AVB or Bale?

[Mullers]

Yes, he had to manage the squad, like every other manager?

I dont really buy into the idea that we went through the season with a ravaged poor squad compared to last - our new signings have done well and Bale has come of age this season. I think AvB performed well but didnt excel particularly, and not in relation to his peers. Laudrup for instance won a cup, played some brilliant football and relatively speaking did a better job.

Im not knocking AvB I want him to stick around and try and build something but we finished where we did because of Bale not AvB. Therefore Bale is more important.

If we had won the cup playing brilliant football but finished below Everton and Liverpool, I think the media and most supporter would not think that was good enough.

 

[Kendall]

Seems like one or two are suggesting that if we didn't have Bale last season, we would have only played with 10 men. And to say that the late goals were lucky? When it happens 9 times in a season, it's not luck.

I voted for AVB though because the players obviously love him and if he were to leave now, I think some of them would be looking for a transfer before too long, including Bale. Plus, he's done a brilliant job even if some refuse to see it or give him credit.

Not at all, but the question says Bale or AVB.

If we didn't have AVB would we be playing without a manager? No.

You can only judge based on what the individuals did over the course of the season and I feel Bale was bale-ing AVB out a lot.

 

[Spurs_Bear]

If we had won the cup playing brilliant football but finished below Everton and Liverpool, I think the media and most supporter would not think that was good enough.

If we'd finished mid table the previous season I'm pretty sure they would have been fine with it.

 

[$hoguN]

AVB. Players come and go, even ones as talented as Bale. The one thing Spurs fans of any vintage or intelligence must surely understand by now is the importance of a good manager and stability. Shirley?

I'm not quite sure about that, players like Bale turn up once in a generation. The lad is constantly improving and within two years will probably unequivocally be mentioned alongside Ronaldo and Messi as one of the top 3 players in the World. When he leaves we may not see a player reaching such heights again for many years.

I'm glad we don't have to make this decision in real life tbh.

 

[Mullers]

If we'd finished mid table the previous season I'm pretty sure they would have been fine with it.

But we didn't, Laudrup has got far more wriggle room than AVB.

 

[Spurs_Bear]

But we didn't, Laudrup has got far more wriggle room than AVB.

Potentially, but don't forget Laudrup replaced one of the media darlings in Brent-an Rodgers too.

 

[JerryGarcia]

Not at all, but the question says Bale or AVB.

If we didn't have AVB would we be playing without a manager? No.

You can only judge based on what the individuals did over the course of the season and I feel Bale was bale-ing AVB out a lot.

What I meant was that people often say without Bale we'd have x number less goals without allowing for the fact that we would have a different player in that position or be playing a different formation all together.

You might think he bailed the manager out and you might be correct but my opinion is that we wore those teams down over the course of games and it was the first season where I always felt that a goal was going to come. Bale is obviously our most important player but I've always believed that stability is the most important factor in growing a club, even more so when you don't have £150m per season to buy a new team.

Lose AVB and we have to start all over again, lose Bale and although it would be bad, you don't have to go through all the bollocks of the players and manager getting to know each other and new tactics ect.

 

[CowInAComa]

If we had won the cup playing brilliant football but finished below Everton and Liverpool, I think the media and most supporter would not think that was good enough.

Thank Bale then that we didnt finish below them.

However if we finished 2 places higher than we did the previous season,won a cup and unearthed a Michu whilst playing brilliant football I think we would all agree that would be a job well done.

 

[Bulletspur]

Bale all day long.


Im a fan. I watch the players not the dugout.

Not even to see Steffan's jump when we score?

 

[talkshowhost86]

Thank Bale then that we didnt finish below them.

However if we finished 2 places higher than we did the previous season,won a cup and unearthed a Michu whilst playing brilliant football I think we would all agree that would be a job well done.

I think with the same squad and Harry in charge we'd have been much closer to Everton and Liverpool. That's not a dig at Harry as such, but more a recognition of how much AVB got out of a limited squad.

 

[Spurs_Bear]

I think with the same squad and Harry in charge we'd have been much closer to Everton and Liverpool. That's not a dig at Harry as such, but more a recognition of how much AVB got out of a limited squad.

But, the squad we finished 4th with in 09/10 was weaker than the one we had this year.

Palacios and Hudd for most of the year, everyone's favourite Crouch up front.

I think to even call anything to do with Redknapp into the equation is bonkers mate. Couldn't be more irrelevant.

 

[dagraham]

Blaming the team personnel and not the tactics for lack of creativity is sort of absolving AvB of blame though, why should the tactics not be under scrutiny should we be struggling to create chances?

The personnel are hardly pisspoor are they? We are talking about attacking players that would walk into most premier league sides, and so to look so toothless so often something must be going wrong. Other teams look more fluid with far lesser playing staff.

Agree with this. Our movement off the ball and slow tempo of play remained shocking throughout most of the season and that cannot be blamed entirely on the wrong personnel. Look at the difference the new Southampton manager made to the style of play and fluidity of attacking movement in only a matter of weeks.

 

[Misfit]

I'm not quite sure about that, players like Bale turn up once in a generation. The lad is constantly improving and within two years will probably unequivocally be mentioned alongside Ronaldo and Messi as one of the top 3 players in the World. When he leaves we may not see a player reaching such heights again for many years.

I'm glad we don't have to make this decision in real life tbh.

Indeed. I'd rather have a Bale-less squad with a good manager in charge than say, Bale in a squad managed by oh I dunno, Wendy though. I didn't go for AVB because he's the second coming but because he's the head coach/manager. A good one of those given time can achieve far more for a club than any one single player could ever hope to and that's not even a debate is it?

I take your point though. He's a bit spesh. I want the glorious bastard to stay here for as long as possible and am certainly not looking forward to the day when the club is faced with a choice.

 

[Grey Fox]

AVB, cos Bale could break his leg tomorrow or worse. AVB could still manage on crutches.

 

[CoopsieDeadpool]

Thank Bale then that we didnt finish below them.

However if we finished 2 places higher than we did the previous season,won a cup and unearthed a Michu whilst playing brilliant football I think we would all agree that would be a job well done.

Just as Van Persie can be thanked for United not finishing below us? Or Suarez can be thanked for Liverpoo not finishing below Villa? Or Benteke can be thanked for Aston Villa not finishing below QPR? Or how Messi can be thanked for Barcelona not finishing below Real Madrid? Or how Ronaldo can be thanked for Real Madrid not finishing outside of the CL places etc etc etc.

Mate, almost every club has that one player who scores the lions share of goals. I feel you're doing AVB a great disservice, personally.

 

[Spurs_Bear]

Just as Van Persie can be thanked for United not finishing below us? Or Suarez can be thanked for Liverpoo not finishing below Villa? Or Benteke can be thanked for Aston Villa not finishing below QPR? Or how Messi can be thanked for Barcelona not finishing below Real Madrid? Or how Ronaldo can be thanked for Real Madrid not finishing outside of the CL places etc etc etc.

Mate, almost every club has that one player who scores the lions share of goals. I feel you're doing AVB a great disservice, personally.

I agree with your Suarez point, and said so for the majority of the season, not really comparing apples with apples with the rest of them though.

 

[Misfit]

Just as Van Persie can be thanked for United not finishing below us? Or Suarez can be thanked for Liverpoo not finishing below Villa? Or Benteke can be thanked for Aston Villa not finishing below QPR? Or how Messi can be thanked for Barcelona not finishing below Real Madrid? Or how Ronaldo can be thanked for Real Madrid not finishing outside of the CL places etc etc etc.

Mate, almost every club has that one player who scores the lions share of goals. I feel you're doing AVB a great disservice, personally.

Yes. There's a reason top quality players, especially attackers, tend to be paid obscene amounts of money and have the footballing giants falling over themselves to sign them every window.

It's almost a reflex, as if some of us still feel guilty for having a bona fide worldy on our hands.

Those Bayern mugs. Celebrating their CL trophy. Without Robben and the likes they'd be nothing. NOTHING!

 

[CoopsieDeadpool]

I agree with your Suarez point, and said so for the majority of the season, not really comparing apples with apples with the rest of them though.

You're not of the opinion that the goals of the other players I mentioned were absolutely vital to where their teams finished at the end of the season? Which was the point CIAC was originally making bout Bale.

 

[Spurs_Bear]

You're not of the opinion that the goals of the other players I mentioned were absolutely vital to where their teams finished at the end of the season? Which was the point CIAC was originally making bout Bale.

Of course they were vital, but they weren't individual moments of brilliance (not all of them anyway), like the majority of Bale's were.

I think that's the point he was making, and I would add that yes, RV's goals were vital, but if he wasn't there they would have had Rooney or Chicharito in the same positions, they may have scored 80%. Nobody could have replicated what Bale did for us, I don't think we're commending it enough, the amount of free-kicks and 25-30 yarders was bordering on ridiculous.

 

[ShelfSide18]

Of course they were vital, but they weren't individual moments of brilliance (not all of them anyway), like the majority of Bale's were.

I think that's the point he was making, and I would add that yes, RV's goals were vital, but if he wasn't there they would have had Rooney or Chicharito in the same positions, they may have scored 80%. Nobody could have replicated what Bale did for us, I don't think we're commending it enough, the amount of free-kicks and 25-30 yarders was bordering on ridiculous.

I agree with you that it's entirely unlikely we will ever see a season of individual brilliance like Bale gave us again, he essentially compensated for us losing Rafa and Modric with the way his performances went off the scale.

The key question for me about AVB is this, would we have have amassed 72 points if Redknapp had that squad plus uber-Bale? Not a chance.