Player Watch Player Watch: Micky van de Ven

matty74 · Jul 9, 2023

worcestersauce said:
The only way we couldn't afford Van de Ven is if we've pulled the trigger on the Tapsoba deal, otherwise it is suggesting we couldn't afford either of them and no way that's true.
Personally I'm disinclined to pay it much attention to it.

We need to sell players that’s the reason why !! All these players coming back lo celso ndomble reguilon rodan spence . Plus all the dross we need to get rid of already here . Sanchez tanganga dier Sessengon pericic probably Hojberg too.

the squad is over inflated with garbage we can’t go out and buy players until we trim the wage bill . This to me is obvious.

fishhhandaricecake · Jul 9, 2023

JUSTINSIGNAL said:
It really isn’t. Our ‘busy periods’ will only be a few mid week league cup matches around Xmas time. Rest of the time it will be one match a week, maybe two during a few midweek prem fixtures.

If the club have fully scouted Tosin and feel he can do a job as a third choice backup I really don’t see what the issue is.

Future plan for beyond this season perhaps… Tapsoba and VDV are both younger and better than Tosin…

I like Tosin but if we have aspirations to build something again then I’d rather we sign both of these guys.

Tucker · Jul 9, 2023

Fuck me. It’s bad enough when people post Spurs aggregators. Now people are posting Wolfsburg ones?

Dear me.

JUSTINSIGNAL · Jul 9, 2023

fishhhandaricecake said:
Future plan for beyond this season perhaps… Tapsoba and VDV are both younger and better than Tosin…

I like Tosin but if we have aspirations to build something again then I’d rather we sign both of these guys.

VDV (who is likely the one who will be backup) isn’t developing much sitting on the bench. That is the point. We just won’t have the amount of games to go around. Better to have solid back up than frustrate and ruin a players development at the promise that he might get some games if Tapsoba or Romero get injured/suspended.

I’ll leave it there though. I’m repeating myself and we’re not gonna agree.

worcestersauce · Jul 9, 2023

matty74 said:
We need to sell players that’s the reason why !! All these players coming back lo celso ndomble reguilon rodan spence . Plus all the dross we need to get rid of already here . Sanchez tanganga dier Sessengon pericic probably Hojberg too.

the squad is over inflated with garbage we can’t go out and buy players until we trim the wage bill . This to me is obvious.

No, that might be a reason we don't buy one or other of them but it wouldn't be a reason we don't buy either of them.

DenverSpur · Jul 9, 2023

JUSTINSIGNAL said:
We had regular European football then. We don’t have that this season.

The reason VDV has developed to this level is through regular football. If we buy him and Tapsoba, and Tapsoba is first choice VDV could end up playing around less than 12 matches in the whole season. He won’t be happy with that. And it won’t be any good for his development as when he plays cup matches in a cobbled together team of youth players and fringe players he will be lacking rhythm and unable to show his best.

We are going to be playing ONE match per week most weeks. There won’t be any real need to rotate the team. Especially at CB where it is essential that the team is settled and partnerships are formed.

It just makes much more sense to bring in a third choice CB that is willing to sit in the bench as they are at a different stage in their development - such as Tosin or Lenglet. There is no guarantee that Romero will miss a big amount of matches next season. Playing under a new manager with a different focus there might be less chance of injury or suspension. I just don’t seeing it being good for squad dynamics making a hugely talented defender sit in the bench for most of the season on ‘what if’ to cover situations that might never happen.

This sort of thinking is why we never win anything. We should not be putting out a “cobbled together team of youth players and fringe players” in cup games. We should want to win the competition and therefore be putting out as strong a lineup as possible. Really hate this mindset.

JUSTINSIGNAL · Jul 9, 2023

DenverSpur said:
This sort of thinking is why we never win anything. We should not be putting out a “cobbled together team of youth players and fringe players” in cup games. We should want to win the competition and therefore be putting out as strong a lineup as possible. Really hate this mindset.

Looooool

I agree. But then when do you rotate players? because every prem match is just as important as any cup match. Playing your ‘strongest 11’ even for early round cup matches just leads to rustiness and disillusionment among the squad players which ultimately causes problems with squad harmony. A manager wants everyone to feel included and pulling in the same direction, if players aren’t being given chances, even in early cup matches that’s just gonna cause him problems.

Nick-TopSpursMan · Jul 9, 2023

Absolutely no reason we can’t sign him AND Tapsoba.

To those saying he wouldn’t get enough game time, I’d counter that he will get plenty.

In the past 2 seasons, Romero has played 26 and 21 league games as starts respectively. That means it’s quite reasonable to suggest he will miss around at least 10 league games this season through a mix of injuries and suspension. That is 10 league starts for Van de Ven right there.

Tapsoba will play in the African Cup of Nations in Jan-Feb. He will likely miss at least 4 league games when you consider travel and rest required after. That’s another 4 league starts for Van de Ven. This doesn’t factor in any potential injury Tapsoba may suffer which would also potentially give VdV more game time.

Now factor in VdV can and has also played LB. He could easily share games with Destiny in this role. That could give him another 12 league games let’s say.

That would be a total of 26 league starts (just over 2 thirds of a season), before considering potential domestic cup appearances.

There are ALWAYS injuries and suspensions. He will get plenty of game time.

fishhhandaricecake · Jul 9, 2023

JUSTINSIGNAL said:
VDV (who is likely the one who will be backup) isn’t developing much sitting on the bench. That is the point. We just won’t have the amount of games to go around. Better to have solid back up than frustrate and ruin a players development at the promise that he might get some games if Tapsoba or Romero get injured/suspended.

I’ll leave it there though. I’m repeating myself and we’re not gonna agree.

Yea but Romero gets injuries and suspensions, I cannot see him playing 38 games and Tapsoba could also get injured, also VDV can play LB and would suit the inverted LB in ange’s system.

I see where you’re coming from but they’re both great talents and so I just think if they’re both available and willing to come let’s get both done.

fishhhandaricecake · Jul 9, 2023

Nick-TopSpursMan said:
Absolutely no reason we can’t sign him AND Tapsoba.

To those saying he wouldn’t get enough game time, I’d counter that he will get plenty.

In the past 2 seasons, Romero has played 26 and 21 league games as starts respectively. That means it’s quite reasonable to suggest he will miss around at least 10 league games this season through a mix of injuries and suspension. That is 10 league starts for Van de Ven right there.

Tapsoba will play in the African Cup of Nations in Jan-Feb. He will likely miss at least 4 league games when you consider travel and rest required after. That’s another 4 league starts for Van de Ven. This doesn’t factor in any potential injury Tapsoba may suffer which would also potentially give VdV more game time.

Now factor in VdV can and has also played LB. He could easily share games with Destiny in this role. That could give him another 12 league games let’s say.

That would be a total of 26 league starts (just over 2 thirds of a season), before considering potential domestic cup appearances.

There are ALWAYS injuries and suspensions. He will get plenty of game time.

Exactly

this. @JUSTINSIGNAL fyi.

felmani26 · Jul 9, 2023

Nick-TopSpursMan said:
Absolutely no reason we can’t sign him AND Tapsoba.

To those saying he wouldn’t get enough game time, I’d counter that he will get plenty.

In the past 2 seasons, Romero has played 26 and 21 league games as starts respectively. That means it’s quite reasonable to suggest he will miss around at least 10 league games this season through a mix of injuries and suspension. That is 10 league starts for Van de Ven right there.

Tapsoba will play in the African Cup of Nations in Jan-Feb. He will likely miss at least 4 league games when you consider travel and rest required after. That’s another 4 league starts for Van de Ven. This doesn’t factor in any potential injury Tapsoba may suffer which would also potentially give VdV more game time.

Now factor in VdV can and has also played LB. He could easily share games with Destiny in this role. That could give him another 12 league games let’s say.

That would be a total of 26 league starts (just over 2 thirds of a season), before considering potential domestic cup appearances.

There are ALWAYS injuries and suspensions. He will get plenty of game time.

Wholeheartedly agree.

Some short term thinking by some with tunnel vision to this sole campaign and not the bigger picture in which we seek a swift return to European football and to nurture talent which we think long term will propel us to being competitive for silverware again.

Tapsoba looks a prime candidate that if we don't pull the trigger this summer he will be out of our reach (financially and quite possibly coveted by bigger fish) much like Gvardiol and with van de Ven as a rotation option and able understudy, it would provide solid foundations for years to come.

This is the summer to not do things by halves and to retain the core of that defence erring on the side of fiscal caution will once again be our downfall.

fishhhandaricecake · Jul 9, 2023

felmani26 said:
Wholeheartedly agree.

Some short term thinking by some with tunnel vision to this sole campaign and not the bigger picture in which we seek a swift return to European football and to nurture talent which we think long term will propel us to being competitive for silverware again.

Tapsoba looks a prime candidate that if we don't pull the trigger this summer he will be out of our reach (financially and quite possibly coveted by bigger fish) much like Gvardiol and with van de Ven as a rotation option and able understudy, it would provide solid foundations for years to come.

This is the summer to not do things by halves and to retain the core of that defence erring on the side of fiscal caution will once again be our downfall.

1,000,000% this.

We have to make a statement this summer and rebuild strong as you say not make half measures otherwise we will just fall further behind.

fishhhandaricecake · Jul 9, 2023

I know some of our fans don’t like to compare to Arsenal but sorry, if they can spend £180mil on Rice and Havertz and be targeting Cancelo etc then we sure as hell should be pulling the trigger on say a £70m total (£40m and £30m for Tapsoba and VDV) given our defence is absolutely our weakest area and outside of Romero who is a bit injury and suspension prone, we have pretty much no other CB’s of quality.

JUSTINSIGNAL · Jul 9, 2023

felmani26 said:
Wholeheartedly agree.

Some short term thinking by some with tunnel vision to this sole campaign and not the bigger picture in which we seek a swift return to European football and to nurture talent which we think long term will propel us to being competitive for silverware again.

Tapsoba looks a prime candidate that if we don't pull the trigger this summer he will be out of our reach (financially and quite possibly coveted by bigger fish) much like Gvardiol and with van de Ven as a rotation option and able understudy, it would provide solid foundations for years to come.

This is the summer to not do things by halves and to retain the core of that defence erring on the side of fiscal caution will once again be our downfall.

No short term thinking. Just considering squad harmony and the fact as many years that I’ve heard the argument that we need X amount of quality cover for certain positions, ‘just in case’, it never works out that way. Players get frustrated (see Richarlison last season) as a manager under pressure to win every match will likely play a settled 11 most weeks, especially in the centre of defence.

VDV isn’t gonna accept leaving a team where he is a guaranteed starter for a decent bundesliga side, to come and be a bench option for us, potentially stunting his development. He could stay where he is, develop further and get a move to an elite club next summer instead.

Yes we need a quality cover in the long term but Tosin has by all accounts been throughly scouted to potentially provide a back up option this season and we can upgrade further next summer when Dier leaves. Meaning we have Romero, Tapsoba or VDV, Tosin, and a high quality up and coming defender.

JUSTINSIGNAL · Jul 9, 2023

fishhhandaricecake said:
I know some of our fans don’t like to compare to Arsenal but sorry, if they can spend £180mil on Rice and Havertz and be targeting Cancelo etc then we sure as hell should be pulling the trigger on say a £70m total (£40m and £30m for Tapsoba and VDV) given our defence is absolutely our weakest area and outside of Romero who is a bit injury and suspension prone, we have pretty much no other CB’s of quality.

They are in the champions league mate. You arguably need two first elevens to compete in that and the prem effectively. And you have high level matches to offer around and keep the squad happy and harmonious.

Real_madyidd · Jul 9, 2023

JUSTINSIGNAL said:
They are in the champions league mate. You arguably need to first elevens to compete in that and the prem effectively. And you have high level matches to offer around and keep the squad happy and harmonious.

Yeah, just like we did. (Kidding)

Dazzazzad · Jul 9, 2023

coy-spurs1882 said:
impatient? we were told that the new stadium would be the gamechanger for us to compete at highest level so we endured so many transfer shitshows by Levy, and the management has been shambolic since Poch left

We were in the cl final, the highest of high levels, 2 months after the stadium opened. Boom!

Jokes aside, I believe it absolutely is a gamechanger. Previously we had to really nail a manager and squad to be up with the big boys. And we were vulnerable to the bubble bursting - in other words going the way of Leicester.

Now we have enough clout that even when we have a bad run we are able to reset and reinvest (and draw big managers) to get back in the chasing pack at least.

I don't think we'll be in the wilderness (out of Europe) for years at a time anymore and that's in large part due to the stadium.

And if we do win some honours it will no doubt be a big contributing factor.

longtimespur · Jul 9, 2023

Dazzazzad said:
We were in the cl final, the highest of high levels, 2 months after the stadium opened. Boom!

Jokes aside, I believe it absolutely is a gamechanger. Previously we had to really nail a manager and squad to be up with the big boys. And we were vulnerable to the bubble bursting - in other words going the way of Leicester.

Now we have enough clout that even when we have a bad run we are able to reset and reinvest (and draw big managers) to get back in the chasing pack at least.

I don't think we'll be in the wilderness (out of Europe) for years at a time anymore and that's in large part due to the stadium.

And if we do win some honours it will no doubt be a big contributing factor.

Agree re the stadium. To me that’s not the problem. The problem comes from the board because they don’t see the way forward is investing in the squad and that should be every window not just when they think it’s necessary.

mawspurs · Jul 9, 2023

I suspect any delay is due to us waiting to offload a player or two, we all know that the wage bill is Levy’s obsession, it’s not the paying for transfers it’s the running costs of wages he wants to limit.

kent brockman · Jul 9, 2023

JUSTINSIGNAL said:
No short term thinking. Just considering squad harmony and the fact as many years that I’ve heard the argument that we need X amount of quality cover for certain positions, ‘just in case’, it never works out that way. Players get frustrated (see Richarlison last season) as a manager under pressure to win every match will likely play a settled 11 most weeks, especially in the centre of defence.

VDV isn’t gonna accept leaving a team where he is a guaranteed starter for a decent bundesliga side, to come and be a bench option for us, potentially stunting his development. He could stay where he is, develop further and get a move to an elite club next summer instead.

Yes we need a quality cover in the long term but Tosin has by all accounts been throughly scouted to potentially provide a back up option this season and we can upgrade further next summer when Dier leaves. Meaning we have Romero, Tapsoba or VDV, Tosin, and a high quality up and coming defender.

Why would he be a bench option? I reckon he will be first choice at LB when everyone’s fit.

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