Tottenham Takeover Talk

[Westmorlandspur]

I don’t think it’s that uncommon for an owner to sell a business and stay on in some capacity e.g as a non executive director or consultant. Obviously it depends on buyers, but sometimes it can be seen as a valuable continuity arrangement.

Chelsea would have benefited from leaving Graniskowa and Czech in place for 12 months. At least they knew what they were doing.
If we ever do sell, almost certainly will be American what with the NFL stuff.

 

[superted4]

So Man Utd sold 25% to Radcliffe for £1.25b valuing the club at £5B including £600m of dead debt (as in nothing to show for that money)

so how much would spurs be worth with £800m debt but an money making infrastructure. You’re probably taking £3.5b. So would you sell 25% of the club to clear that £800m stadium debt and clear the monthly/annual payments?

I think I would, Daniel might think differently

 

[SpursSince1980]

H88 didn’t get the memo that just cos we have two weeks off, that doesn’t constitute as an international break, therefore his timing is wrong for this this thread. Rookie mistake.

 

[SirHarryHotspur]

So Man Utd sold 25% to Radcliffe for £1.25b valuing the club at £5B including £600m of dead debt (as in nothing to show for that money)

so how much would spurs be worth with £800m debt but an money making infrastructure. You’re probably taking £3.5b. So would you sell 25% of the club to clear that £800m stadium debt and clear the monthly/annual payments?

I think I would, Daniel might think differently

Think your right there, Daniel would think differently, not sure how the money owed to Abramovich was dealt with but the reported sale of Chelsea was 4.25 billion pounds .
Daniel would point out that Spurs have already overtaken Chelsea in revenue and that future earnings potential is higher than Chelsea's with our state of the art stadium and vacant land with planning permission. Admittedly land in Tottenham is of lower value but when you see how some parts of London have rocketed in value e.g Hackney, Hoxton etc who knows what the future will hold.
With construction costs climbing any club thinking of building a brand new stadium to bring in more revenue like Chelsea are going to find the costs might be escalating beyond even the richest pockets.

 

[Led's Zeppelin]

So Man Utd sold 25% to Radcliffe for £1.25b valuing the club at £5B including £600m of dead debt (as in nothing to show for that money)

so how much would spurs be worth with £800m debt but an money making infrastructure. You’re probably taking £3.5b. So would you sell 25% of the club to clear that £800m stadium debt and clear the monthly/annual payments?

I think I would, Daniel might think differently

I wouldn't.

Why would you?

Levy will be thinking the value of the debt is far greater than its cost. In other words repaying it (in effect) would mean sacrificing the investment opportunity. He believes he can make more money than secured lenders can, and his track record shows he's almost certainly right.

So repaying the debt early certainly won't be attractive, and even less so if it means sacrificing say 25% of the equity in THFC.

But that won't matter in the end. What will matter, in my opinion, is whether someone will offer more than Levy believes he can make in charge of THFC. And that is the difficult part because he probably believes he knows better than anyone how to get the maximum value out of the club. And that is going to be a tough argument for anyone to have in support of a bid.

They'll have to offer more than he thinks it's worth, and he thinks that in his hands it's worth A FUCK OF A LOT.

 

[Hotspur88]

So Man Utd sold 25% to Radcliffe for £1.25b valuing the club at £5B including £600m of dead debt (as in nothing to show for that money)

so how much would spurs be worth with £800m debt but an money making infrastructure. You’re probably taking £3.5b. So would you sell 25% of the club to clear that £800m stadium debt and clear the monthly/annual payments?

I think I would, Daniel might think differently

£4.5b

 

[ukdy]

So Man Utd sold 25% to Radcliffe for £1.25b valuing the club at £5B including £600m of dead debt (as in nothing to show for that money)

so how much would spurs be worth with £800m debt but an money making infrastructure. You’re probably taking £3.5b. So would you sell 25% of the club to clear that £800m stadium debt and clear the monthly/annual payments?

I think I would, Daniel might think differently

The Debt isn't in ENIC's name, it's in Tottenham's name. If ENIC sold 25% - that sale money goes into their accounts, and the associated trusts of the beneficiaries. The club still has stadium debt. But the interest payable on the bond is so low, they'll likely not touch it.

If Spurs are making £549m revenue a year (2023) then you're buying a quarter of that, after tax!

 

[muppetman]

We are entering a period where the game is being more strictly regulated in terms of what teams can and can't spend, based on their profitability.

I wish I was as confident about this as you seem to be.

If Chelsea/Manu/ManC etc can't keep bringing in expensive, exciting players then I can see the PL seeing that as damaging to their brand and finding ways round it.

We shall see, I hope you're right, but will wait a bit longer before I get the bunting out.

 

[MR_BEN]

So Man Utd sold 25% to Radcliffe for £1.25b valuing the club at £5B including £600m of dead debt (as in nothing to show for that money)

so how much would spurs be worth with £800m debt but an money making infrastructure. You’re probably taking £3.5b. So would you sell 25% of the club to clear that £800m stadium debt and clear the monthly/annual payments?

I think I would, Daniel might think differently

Selling 25% of the club wouldn’t directly provide any funds to clear the stadium costs.

The money from the sale goes to ENIC, not the club.

 

[SpursSince1980]

£4.5b

Which is pittance compared to some US sport franchises. Over 15 years ago Ballmer bought the LA Clippers for 2bn. And that was when they were perenially dog shit. They’re now worth twice what he invested. That’s crazy. The effing LA Clippers valued at nearly as much as we are valued.

That‘s why more US investors are expressing interest, as they see massive financial upside in clubs who have a strong international presence.

Teams with the highest value ww include>
DALLAS COWBOYS (NFL) at $9bn
NEW YORK YANKEES (MLB) at $7.2bn
GOLDEN STATE WARRIORS (NBA) at $7bn

On the Forbes list, the first football team to appear is in 11th place (Real Madrid at over 6bn). Man U and Liverpool are also in the top twenty, both valued between 5 to 6bn.

If anything, a lot of the European giants are a little undervalued. So, you can understand their growing interest.

I’d not be surprised if there was an investment group looking at us that owns an NFL franchise. Just makes so much sense. Even more so if we pip Chelsea to the Jumpman brand.

Whether Levy is interested or not is irrelevant, if it is the Lewis family selling their portion of ENIC.

 

[rossdapep]

It's a 'thing' now.

I went to buy a brand new car and the dealership said fine, I could buy it, as long as only they drove it about

Bought a house a few weeks back and when I got the keys, I walked in to find the previous owner having a shit in the shower.

Told me he is just 'glossing things over' until we get comfortable there..

 

[mill]

Bought a house a few weeks back and when I got the keys, I walked in to find the previous owner having a shit in the shower.

Told me he is just 'glossing things over' until we get comfortable there..

Yeah sorry about that, at least I stuck some bleach down it after

 

[rossdapep]

Yeah sorry about that, at least I stuck some bleach down it afafter

A bit of bleach!

The contract stated the whole bathroom would require refurbishment if that happened!

 

[CantSmileWithoutYou]

Which is pittance compared to some US sport franchises. Over 15 years ago Ballmer bought the LA Clippers for 2bn. And that was when they were perenially dog shit. They’re now worth twice what he invested. That’s crazy. The effing LA Clippers valued at nearly as much as we are valued.

That‘s why more US investors are expressing interest, as they see massive financial upside in clubs who have a strong international presence.

Teams with the highest value ww include>
DALLAS COWBOYS (NFL) at $9bn
NEW YORK YANKEES (MLB) at $7.2bn
GOLDEN STATE WARRIORS (NBA) at $7bn

On the Forbes list, the first football team to appear is in 11th place (Real Madrid at over 6bn). Man U and Liverpool are also in the top twenty, both valued between 5 to 6bn.

If anything, a lot of the European giants are a little undervalued. So, you can understand their growing interest.

I’d not be surprised if there was an investment group looking at us that owns an NFL franchise. Just makes so much sense. Even more so if we pip Chelsea to the Jumpman brand.

Whether Levy is interested or not is irrelevant, if it is the Lewis family selling their portion of ENIC.

So that's doubling the purchase price...

23 years ago ENIC bought spurs for £120m we were perennially dogshit. Now there investment is worth 30 times their initial investment. Hardly pittance in returns is it, compared to your Clippers example ...

 

[Led's Zeppelin]

Which is pittance compared to some US sport franchises. Over 15 years ago Ballmer bought the LA Clippers for 2bn. And that was when they were perenially dog shit. They’re now worth twice what he invested. That’s crazy. The effing LA Clippers valued at nearly as much as we are valued.

That‘s why more US investors are expressing interest, as they see massive financial upside in clubs who have a strong international presence.

Teams with the highest value ww include>
DALLAS COWBOYS (NFL) at $9bn
NEW YORK YANKEES (MLB) at $7.2bn
GOLDEN STATE WARRIORS (NBA) at $7bn

On the Forbes list, the first football team to appear is in 11th place (Real Madrid at over 6bn). Man U and Liverpool are also in the top twenty, both valued between 5 to 6bn.

If anything, a lot of the European giants are a little undervalued. So, you can understand their growing interest.

I’d not be surprised if there was an investment group looking at us that owns an NFL franchise. Just makes so much sense. Even more so if we pip Chelsea to the Jumpman brand.

Whether Levy is interested or not is irrelevant, if it is the Lewis family selling their portion of ENIC.

They have trusted Levy to run the business for a couple of decades and its increased its value more than they could ever have dreamed was possible. It’s not all his doing but the family knows that an awful lot of it is.

His valuation will carry more weight than anyone’s in their minds. And like most billionaires, they will be very reluctant to sell their major asset for less than its maximum value.

And if Levy is unhappy with the deal, whether he stays or has to be replaced , his views will be very influential indeed. I think you can be confident of that.

He could of course do a complicated deal whereby he increases his share at a reduced price. All sorts of options are possible. But I don’t think you can assume that the majority shareholders can simply ignore him. There’re not complete fools.

And his shareholding is similar to Jim Ratcliffe’s in Man Utd. And look at the influence that can buy. Levy’s no mug. The value of his stake won’t be exposed in that way to the whims of the family. It doesn’t work that way.

 

[Finchyid]

£4.5b

Sounds about right to me..I would say £5bn would be a start number for levy

 

[SpursSince1980]

So that's doubling the purchase price...

23 years ago ENIC bought spurs for £120m we were perennially dogshit. Now there investment is worth 30 times their initial investment. Hardly pittance in returns is it, compared to your Clippers example ...

You misread what I wrote. I was saying by today’s market standard 4.5bn is a pittance compared to other large sports franchises. Clippers is an example of how costs have doubled in just 10 years. So, if anyone offered 4.5bn, if anything we are being undervalued.

And definitely not “my Clippers”. Can’t stand them!

 

[ukdy]

They have trusted Levy to run the business for a couple of decades and its increased its value more than they could ever have dreamed was possible. It’s not all his doing but the family knows that an awful lot of it is.

His valuation will carry more weight than anyone’s in their minds. And like most billionaires, they will be very reluctant to sell their major asset for less than its maximum value.

And if Levy is unhappy with the deal, whether he stays or has to be replaced , his views will be very influential indeed. I think you can be confident of that.

He could of course do a complicated deal whereby he increases his share at a reduced price. All sorts of options are possible. But I don’t think you can assume that the majority shareholders can simply ignore him. There’re not complete fools.

And his shareholding is similar to Jim Ratcliffe’s in Man Utd. And look at the influence that can buy. Levy’s no mug. The value of his stake won’t be exposed in that way to the whims of the family. It doesn’t work that way.

"They have"... no choice, Levy is one of the bloody owners!!

ENIC own 86.5% of Spurs.
Daniel Levy's family trust own 29.88% of ENIC
Joe Lewis' family own 71.12% of ENIC.

If ENIC sell 25% of their stake.. it could come from DL's family trust share, or JL's family trust share. Potentially with the Lewis family trust still being the majority shareholder. The status quo stays the same.

SOURCE

 

[SpursJord]

"They have"... no choice, Levy is one of the bloody owners!!

ENIC own 86.5% of Spurs.
Daniel Levy's family trust own 29.88% of ENIC
Joe Lewis' family own 71.12% of ENIC.

If ENIC sell 25% of their stake.. it could come from DL's family trust share, or JL's family trust share. Potentially with the Lewis family trust still being the majority shareholder. The status quo stays the same.

SOURCE

Wouldn't the 25% stake just come from ENICs overall share?

They currently own 86.58% so if they sell they 25% ENIC would end up with 61.58%. I don't imagine that it would have much more effect than that.

The only thing Joe Lewis/Daniel Levys separate shares in ENIC would likely affect is the amount each party would receive from the deal.

This would surely be the case wouldn't it with a minority sale?

 

[ukdy]

Im sure both scenarios are possible. The ownership percentages of THFC by ENIC stay the same. Or one party could reduce their share.

Person 1 wants to buy 25%

They don't care who agrees to sell their shares. DL, JL, or both to meet the 25%