The sliding doors moment

[fecka]

IIRC, I think we had ITK about ETH not interviewing well and showing a lack of charisma during talks with Levy, so we went for Gattuso and then Nuno after the fans showed disdain for the appointment of the former.
Hindsight and all that, but that is fairly damning when looking at it now.

 

[wspur]

IIRC, I think we had ITK about ETH not interviewing well and showing a lack of charisma during talks with Levy, so we went for Gattuso and then Nuno after the fans showed disdain for the appointment of the former.
Hindsight and all that, but that is fairly damning when looking at it now.

Regarding ETH it's just been a few months and despite their results they are not that impressive. We were also blowing everyone away last season under Conte and look where we are now.

 

[Japhet]

I'd say Summer 2017 made Poch dig his heels in thereafter, refusing anything but the best (which he never got). Levy had been getting away with him over-achieving and thought he could just carry on doing the same. I think that's when Poch started losing faith and the rot set in from then on.

After that, hiring Mourinho who told Levy what he wanted to hear as in 'I'm OK with the players we already have'. That got him 15m per year but was a continuation of the last months of Poch with turgid football, and we've not got away from that since.

 

[fecka]

Regarding ETH it's just been a few months and despite their results they are not that impressive. We were also blowing everyone away last season under Conte and look where we are now.

Early days for sure, but I think United's results have been very impressive since ETH got rid of Ronaldo. For me, it has felt similar to when Poch decided to get rid of Kaboul, Adebayor, Capoue, etc., and focus on Kane, Mason, Bentaleb, and the younglings instead.
Anyways, my point was more focused on charisma being so important and therefore ending up with Gattuso and Nuno as alternatives, both being wildly different with their football compared to ETH, and neither having lit up the footballing world in any capacity before or since.

 

[EssexSH27]

Three at the end of Pochs reign

Auriers toe offside and instead going 2-0 up lose 2-1 at Leicester

Wild long range shot from Guendouzi goes in at Emirates to make it 2-2

Son going round Allison and hitting the bar and instead going 2-1 up at Anfield we lose.

That silly ‘never win away this year’ label goes away and maybe cheers old Poch up out of his funk if any of those turn into wins. Then Levy doesn’t make the stupid mistake that’s set us back ever since.

 

[EssexSH27]

When I looked at the team sheet and saw Winks and Sissoko instead of Dembele and Wanyama

What’s with the revolutionary history on Sissoko in this place. He was player of the season that year.

 

[Stamford]

Dier hitting the post against Man Utd in the FA Cup semi final. Leaving the stadium that day i knew Poch would never win anything at Spurs.

 

[philll]

Poch saying "maybe this is our level" or some such after we got beaten by (iirc) Bournemouth.

 

[C1w8]

But dont you think there was a window where we could have cemented ourselves and stayed up there a little longer?

Also a trophy or 2 probably would have led to more

Not particularly no - our leadership has been the same throughout and their approach relatively consistent...at a time when building the stadium we didnt spend much. Even if we did, what we wouldve signed would be very hit and miss to have made a difference seeing what we've done in the market since. We are relatively ok in terms of being cemented "up there" (that i consider being top 4). Sure it'd be better if it was a question of "not sure if we'll finish thiird or fourth", rather than fourth or fifth, but that's still pretty close to where i think our aspirations as a club lie, like those aspirations or not. We're about as cemented up there as anyone aside from the two horsies that tend to pull away for the title race, which seems to be way the league plays out these days albeit with interchanging competitors each year.

I suppose i dont consider anything that'd have kept us up a little higher for a little longer, as enough of difference from today to count as a sliding doors moment - that should be a monumental shift, like Newcastle getting their saudi take over money. Us staying two positions higher in the league for two or three years more is not that much more than we have right now. The football we've played and some of the results have been terrible but we're not down in 8th (yet!)...

 

[Gassin's finest]

The infamous 2018 without signing a single player.

 

[Flobadob]

Only 5 teams in the PL have conceded more goals than we have this season and we have 2 of the best defensive players in the league in Romero and Emerson. That really should tell anyone that pays attention how terrible the rest of our back line is. We need 3 top quality signings for our back 6 in the summer before we do ANYTHING else. I don’t give a shit if we sign a player in a different position, if we don’t get those 3 defensive signings the window is a failure, it’s as simple as that

 

[riggi]

Well this is fun.

 

[mil1lion]

What’s with the revolutionary history on Sissoko in this place. He was player of the season that year.

Nothing against Sissoko at all, he always gave his all. It's the drop off in quality from someone like Dembele or Wanyama and also a totally different type of player. That midfield was incredibly open compared to when we had Dembele and Wanyama/Dier which was a key part of our success under Poch. The cracks opened after Wanyama got injured and Dembele went.

Not Sissokos fault but still showed we had no long term plan for him given Sissoko was last minute dot com. That was the start of the pattern where we had no long term plan. When we sold Walker we at least had Trippier so I could see a reason for that. It was the time Wanyama was badly injured and we didn't replace him followed by no forward plan to succeed Dembele that it was clear.

 

[Timberwolf]

Nothing against Sissoko at all, he always gave his all. It's the drop off in quality from someone like Dembele or Wanyama and also a totally different type of player. That midfield was incredibly open compared to when we had Dembele and Wanyama/Dier which was a key part of our success under Poch. The cracks opened after Wanyama got injured and Dembele went.

Not Sissokos fault but still showed we had no long term plan for him given Sissoko was last minute dot com. That was the start of the pattern where we had no long term plan. When we sold Walker we at least had Trippier so I could see a reason for that. It was the time Wanyama was badly injured and we didn't replace him followed by no forward plan to succeed Dembele that it was clear.

I also think a huge part of the Sissoko redemption arc were low expectations. He was so abysmal for his first 2 years than when he started putting in good performances, they were elevated as people simply didn't think he was capable of it. Add in the fact he ran non-stop and worse his heart on his sleeve - two things fans always love - and he became a bit of a cult hero.

While there's no denying Sissoko had some great games during that period and redeemed himself in the eyes of the fan-base, he still couldn't pass, was limited defensively and was a massive step down from both Dembele and peak Wanyama.

 

[TheChosenOne]

Many great replies here lads, looks like instead of a football dynasty we got to die nasty as a team.
Sad indictment of a footballing decade that promised so much.

 

[Rosco1984]

All of our problems started with Mourinho. He was pure poison for everything good we had built. Poch needed a break after the Champs League Final clearly but we should have continued with a front foot positive replacement not a confidence killing bus parker and its been one boring defensive minded defeatist attitude after another ever since. We were good because we took the game to whoever we played and we have been largely dogshit since we stopped doing that.

 

[Timberwolf]

All of our problems started with Mourinho. He was pure poison for everything good we had built. Poch needed a break after the Champs League Final clearly but we should have continued with a front foot positive replacement not a confidence killing bus parker and its been one boring defensive minded defeatist attitude after another ever since. We were good because we took the game to whoever we played and we have been largely dogshit since we stopped doing that.

Yeah that might be the biggest mistake of them all.

Maybe they were doomed from the start, but I think a more progressive manager might've got a lot more out of Ndombele and Lo Celso too. Neither of them were a great fit for Jose and we could've really done with getting some value out of that 100m investment...especially given the holes elsewhere in the squad.

 

[dontcallme]

Arnesen leaving for me. Once Levy saw Hoddle wasn’t working it became clear the manager wasn’t the problem.

We went most of a season with a caretaker then a DOF was brought in to run the football side of things.

He gutted out the club from top to bottom. He spoke about how we should create a formation and every level of the club should play the same to allow easier integration from the youth levels to the first team.

We bought talented youngsters as well as experienced pros like Davids and Naybet.

Then he decided the job was too big and went to Chelsea.

Since then we’ve gone though Comolli, Redknapp, Baldini, etc and lost any continuity.

 

[mpickard2087]

Anyway, how would you feel about a Poch reunion? Do you think it could still work?

Im skeptical because today, most coaches operate with high intensity pressing and Im not sure Poch is wily enough to adapt

Generally not a fan of trying to repeat history and looking back. If it did happen though then it should be when no player is here that Poch managed before (I fear he'd be too sentimental and ultimately weak with them - he was before after all). If he was back then I'd want full on PochBall no compromises, and how will you get high energy high press from, in particular, the likes of Son and Kane?

 

[adamsky]

There wasn’t one sliding doors moment for us. Every club can have a bad window but we had around 6 bad windows in a row, compounding each one. I don’t think we made a good signing since moving to Wembley until Romero came in. It is actually a miracle we have done as well as we have and that is largely down to Kane & Son.