Defending corners - a question

[JollyHappy]

This is not another blame thread.

Well before the Villa and Reading games it was obvious that we are crap at defending corners and if you remember, Jol said earlier in the season something along the lines that he sh*tted himself everytime the other side got a corner.

Also heard Poyet saying on Sky that things have to change, and when asked if that meant new players, he siad it was changes in the existing personell as well.

Ok so the question is how do you defend corners and set pieces properly. I'm just a fan, not a football expert and we also know even the best sides give goals away from corners and similar set pieces (look at Man U against the Spammers).

I'd be really interested for some constructive ideas and comments about a team go about properly defending. For example, how do you cope with someone like Lausen who setps back, forward then curves a run and if the corner is delivered well to the space where is is running into then how do you stop him. (I know putting O Hara on him was crazy) but what should a coach do?


Let's keep this thread away from the normal "Robbo/Daws/Kaboul" are crap as they are all premiership class players that should be able to defend.

Hope to read some constructive answers!

 

[There's always next year]

This is not another blame thread.

Well before the Villa and Reading games it was obvious that we are crap at defending corners and if you remember, Jol said earlier in the season something along the lines that he sh*tted himself everytime the other side got a corner.

Also heard Poyet saying on Sky that things have to change, and when asked if that meant new players, he siad it was changes in the existing personell as well.

Ok so the question is how do you defend corners and set pieces properly. I'm just a fan, not a football expert and we also know even the best sides give goals away from corners and similar set pieces (look at Man U against the Spammers).

I'd be really interested for some constructive ideas and comments about a team go about properly defending. For example, how do you cope with someone like Lausen who setps back, forward then curves a run and if the corner is delivered well to the space where is is running into then how do you stop him. (I know putting O Hara on him was crazy) but what should a coach do?


Let's keep this thread away from the normal "Robbo/Daws/Kaboul" are crap as they are all premiership class players that should be able to defend.

Hope to read some constructive answers!

One common denomenator with the last two or three years of giving goals away from corners = Robinson

 

[whatsappnin]

you dont need to be an expert to have seen that Melberg mugged Dawson right off tonight, out smarted him.....easily. Poor Jamie been expected to mark Laursen at the corner.

I think Berbatov wants to stay now, cos playing like that he'd be lucky if southend wanted him!

 

[dj2gee]

One common denomenator with the last two or three years of giving goals away from corners = Robinson

thats constructive... robbo is the best keeper we've had in a long time.

 

[Mullers]

We had trouble defending set pieces under Ossie's management too. He went out and bought six foot four Kevin Scott from swindon, he was awful and we still conceded from set pieces.

 

[Black]

Robbo can not mark players in the box we have small guys marking big men why ?

 

[clarryboy]

One common denomenator with the last two or three years of giving goals away from corners = Robinson

Can't disagree there.

As a defender I'd imagine you want your keeper to come and take everything out, ball and men. I wouldn't even mind him knocking me out into the middle of next week as long as it meant the ball was cleared.

I could go on a Robbo rant now but as the threadstarter has stated we shouldn't be singling an individual out, my contribution is that I feel we defend too deep from set pieces. If the opposition get any contact on the ball then basically we're at their mercy and just have to hope for a poor contact or it goes off target.

 

[Juande_Ramos]

Best defensive system in the league for defensive set pices is Liverpool's zonal marking, but they have a lot of tall players who are not very quick to follow their man and suits them.
With zonal marking you put your best headers of the ball in the area where Villa scored today (the most dangerous) and players do not man mark anyone but cover just ma zone in the area. It needs a great deal of understanding between the defenders so that they know which ball to attack and which to leave for their teammates.

 

[spurs4europe]

i think one of the key points is the distinct lack of a leader within the team and especially the defence; someone who will yell at everyone and make sure everyone is organised and is doing what they should be doing, given their capabilities. O'Hara marking laursen is a prime example of how this is missing

 

[Legend10]

It's alarming how many times our defenders take the wrong body shape, I'm talking about they get themselves in a position whereby they can see the ball but not who they are marking or they can see tha player and not the ball.

Good defenders get themselves in a position where they can see both.

But for me I think our biggest problem is that we don't attack the ball well enough, Robbo should be catching or punching the ball at the highest point he can or defenders should be heading it at the highest point they can. Even if the attacking players have lost their markers there is no reason why defensively attack the ball at it's highest reachable point. An example of this was Villa's 1st goal today where although Daws made a complete balls of losing Mellberg KPB still had the chance to attack the ball and clear the danger.

You really need desire to defend set pieces properly and I would question wheter as a group of players we have it.

 

[There's always next year]

thats constructive... robbo is the best keeper we've had in a long time.

Since Ray Clemance, we've had Booby Mimms, Ian "The Grinner" Walker and Kasey " Lead Legs" Keller. I'm fucking better than these three, so you're comment about Robbo being the best keeper we've had for ages ain't difficult when benchmarked against these three toss pots

 

[nicdic]

For their first today Dawson was poor. Sure, try and play him offside, but stay goal side. Where Dawson positioned himself he couldn't see Mellberg. He should have been behing him so he could see him at all times. First rule of defending is getting goal side.

 

[yanno]

Best defensive system in the league for defensive set pices is Liverpool's zonal marking, but they have a lot of tall players who are not very quick to follow their man and suits them.
With zonal marking you put your best headers of the ball in the area where Villa scored today (the most dangerous) and players do not man mark anyone but cover just ma zone in the area. It needs a great deal of understanding between the defenders so that they know which ball to attack and which to leave for their teammates.

This is arguable.

Liverpool had tremendous difficulties when they first switched to zonal marking because English players are brought up to man mark from set pieces. Carragher et al were bitching like mad about it. Having said that, we don't have that many English defenders so it may not be quite so much of a learning curve....

My instincts are that if we were to switch to zonal marking, I think we might have to wait till next season, and spend the whole of pre-season getting the players used to it. However, given this lot seem totally incapable of manmarking......

 

[claw_diddy]

We simply haven't had a steady back four all season due to injuries to King, Dawson, Bale, if these 3 three and maybe Gardener had been fit we'd have been ok. I also think our midfield selection hasn't been that settled either. Zokora, Hudd, Jenas, Boetang, O'Hara have all had a go in the centre of midfield, none of them have convinced me they are capable of protecting and mopping up the back four like Carrick did.

It worries me that we are now in January and the defensive part of our team has yet to 'gel' this term.

 

[we8arse]

The Best Way To Defend A Corner Is Simple..........
When The White Round Ball Comes Near You Fuckin Hoooooooof The Bastard Away

 

[..Tee..]

Since Ray Clemance, we've had Booby Mimms, Ian "The Grinner" Walker and Kasey " Lead Legs" Keller. I'm fucking better than these three, so you're comment about Robbo being the best keeper we've had for ages ain't difficult when benchmarked against these three toss pots

Just waiting for Soccer Idol eh.

 

[clarryboy]

Best defensive system in the league for defensive set pices is Liverpool's zonal marking, but they have a lot of tall players who are not very quick to follow their man and suits them.
With zonal marking you put your best headers of the ball in the area where Villa scored today (the most dangerous) and players do not man mark anyone but cover just ma zone in the area. It needs a great deal of understanding between the defenders so that they know which ball to attack and which to leave for their teammates.

Trouble is, everytime a team defending zonally do concede from a set piece, studio "experts" will be saying space doesn't score goals, players do.

We definitely do need bigger players. I don't like to go all Harry Redknapp and see us build a team full of physical African players but it does concern me whenever we sign defenders who are slight in stature..BAE, Rocha, Gunter, maybe Emmanuelson too.

 

[BoringOldFan]

what should a coach do?

As we have recently employed the highest-paid coach in club football I was rather hoping he might have one or two good ideas about this.

 

[Juande_Ramos]

This is arguable.

Liverpool had tremendous difficulties when they first switched to zonal marking because English players are brought up to man mark from set pieces. Carragher et al were bitching like mad about it. Having said that, we don't have that many English defenders so it may not be quite so much of a learning curve....

My instincts are that if we were to switch to zonal marking, I think we might have to wait till next season, and spend the whole of pre-season getting the players used to it. However, given this lot seem totally incapable of manmarking......

Numbers support my case.
http://www.yappari.co.uk/archive/2006/09/13/lies-damned-lies-and-football-commentators/

Liverpool have conceaded from set pieces less goals than any other team in the league 2 years running. At the beginning it was a nightmare cause the players were used to man marking. Now it is almost impossible to head a ball in the Liverpool area, not to mention score from it, cause there is always a big fella challenging the attacker.
Liverpool zonal marking went under scrutiny because it was new in England (not exactly, but Sky pundits are anything but pundits) and it was not working.

 

[talkshowhost86]

As we have recently employed the highest-paid coach in club football I was rather hoping he might have one or two good ideas about this.

I criticised Jol for being at fault for our ridiculous defending of set pieces when he was in charge. Sadly it appears that these players are totally uncoachable. I feel what the coach will have to do is buy four new defenders.