Player Ratings vs Man City

[StartingPrice]

This is serious...SP is the king of the optimists..

Oh yeah:

Wobbly Chops minus ten:roll:

Not the King, Good Pard'Ner, just the spokesperson :wink:

And it is not that serious - we won't line up like that again...and the rat will get better, too, either that or I will hunt him down and ensure he doesn't have any childres <CENSOR EVASION>

 

[Legend10]

It's afew hours now plus I've had the enjoyment of watching Arse make us look good and commiting similar suicide to us!

Firstly I'm going to say that I don't actually blame the players for this defeat, they might have been the ones in the shirts but when you effectively play back 4 against an incredibly strong front 4 you're pretty much going to get done every single time and quite often heavily. 4 attacking midfield players was simply a mond boggling decision.

Friedel 6 - Only a sniff of a chance with the Aguero goal, the others none.

Charlie 6 - done ok
Dawson 5 - Everything is so desperate and can't keep possesion, Aguero squared him up so easily for his goal.
Kaboom 4 - Just couldn't cope in a one on one with Dzeko, got no help at all.
Benny 6 - Done ok

Lennon 6 - Gave Clichy one or two problems at least and bale should have scored.
Niko 5 - He's a creator left to deal with 3 with our other creator.
Luka 6 - had no chance in there
Bale 5 - needs more commitment, fantastic cross for Crouch!

VDV 7 - Ran his nuts off whilst Crouch just stood there and watched him.

Crouch - I can't mark him, simply the worst performance I've ever seen from a pro.


Hudd 4 - So so slow, just passed him by.
Defoe 7 - Looked sharp and at least he was prepared to have a go and made his own space.
Jake 6 - Done well in dire circumstances.

 

[theShiznit]

How can a man that looks like Deputy dawg after a rough night instill passion into anyone...

Like at OT totally gave up after going 2-0 down.

 

[kkemal]

I have that feeling that he's a damn good accountant and done a great job on our books, but he was prepared to let us lose to the 2 Mancs rather than get deals done in time to have the players we needed when we needed them. Now we are going to play catch up with Liverpool and Arsenal for the rest of the season, if indeed we can.

Levy's a good chaiman but has an accountant's mentality not a risk takers.

We dont want a gambler running the club but we need him to take some chances. He's begining to look like The Wenger of footbal chairmen, scared to take a chance. Dzeko, Suarez both to big a risk for the money.

Yawn!!! I want trophies and big name players, I want signings in July not august 31st! Stop making excuses for levy and wake up! He's a tight git!!!!!

 

[camaj]

I missed the start of the game today so I can't really give any scores but I have some comments anyway, just bear in mind that I'm basing it on 2/3 of the match

Friedel - I don't dislike him, I think he'd be a handy second choice keeper but I still think Gomes is amazing. It winds me up when people say Gomes "flaps" when it appears they mean Gomes punches crosses clear. I'm not sure why that's a bad thing but how many goals have we conceded from crosses? Friedel doesn't come and deal with the danger. To be fair, he couldn't do much about the Utd crosses but he could have today.

He didn't handle the one on one well either, he made it easier for the striker

Kaboul - He'd be my first choice RB, maybe second after walker but he's been awful at CB these past two games. Should have at least jumped for one of those crosses.

Dawson - Again, he's a good defender but he was asleep for their first goal

Crouch - Knew we'd lose when I saw him on the team sheet. I feel bad criticising him all the time because it's not his fault he keeps getting picked but whatever we're paying him, it's too much.

Defoe - I'm a big critic of Defoe but he was far better this week than he was on Monday night. If he'd taken some of those shots at Old Trafford we may have got something. Yes, most of them were straight at the keeper but he was really fired up and made a real difference when he came on.

Livermore - Very good when he came on. Reminds me of O'hara. Maybe the real reason we sold O'hara?

Lennon - Great move at one point but he seems to slow down when he should be turning the screw. Ended up with a FK I believe

Pav against Hearts last week was up alongside it.

Pav's finishing was the problem against Hearts. Crouch doesn't even cause problems

 

[DJS]

I've been out all today so only got the result late and have only just seen the team put out.

What on earth was fucking Redknapp thinking putting Krancjar in centre midfield alongside Modric against City...

 

[Bus-Conductor]

This game showed up all the weaknesses of Redknapp's management. Picking a midfield made up entirely of vanilla ice cream was stupid, but the (flawed) logic he applied was exactly the same as the logic that had him picking Modric and Hudd together in CM with Lennon and Bale previously - they were ok last week. Redknapp doesn't really believe in preparation, hard work, discipline, organisation. The game for him is far simpler. Kranjcar played well last week with Livermore against Hearts, so surely he will be ok with Modric against one of the strongest teams in our league ?

As ever this isn't just about the poor tactical choices, we might have gotten away with those if we were a well drilled, well organised, hard working side. But that's an even bigger joke. It's easy to blame Kaboul and Dawson for their part in the first four goals, but a proper side wouldn't be allowing the opposition to slowly waltz around un-challenged, un-pressed and create the opportunities.

That said, Redknapp's choice to continually pick Dawson is just another nail in his own coffin - as it was Jol's. He was awful on Thursday, and Bassong's pace would have far better complimented Kaboul, and would have perhaps been better at coping with players like Silva, Ageuro & Nasro etc. And we wouldn't have humped so many balls to no-one. We would have had the bonus of another footballer at the back.

The decision to offload Palacios is the stupidest since Jol decided to swap Kanoute for Mido. I'd have offloaded Huddlestone & Jenas before him.

For some reason Redknapp has decided to replace one of the best keepers in the EPL, who was superb at dealing with crosses, with a 40yo. We have now conceded 5 goals in 2 games from crosses. I don't think they were all Friedel's fault, but what is the fucking logic in this selection ? I do not understand it in any shape or form. We are replacing a fantastic keeper with a good one with no future past this year.

We are selling the only RB we have who can, move faster than a quick walk, attack and defend and retaining the slowest rb in the EPL and one that can't defend.

I barely remember anyone making a tackle for us the whole game.

Lennon and Bale seem to think they are only responsible for attacking and Bale in particular is not being taught that he has to track back and press and work for the team. This has to come from the coach and coaching. Bale must be taught, drilled, cajoled, explained to and eventually bollocked.

Lennon is a worse player now than at any time I can remember. Bale is showing zero development from that exciting kid that re-burst onto the scene.

But we could sign three world class players and it would not solve the problems we have. We are now where we were when Jol was sacked. A pretty shit defence playing behind a badly drilled bunch of players, some of whom are played out of position, with no fucking discipline.

Our football last year was showing very worrying signs of a complete lack of coaching. It was naive, open, lacking in cohesion, organisation, ethos and work rate.

I'm sick of watching the same mistakes, the same basic deficiencies. The same lack of preparation, organisation and hard work.

And why does Redknapp keep telling us about how unhappy Modric is. It is hardly endearing him to the fans and that is going to communicate itself from them to the player and make the situation worse for everyone.

We were like a house that was in the middle of a renovation. A long comes a chirpier builder who says "I can get that built in half the time" so you sack the existing builder and your house gets built on half the time, and you're chuffed, until you find out you've spent £100m and the house has been stuck together with old chewing gum and pretty lego and is in fact likely to blow down in a strong wind.

Fuck the ratings.

 

[OmarsComing]

saying Bale hasnt developed since when is a load of bollocks. Before Redknapp came in he was a nobody playing in the reserves.

Palacios is a good solid defensive midfielder but he cannot pass to a team mate who is further than 10 yards away - this is as big as Huddlestone's mobility problems and Jenas' lack of a brain problem.

Last season Gomes' mistakes were a fucking joke. Friedel has come in and we've played against the two best teams in the league - I think Friedel deserves to be judged over more than 2 games.

Totally agree with your assessment of Dawson.

Football is a joke now.

p.s Kaboul's positioning for the goals was nothing short of pathetic, but because he's one of your favourites, you forgot to slaughter him like you do with Donkey Dawson.

 

[TheGreenLily]

This game showed up all the weaknesses of Redknapp's management. Picking a midfield made up entirely of vanilla ice cream was stupid, but the (flawed) logic he applied was exactly the same as the logic that had him picking Modric and Hudd together in CM with Lennon and Bale previously - they were ok last week. Redknapp doesn't really believe in preparation, hard work, discipline, organisation. The game for him is far simpler. Kranjcar played well last week with Livermore against Hearts, so surely he will be ok with Modric against one of the strongest teams in our league ?

As ever this isn't just about the poor tactical choices, we might have gotten away with those if we were a well drilled, well organised, hard working side. But that's an even bigger joke. It's easy to blame Kaboul and Dawson for their part in the first four goals, but a proper side wouldn't be allowing the opposition to slowly waltz around un-challenged, un-pressed and create the opportunities.

That said, Redknapp's choice to continually pick Dawson is just another nail in his own coffin - as it was Jol's. He was awful on Thursday, and Bassong's pace would have far better complimented Kaboul, and would have perhaps been better at coping with players like Silva, Ageuro & Nasro etc. And we wouldn't have humped so many balls to no-one. We would have had the bonus of another footballer at the back.

The decision to offload Palacios is the stupidest since Jol decided to swap Kanoute for Mido. I'd have offloaded Huddlestone & Jenas before him.

For some reason Redknapp has decided to replace one of the best keepers in the EPL, who was superb at dealing with crosses, with a 40yo. We have now conceded 5 goals in 2 games from crosses. I don't think they were all Friedel's fault, but what is the fucking logic in this selection ? I do not understand it in any shape or form. We are replacing a fantastic keeper with a good one with no future past this year.

We are selling the only RB we have who can, move faster than a quick walk, attack and defend and retaining the slowest rb in the EPL and one that can't defend.

I barely remember anyone making a tackle for us the whole game.

Lennon and Bale seem to think they are only responsible for attacking and Bale in particular is not being taught that he has to track back and press and work for the team. This has to come from the coach and coaching. Bale must be taught, drilled, cajoled, explained to and eventually bollocked.

Lennon is a worse player now than at any time I can remember. Bale is showing zero development from that exciting kid that re-burst onto the scene.

But we could sign three world class players and it would not solve the problems we have. We are now where we were when Jol was sacked. A pretty shit defence playing behind a badly drilled bunch of players, some of whom are played out of position, with no fucking discipline.

Our football last year was showing very worrying signs of a complete lack of coaching. It was naive, open, lacking in cohesion, organisation, ethos and work rate.

I'm sick of watching the same mistakes, the same basic deficiencies. The same lack of preparation, organisation and hard work.

And why does Redknapp keep telling us about how unhappy Modric is. It is hardly endearing him to the fans and that is going to communicate itself from them to the player and make the situation worse for everyone.

We were like a house that was in the middle of a renovation. A long comes a chirpier builder who says "I can get that built in half the time" so you sack the existing builder and your house gets built on half the time, and you're chuffed, until you find out you've spent £100m and the house has been stuck together with old chewing gum and pretty lego and is in fact likely to blow down in a strong wind.

Fuck the ratings.

:clap:

 

[Mr Pink]

BC, I agree with a lot of that but a couple of points. I think Friedel has done well, and wasn't at fault for any of the goals - including United away. Maybe Aguero's.....being ultra critcal.

Hutton is just a poor defender for me, can't say he would of made any difference whatsoever, yeah he's more lively - but he's brain dead.

 

[fatpiranha]

Looking for the positives I think that BAE had a decent game and the Modric and Livermore played reasonably well. The truth is we were beaten by a better team and for the 2nd match running Krancjar was given a job he simply isn't capable of doing. This isn't a criticism of Krancjar (he's a good player in the right formation) but demonstrated Harry's tactical ineptitude.

 

[ultimateloner]

Modric is justified in wanting to leave.

 

[StartingPrice]

Modric is justified in wanting to leave.

That is a matter of opinion...but he is absolutely 100% damned and condemned for the sneaky, treacherous way he has gone about trying to affect it, in collusion with Chelsea :evil:

 

[sbrustad]

Been too depressed to even think about the game until now.

Friedel 5 - Can't be blamed with the horrendous help he got from the back four (Kaboul and Daws in particular). Not much of a presence on crosses however, which in turn may be part of the reason they knocked so many past him.

Charlie 5 - Can't expect much more. Couple of good interventions
Dawson 3 - Horrible ball distribution, no control in the back, never once looked like a proper captain.
Kaboul 1 - He grabbed himself a goal, if not he'd have gotten 0. Involved in 4 out of 5 goals against, and not in a good way. No positional awareness whatsoever when defending.
BAE 6 - In my opinion the only player in our back four that looked like a PL player tonight.

Lennon 4 - Seems to be playing without much confidence. Got a couple of balls in there, unfortunately we had Crouch up top.
Niko 5 - I really love Niko, but he's obviously not a CM.
Luka 4 - Is his heart really in it. Not at all his best performance.
Bale 4 - Should have scored, had one great crossball, otherwise very very anonymous.

Van der Vaart 7 - Worked his ass off even when all the other Spursplayers on the pitch had completely lost confidence. Not much end product, but who can blame him when Crouch has an even worse game than usual.

Crouch 2 - He was absolutely horrible but still not as bad as Kaboul. Hence the 2.

Huddlestone 3 - Not a game he'll want to remember. Poor distribution, and did he ever move faster than a slow jog tonight?
Livermore 5 - Looked lively, but obviously came on when the game was beyond all doubt and had little impact.
Defoe 5 - Compared to Crouch he looked like a world class striker tonight. Managed to test Hart a couple of times.

 

[sparx100]

Modric is justified in wanting to leave.

No he isn't. He has disrupted the club. We have played the top 2 teams in the league and lost due to tactics and injuries. Most teams will lose to them too, its just bad luck they are our first two games of the season.

 

[Chinaspur]

Looking for the positives I think that BAE had a decent game and the Modric and Livermore played reasonably well. The truth is we were beaten by a better team and for the 2nd match running Krancjar was given a job he simply isn't capable of doing. This isn't a criticism of Krancjar (he's a good player in the right formation) but demonstrated Harry's tactical ineptitude.

This for me was the only positive this game. Time and time again he looked like our only player on the pitch who felt comfortable on the ball.

 

[mpickard2087]

This game showed up all the weaknesses of Redknapp's management. Picking a midfield made up entirely of vanilla ice cream was stupid, but the (flawed) logic he applied was exactly the same as the logic that had him picking Modric and Hudd together in CM with Lennon and Bale previously - they were ok last week. Redknapp doesn't really believe in preparation, hard work, discipline, organisation. The game for him is far simpler. Kranjcar played well last week with Livermore against Hearts, so surely he will be ok with Modric against one of the strongest teams in our league ?

As ever this isn't just about the poor tactical choices, we might have gotten away with those if we were a well drilled, well organised, hard working side. But that's an even bigger joke. It's easy to blame Kaboul and Dawson for their part in the first four goals, but a proper side wouldn't be allowing the opposition to slowly waltz around un-challenged, un-pressed and create the opportunities.

That said, Redknapp's choice to continually pick Dawson is just another nail in his own coffin - as it was Jol's. He was awful on Thursday, and Bassong's pace would have far better complimented Kaboul, and would have perhaps been better at coping with players like Silva, Ageuro & Nasro etc. And we wouldn't have humped so many balls to no-one. We would have had the bonus of another footballer at the back.

The decision to offload Palacios is the stupidest since Jol decided to swap Kanoute for Mido. I'd have offloaded Huddlestone & Jenas before him.

For some reason Redknapp has decided to replace one of the best keepers in the EPL, who was superb at dealing with crosses, with a 40yo. We have now conceded 5 goals in 2 games from crosses. I don't think they were all Friedel's fault, but what is the fucking logic in this selection ? I do not understand it in any shape or form. We are replacing a fantastic keeper with a good one with no future past this year.

We are selling the only RB we have who can, move faster than a quick walk, attack and defend and retaining the slowest rb in the EPL and one that can't defend.

I barely remember anyone making a tackle for us the whole game.

Lennon and Bale seem to think they are only responsible for attacking and Bale in particular is not being taught that he has to track back and press and work for the team. This has to come from the coach and coaching. Bale must be taught, drilled, cajoled, explained to and eventually bollocked.

Lennon is a worse player now than at any time I can remember. Bale is showing zero development from that exciting kid that re-burst onto the scene.

But we could sign three world class players and it would not solve the problems we have. We are now where we were when Jol was sacked. A pretty shit defence playing behind a badly drilled bunch of players, some of whom are played out of position, with no fucking discipline.

Our football last year was showing very worrying signs of a complete lack of coaching. It was naive, open, lacking in cohesion, organisation, ethos and work rate.

I'm sick of watching the same mistakes, the same basic deficiencies. The same lack of preparation, organisation and hard work.

And why does Redknapp keep telling us about how unhappy Modric is. It is hardly endearing him to the fans and that is going to communicate itself from them to the player and make the situation worse for everyone.

We were like a house that was in the middle of a renovation. A long comes a chirpier builder who says "I can get that built in half the time" so you sack the existing builder and your house gets built on half the time, and you're chuffed, until you find out you've spent £100m and the house has been stuck together with old chewing gum and pretty lego and is in fact likely to blow down in a strong wind.

Fuck the ratings.

Cant argue with much of that. Some good points BC.

 

[steve]

Balance is crucial in football, as is hard work, intelligence and ultimately a team ethic. City had it in spades, we didn't.

I don't like Mancini, I think he's a smug fucker and he'll never revolutionise a club like Wenger has - obviously without the money he'd just be another manager. But his emphasis on defence, not conceding and hard work over flair that he brought in previous to this season is bearing fruit now. See players don't need to be encouraged a great deal when they have the ball - players of the class of Nasri, Silva, Aguero, Dzeko love having the ball, they know instinctively how to interact, pass and move, their close control and finishing are top class. Offensively they just need to be encouraged, to be confident and happy and then the rest will follow.

But off the ball is where a manager really earns his money. Getting world class shit kickers to do the dirty work is the key - tracking runners, busting a gut to get back when an attack has broken down, wingers doubling up to help full backs, attackers marking defenders PROPERLY at corners. Ultimately defending as a team, from the front and pressing the opposition into mistakes. Man City do it thanks to Mancini. We do it sometimes usually when we play the players to do it - think Sandro and Palacios in Milan. And when some are doing it it starts to become infectious - others will do it too.

For teams trying to play it short from the back the midfield 2 or 3 are key. The vast majority of balls will go through them so if they are shut down it's very hard for centre halves to play the short pass out, same for wingers. Lennon, Bale, Niko and Mod are never going to do it effectively, not in a million years. Barry and Toure do it as do De Jong and Milner. But as do Silva and Nasri crucially much better than Lennon and Bale.

City have better players than us - who realistically from Spurs would walk into their team? Maybe a fully fit Ledley is the only one I can think of. Modric would unbalance their midfield, De Jong and Toure compliment the creatives better than Sandro would. So how the fuck can we expect to compete with a vastly more talented team if we don't match them for work rate?

City today reminded me today of one of the uber Italian teams of the 80's or 90's an AC Milan or Juventus at their best. And they still are not playing at top speed. But it was with a wonderful balance of skill, strength and hard work.

If them and United are setting the benchmark then we need to make changes and stop being sentimental. Aguero did to Dawson what Torres did to him about 4 seasons ago - a world class player making a decent player look bad. But if we're aiming for the top do we need Dawson in the long term? Physically he'll never get quicker or more agile. Kaboul has all the physical charateristics required to make it but it needs to be hammered into him on the training pitch to switch on. He ball watches when he should be man watching.

Lennon is uber inconsistent with and without the ball. Nasri played a little give a go today and Lennon got left behind - it's not good enough. Bale is a lazy back tracker too, Niko shouldn't be playing CM against the likes of City and certainly not with an unhappy Modric beside him. Livermore isn't the future either and we still would've lost but he would've got closer to putting a tackle in than any of Niko, Mod or Tom (why bring off a slow, immobile non-presser and replace him with another?).

We can't match City over a season - they have some fantastic players and a manager who is striving for them to work their balls off - an excellent blend.
But we can work a hundred times harder than we do and SHOULD be matching if not excelling them for work effort. Parker, Diarra, Sandro will all help but it won't always cover up for deficiences in the rest of the team when it comes to desire and hard work - and ultimately it's the manager who needs to instill that in the team...

 

[ultimateloner]

Well said Steve...agree most with the statement

But off the ball is where a manager really earns his mone

very true.

 

[jonathanhotspur]

Top post, steve. Always a pleasure to read your thoughts.