Ex-Manager watch: Antonio Conte

[Timberwolf]

Well the Devine, White cohort is coming through so maybe that’s the first to show- Chelsea and City obvious pulling power until recently. Don’t know about Palace - have they got great kids?

Could be wrong but I imagine he's talking about the likes of Olise and Eze. Both very talented players that we could've signed, but not sure either of them would've got a look in under our recent managers so probably a wise career move for them to go to Palace.

 

[Yiddo100]

Could be wrong but I imagine he's talking about the likes of Olise and Eze. Both very talented players that we could've signed, but not sure either of them would've got a look in under our recent managers so probably a wise career move for them to go to Palace.

Also wouldn’t say they’re ‘youth’ players either. Young players but we’re very much established first team players before arrival

 

[Timberwolf]

Also wouldn’t say they’re ‘youth’ players either. Young players but we’re very much established first team players before arrival

I guess Eze was like 21/22 but Olise was, what, 19? Young/youth.

 

[rossdapep]

It’s not down to the identification of players, or suitable players recommended by the scouting teams and analysts. There is always a good list of players they recommend from up and coming players to first team ready.
FP, the manager and Board, then decide if they want to act on this info or go for the players that have been offered by agents or players the manager/FP want.
Trying to move on players is hard if they don’t want to leave, or don’t have better offers elsewhere.

I'm really glad you said this.

As a scout myself, it's a little irritating to see people say we have poor scouts.

Scouting players is only like 25% of the process. You need people in places to be telling you where to scout, what to scout for etc.

Then, if the scouts are indeed referring good players to the head scout, coach, DOF etc then it's out of their hands. The decision makers then take over and a player you felt was perfect for the role needed, is then cast aside for a player either you didn't recommend or wasnt your first selection.

I still, to this day, believe our scouts would have noted Ndombele's issues because quite frankly you shouldn't be a scout if you didn't, but Poch overrid it believing he could get a tune out of him. I mean we even have Poch's quotes on it, where you ca read between the lines.

But yeah, scouts aren't necessarily the problem here.

 

[jurgen11]

Easy to say, but he wins we have had great teams and the chance but not managed it

Tbf we needed a bit of investment

Great managers win trophies its to say it’s luck, or you could argue luck is half opportunity half preparation!

Out to mention our shite defence and goalie giving gifts makes really holds us back

Money wins trophies , google winners of premier League , fa cup and league cup

 

[wpd659]

I'm really glad you said this.

As a scout myself, it's a little irritating to see people say we have poor scouts.

Scouting players is only like 25% of the process. You need people in places to be telling you where to scout, what to scout for etc.

Then, if the scouts are indeed referring good players to the head scout, coach, DOF etc then it's out of their hands. The decision makers then take over and a player you felt was perfect for the role needed, is then cast aside for a player either you didn't recommend or wasnt your first selection.

I still, to this day, believe our scouts would have noted Ndombele's issues because quite frankly you shouldn't be a scout if you didn't, but Poch overrid it believing he could get a tune out of him. I mean we even have Poch's quotes on it, where you ca read between the lines.

But yeah, scouts aren't necessarily the problem here.

This is the situation and has been an issue in the past.
Ndombele was a Poch player he wanted but also had high praise from scouts and agent touting round to clubs. The issues he has in his game were thought would be coached and improved. But unfortunately it looks like other factors are stopping this.

Our scouts and analysts are excellant and do a brilliant job within their remit and scope. FP and the manager have their view and DL is very much on board with this. The only issue is when an agent comes direct to DL and offers a player we have been interested in previous for a great deal to be made. It’s a smart financial decision but not one that always pays on on the pitch. But FP is still very much involved in these deals too.

 

[Ghost Hardware]

This is the situation and has been an issue in the past.
Ndombele was a Poch player he wanted but also had high praise from scouts and agent touting round to clubs. The issues he has in his game were thought would be coached and improved. But unfortunately it looks like other factors are stopping this.

Our scouts and analysts are excellant and do a brilliant job within their remit and scope. FP and the manager have their view and DL is very much on board with this. The only issue is when an agent comes direct to DL and offers a player we have been interested in previous for a great deal to be made. It’s a smart financial decision but not one that always pays on on the pitch. But FP is still very much involved in these deals too.

I must say i'm still incredibly baffled by the Spence signing considering how far off the required level he seems to be, and also by a lesser extent the Danjuma one considering he's essentially 3rd choice in his best position. Re Spence, im all for buying prospects but surely our primary focus should be on brining in players we desperately need. Considering the amount of time we spent trying to get him done its a bit crazy to think that next season he will probably need to be sent back out on loan because i don't see him getting ahead of Royal or Porro any time soon. I get that its only recently that Royal started preforming but even so, just seems like a rather illogical deal considering Conte wasn't even a big fan supposedly.

 

[bubble07]

First half we were terrible. People are forgetting this because we won

 

[Trix]

Well the Devine, White cohort is coming through so maybe that’s the first to show- Chelsea and City obvious pulling power until recently. Don’t know about Palace - have they got great kids?

Yes.

 

[olithfc]

I must say i'm still incredibly baffled by the Spence signing considering how far off the required level he seems to be, and also by a lesser extent the Danjuma one considering he's essentially 3rd choice in his best position. Re Spence, im all for buying prospects but surely our primary focus should be on brining in players we desperately need. Considering the amount of time we spent trying to get him done its a bit crazy to think that next season he will probably need to be sent back out on loan because i don't see him getting ahead of Royal or Porro any time soon. I get that its only recently that Royal started preforming but even so, just seems like a rather illogical deal considering Conte wasn't even a big fan supposedly.

If he goes on loan at a prem club next season followin half a season in the french league and puts in reasonable performances we will probably be no worse off financially and may make a profit if we sold him (should they decide not to keep him). It's a smilar signing to Sarr, Gil, Udogie. It came at the wrong time maybe as we also needed a 1st team ready player at RWB but it doesn't seem an unreasonable prospect signing

 

[Trix]

Could be wrong but I imagine he's talking about the likes of Olise and Eze. Both very talented players that we could've signed, but not sure either of them would've got a look in under our recent managers so probably a wise career move for them to go to Palace.

Pretty sure he's talking about their academy right now which has some very good young players in most age groups, players wanted by bigger sides have gone there instead as they've heavily invested in their set up over the last few years.

 

[wrd]

I'm really glad you said this.

As a scout myself, it's a little irritating to see people say we have poor scouts.

Scouting players is only like 25% of the process. You need people in places to be telling you where to scout, what to scout for etc.

Then, if the scouts are indeed referring good players to the head scout, coach, DOF etc then it's out of their hands. The decision makers then take over and a player you felt was perfect for the role needed, is then cast aside for a player either you didn't recommend or wasnt your first selection.

I still, to this day, believe our scouts would have noted Ndombele's issues because quite frankly you shouldn't be a scout if you didn't, but Poch overrid it believing he could get a tune out of him. I mean we even have Poch's quotes on it, where you ca read between the lines.

But yeah, scouts aren't necessarily the problem here.

Yeah I certainly posted something which was an oversimplification, I didn't mean the individual scouts, I meant more the entire pipeline of our approach, so essentially what I should have said is; why are we not the best in the world at utilising scouting rather than why do we not have the best scouts.

 

[Duke of Northumberland]

Louder and even louder!!
The more youth football Ypy watch, you come to realise that making it to the top, is a huge slice of luck and a lot on who you know!

My nephew has played for a North London academy through his teens and been in and around trials with Barnet and Southend. Arsenal and Spurs are seen as the elite and never send scouts to their games, or make themselves known at least. The lower tier clubs seem to go for the most physically developed, biggest boys and they like the ones with confident/cocky personalities. You can see how someone like Harry Kane who comes across as more introspective got filtered out at Arsenal.

 

[Shanks]

My nephew has played for a North London academy through his teens and been in and around trials with Barnet and Southend. Arsenal and Spurs are seen as the elite and never send scouts to their games, or make themselves known at least. The lower tier clubs seem to go for the most physically developed, biggest boys and they like the ones with confident/cocky personalities. You can see how someone like Harry Kane who comes across as more introspective got filtered out at Arsenal.

Happens all the time, Chelsea shipped out declan rice at 14, my sons club released players at 14, who have now signed pro deals woth other clubs, but what I meant by other academies, city and Chelsea to name both, is purely down to financials as there’s actually less of a pathway to first team at those clubs
One of my lads mates, signed by city, 2 years later over to dortmund and now a regular starter at 18/19 , he’d never have gotten that chance at city

 

[chas vs dave]

Happens all the time, Chelsea shipped out declan rice at 14, my sons club released players at 14, who have now signed pro deals woth other clubs, but what I meant by other academies, city and Chelsea to name both, is purely down to financials as there’s actually less of a pathway to first team at those clubs
One of my lads mates, signed by city, 2 years later over to dortmund and now a regular starter at 18/19 , he’d never have gotten that chance at city

Is that Bynoe-Gittens? Supposed to be doing well over there.

 

[rossdapep]

Yeah I certainly posted something which was an oversimplification, I didn't mean the individual scouts, I meant more the entire pipeline of our approach, so essentially what I should have said is; why are we not the best in the world at utilising scouting rather than why do we not have the best scouts.

Apologies, mate.

I didn't actually see your original post so please don't take it as a reaction to yours.

It was actually more in response to the many 'get better scouts' posts we've had over the years and @wpd659
post resonated

 

[Shanks]

Is that Bynoe-Gittens? Supposed to be doing well over there.

Yes pal

 

[chas vs dave]

Yes pal

I looked at his bio on Wikipedia. I'd assume you are from the reading area then. Some good youngsters coming out from that area. A lot seem to be poached from reading youth.

 

[rossdapep]

Found a couple of reports from Conte's last year at Chelsea. Some concerns regarding fitness and the intensity of Conte's sessions but also why things went awry for him there.

Why Antonio Conte is 'unhappy' at Chelsea

The current Blues head coach admitted last month he does not want to “stay abroad for too long”

www.mirror.co.uk

Antonio Conte left hurt, angry and sad by Chelsea’s disastrous title defence

Antonio Conte said he has been deeply hurt by Chelsea’s disastrous title defence and admits a season fraught with difficulties has given him sleepless nights

www.theguardian.com

Chelsea Players Reportedly 'Unhappy' with Antonio Conte's Methods Amid Slump

Chelsea 's squad are reportedly " unhappy with the intensity" of manager Antonio Conte 's training methods and the fact it has not relented in 2017-18 despite a much busier schedule than last term...

bleacherreport.com

Basically, if Conte is gonna stay, we need a bigger squad but ONLY signings he wants. Chelsea lost all of Costa, Terry and Matic in one window and replaced with Morata, Rudiger and Bakayoko, then they started to get big injuries.

 

[ravo]

Apologies, mate.

I didn't actually see your original post so please don't take it as a reaction to yours.

It was actually more in response to the many 'get better scouts' posts we've had over the years and @wpd659
post resonated

Thanks for your interesting comments around the scouting networks - I've always been intrigued and it's great to hear expert insights. Out of interest, what are your thoughts on why Brighton (as an example) seem to be doing so well with recruitment at the moment? Is it as simple as the combination of the best structure (from scouts to the chairman/DOF) as you mentioned, mixed in with a bit of luck, or are there potentially other factors? Cheers.