough for Spurs .
For myself I am no having the "not good enough for spurs " stance .
I rate him highly and just hope the Jose can find the way to get the best out of him as playing in a holding midfield position is not his game and playing him further forwards will pay dividends .

Trippier ahead of Alexander-Arnold and Walker would sum up an England selection.

 

[buckley]

To my memory this is about as good as it gets for many a year with England so Southgate must be doing something right .

 

[ikky]

Winks is a good player,that can only become a great player if he took on an attacking MF role and succeeded or a defensive one. He is in the middle of both and not much of either.Thats his problem. We can see some great passes on the rare occasion,and some good tackles occasionally too He has always seemed a bit of a Carrick type. Im not sure where this works with us. We need a strong DM behind Ndombele.
Skipp seems a better prospect at the CM spot than Winks. Winks is listed at 45 mil on Transfer Market,Im not sure if that's a close figure for him but if we need to sell to buy,I think using 45 m towards a quality DM would help

If we could get £45m for him I’d bite their hand off.