Is Redknapp Tactically good Enough!

[Bus-Conductor]

Totally disagree with that statement. Huddlestone was nothing but consistent throughout all of last season (in the main, sure he has off days), something Jenas has not achieved in the 5 years he's been here. To lump them into together is a complete disservice to Huddlestone and the strides he has made in the last year or so. Palacios too was consistent until his decline started....Jenas has yet to prove anything over any sustained period of time...infact the 4 games or so he has played in this season are the best he's played - in terms of consecutive games for us.

What a ridiculous load of bollocks. Huddlestone and Jenas joined the club a month apart and every season Jenas has passed the ball more often, with more accuracy and more vision, has created more assists and scored more goals whilst tackling more. Huddlestone can't even manage two consistent halves let alone two games and you accuse me of bias ? Fucking laughable.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

So winning the CC under Wendy Random means fuck all, essentially?

It meant an awful lot because we played the same brand of good football to beat two of the best sides in europe, that we had played in the league prior to that to climb out of the mess that Jol had got us into.

 

[Spurger King]

:lol:

Sorry BC but that is disingenuous at best.

Jenas is massively inconsistent. I agree that he has the ability, and has shown it in more games than Huddlestone, but surely the elephant in the room here is the fact that Jenas is 4 years older than Hudd, and was brought as a player to be starting or competing for a starting place, whereas Hudd was a youth player we hoped to integrate gradually.

To mention the fact that they joined at roughly the same time only goes to support how consistently patchy Jenas has been, whilst Hudd has made steady improvements to his game.

Having said that, I'm glad to see Jenas getting another chance in the side. At the end of the 2008/09 season him and Palacios were starting to look pretty tasty in the middle together.

 

[scat1620]

This really should bring out a wry smile...Somehow the same reasoning is hardly ever applied to the start of the season under Ramos, and yet just read the words above and think back to what he had to work with then:

BAE was injured, so Bale, one of our best attacking options - and just back from long injury himself - had to play left back; King was not fit to play many games...sounds familiar?
Our holding midfielders were Jenas and O'Hara - hardly the most solid combination; Huddlestone was more or less in his first full season and needed time to settle in; Modric been in the country about a month; Bentley...let's not even go there; Lennon was just finding his form after long injury...sounds even more familiar perhaps?

Our TWO main strikers and top goalscorers both departed and we were left with nervous Bent and the Man U youth reserve, who both did a good impression of invisible men most of the time...the bell is ringing louder, except Ramos did not have ANY OTHER option up front before Pav came in from an injury in late Sept and then inevitably took time to settle?

Add to that Gomes being in the country for only a month too and then getting injured in one of the numerous fouls from Pulis' Stoke in one of the early games...

Then if you compare the squad/team that Ramos had then and Redknapp has now, perhaps you may be forgiven for thinking that Harry should really be doing better with this squad, although the reasons for the difficult start are valid - albeit less so than the situation Ramos had then.

So, once again, Mr Bullshit Revisionist, how do you explain the 3.5 MONTHS after the CC final for February to May in 2007/08 (nothing to do with the two points from eight games in 2008/09) that we played like utter toilet, despite having Berba and Keane together at the club, Woodgate largely available, and the majority of the rest of the squad all fit and available for selection every week?

When will you understand? Ramos wasn't sacked purely because of the dreadful start we had in 2008/09 (albeit you could hardly blame Levy even if that had been the case - which it wasn't - given that it was our worst EVER start to a league season), but just as much for the prolongued period of woeful form that we endured for nearly all of the back half of the 2007/08 season as well.

You act like those woeful months simply never existed, and it's a terrible falsification of what actually happened. Until Harry has a period where we can't buy a win for a period of 4-5 months, like Ramos did, then you simply make yourself look ludicrous by offering any favourable comparisons of Ramos against Redknapp.

 

[SpurSince57]

This really should bring out a wry smile...Somehow the same reasoning is hardly ever applied to the start of the season under Ramos, and yet just read the words above and think back to what he had to work with then:

BAE was injured, so Bale, one of our best attacking options - and just back from long injury himself - had to play left back; King was not fit to play many games...sounds familiar?
Our holding midfielders were Jenas and O'Hara - hardly the most solid combination; Huddlestone was more or less in his first full season and needed time to settle in; Modric been in the country about a month; Bentley...let's not even go there; Lennon was just finding his form after long injury...sounds even more familiar perhaps?

Our TWO main strikers and top goalscorers both departed and we were left with nervous Bent and the Man U youth reserve, who both did a good impression of invisible men most of the time...the bell is ringing louder, except Ramos did not have ANY OTHER option up front before Pav came in from an injury in late Sept and then inevitably took time to settle?

Add to that Gomes being in the country for only a month too and then getting injured in one of the numerous fouls from Pulis' Stoke in one of the early games...

Then if you compare the squad/team that Ramos had then and Redknapp has now, perhaps you may be forgiven for thinking that Harry should really be doing better with this squad, although the reasons for the difficult start are valid - albeit less so than the situation Ramos had then.

It's certainly brought out the bullshit.

 

[Gilzeanking]

Wha hey...read the whole thing ! Not a bad read as it goes . BBLG plain brilliant ,57 gave me a first chuckle ever , someone has quit the forum forever because of the thread ....bit of drama , good arguments .

I think its right that the imo complacent recent Harry interview allied to the overall indifferent team performances this year , should warrant a questioning thread of this nature . Don't think the questioners got too much aggro either..

I'm sure we all hope things pick up ,key players find form and we find some king of stability in team selection .Theres no doubt we're going through a bumpy patch , its a test of Harry's abilities and resolve . How he and his staff attempt to sort it will tell us a lot .

 

[BringBack_leGin]

Wha hey...read the whole thing ! Not a bad read as it goes . BBLG plain brilliant ,57 gave me a first chuckle ever , someone has quit the forum forever because of the thread ....bit of drama , good arguments .

I think its right that the imo complacent recent Harry interview allied to the overall indifferent team performances this year , should warrant a questioning thread of this nature . Don't think the questioners got too much aggro either..

I'm sure we all hope things pick up ,key players find form and we find some king of stability in team selection .Theres no doubt we're going through a bumpy patch , its a test of Harry's abilities and resolve . How he and his staff attempt to sort it will tell us a lot .

:dance:

Glad you enjoyed it. I think this has, in it's own way, ended up one of the best threads ever. Generally, people were quite respectful regardless of how apart their views were. Bit of a shame that kkemal got himself banned in such stupid fashion, talk about going out with a whimper. adiepf couldn't take it any more either. So many different posters with different views have made it all in all, quite a ride.

 

[Mornstar]

We've made an indifferent start but we are only three points off fourth, despite a horrendous injury list.

Unless we had Jesus as manager and he healed our injured players back to full fitness, I doubt anyone could have come up with a better team selection on Saturday.

I'm not 'Arry's biggest fan, but every team would struggle with the injuries we have had this season.

Or the player at Seville even, that would be soooo cool!

 

[Mr Pink]

What a ridiculous load of bollocks. Huddlestone and Jenas joined the club a month apart and every season Jenas has passed the ball more often, with more accuracy and more vision, has created more assists and scored more goals whilst tackling more. Huddlestone can't even manage two consistent halves let alone two games and you accuse me of bias ? Fucking laughable.

Flip me your sensitive - calm down, you'll have a fit.

Your stubborness totally clouds your judgement and please take your head out of the stat book - its boring. Its a limited way to draw conclusions solely on stats. Try using your eyes.

 

[Coyboy]

What a ridiculous load of bollocks. Huddlestone and Jenas joined the club a month apart

So did Davids and Lennon. Should they have been of the same standard?

This really should bring out a wry smile...Somehow the same reasoning is hardly ever applied to the start of the season under Ramos, and yet just read the words above and think back to what he had to work with then:

BAE was injured, so Bale, one of our best attacking options - and just back from long injury himself - had to play left back; King was not fit to play many games...sounds familiar?
Our holding midfielders were Jenas and O'Hara - hardly the most solid combination; Huddlestone was more or less in his first full season and needed time to settle in; Modric been in the country about a month; Bentley...let's not even go there; Lennon was just finding his form after long injury...sounds even more familiar perhaps?

Our TWO main strikers and top goalscorers both departed and we were left with nervous Bent and the Man U youth reserve, who both did a good impression of invisible men most of the time...the bell is ringing louder, except Ramos did not have ANY OTHER option up front before Pav came in from an injury in late Sept and then inevitably took time to settle?

Add to that Gomes being in the country for only a month too and then getting injured in one of the numerous fouls from Pulis' Stoke in one of the early games...

Then if you compare the squad/team that Ramos had then and Redknapp has now, perhaps you may be forgiven for thinking that Harry should really be doing better with this squad, although the reasons for the difficult start are valid - albeit less so than the situation Ramos had then.

1. King was fit to play against the mighty Krakow and Newcastle in the CC but not fit for the league. It was the same story as now. If anything, his knee or knees were less fucked.

2. Huddlestone was with with us for full seasons in 2006-7 and 2007-8. Absolute bullshit.

3. We had Zokora also as a CM.

4. What long injury had Lennon just had?

5. How do you know Bent was nervous? He still put away chances, of the few that were created. Aren't you forgetting Pav?

6. Gomes and Modric were new to the country, but it hardly took long from end of October onwards for them to find their form.

The comparison doesn't compute; and as scat said Ramos' team from the previous team had finished the season badly and insipidly; just as we did under Hoddle in 2003. Last season, we did quite well.

Why do you just make up facts now to suit your dying argument?

 

[Bus-Conductor]

So did Davids and Lennon. Should they have been of the same standard?

No, but then Lennon and Davids haven't spent five years competing for the same position like Huddlestone and Jenas have.

Did you actually disagree with my assessment that Jenas has been massively more consistent than Huddlestone over those five years or just felt the need to say something irrelevant in the absence of a typo to correct.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Flip me your sensitive - calm down, you'll have a fit.

Your stubborness totally clouds your judgement and please take your head out of the stat book - its boring. Its a limited way to draw conclusions solely on stats. Try using your eyes.

It must really irk you that the facts don't support what your eyes tell you. If I had your understanding of football the only thing I'd ever look at were stats.

.

 

[spurs_viola]

So did Davids and Lennon. Should they have been of the same standard?



1. King was fit to play against the mighty Krakow and Newcastle in the CC but not fit for the league. It was the same story as now. If anything, his knee or knees were less fucked.

2. Huddlestone was with with us for full seasons in 2006-7 and 2007-8. Absolute bullshit.

3. We had Zokora also as a CM.

4. What long injury had Lennon just had?

5. How do you know Bent was nervous? He still put away chances, of the few that were created. Aren't you forgetting Pav?

6. Gomes and Modric were new to the country, but it hardly took long from end of October onwards for them to find their form.

The comparison doesn't compute; and as scat said Ramos' team from the previous team had finished the season badly and insipidly; just as we did under Hoddle in 2003. Last season, we did quite well.

Why do you just make up facts now to suit your dying argument?

Some of the points in my post may indeed have been not 100% correct factually (eg Huddlestone did play in 2006-07 and 2007-08 seasons, but started in less than half of the games then, and the 2008-09 season was the first when he became the regular first team player at the age of not quite 21), but you cannot seriously say that the situation with the squad now is not much better than the one our coaches found themselves in the first month of that season. You cannot compare the two teams Ramos and Harry had for the first month then and now.
Or actually, yes, I know you will say that seriously - because you will say just about anything in this case to hide the main point behind smaller issues. You probably would say with a straight face that the option of having only Bent and F.Campbell (before Pav joined late Sept) were equivalent to the option of having Defoe (who only missed the last couple of matches), Pav, Keane and Crouch...

The point is not whether we were right to sack Ramos or not - this was covered hundreds of times already. The point I wanted to make in this thread is that we may be having similar difficulties with the team integration and injuries/unreplaced departures that we had at the start of season 2008-09. Except that our squad is much stronger now than it was then.

 

[Mr Pink]

No, but then Lennon and Davids haven't spent five years competing for the same position like Huddlestone and Jenas have.

Did you actually disagree with my assessment that Jenas has been massively more consistent than Huddlestone over those five years or just felt the need to say something irrelevant in the absence of a typo to correct.

Last season saw our best League finish since the inception of the PL. Huddlestone played more than any other player and Jenas was peripheral at best, albeit he had injury problems. Looking at it since the start of their careers with us totally suits you, again you ignore the fact that Huddlestone is a good bit younger and had no PL experience when he joined - Jenas had plenty.

Last season will go down as the significant one, whatever way you try and side step it.

 

[Mr Pink]

It must really irk you that the facts don't support what your eyes tell you. If I had your understanding of football the only thing I'd ever look at were stats.

.

Are you for real? lol..If you had any understanding of football, and I am guessing you've barely kicked a ball in your life, you would understand that there's alot more to the game than stats.

But fair play, you do make me laugh!

 

[Bobbins]

Some of the points in my post may indeed have been not 100% correct factually

Brilliant :lol:

Last season saw our best League finish since the inception of the PL. Huddlestone played more than any other player

I don't think Huddlestone had much to do with it, compared to say Bale, Gomes or Dawson.

He was ok - nothing more. His number of goals and assists is still far, far too low.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Are you for real? lol..If you had any understanding of football, and I am guessing you've barely kicked a ball in your life, you would understand that there's alot more to the game than stats.

But fair play, you do make me laugh!

So who do you think has been the better player so far this season, Jenas or Huddlestone ?

 

[Mr Pink]

Brilliant :lol:



I don't think Huddlestone had much to do with it, compared to say Bale, Gomes or Dawson.

He was ok - nothing more. His number of goals and assists is still far, far too low.

So by that basis Gomes and Dawson had more assits and goals than Huddlestone!...

You dont think Huddlestone had much to do with it? I would say the regular starting eleven had everything to do with it. Huddlestone also featured the most out of any outfield player and was pretty much the hub of the side - most things went through him which helped others to do their bit. He was totally central to our ability to retain possession well and was brillant at switching the play and opening the game up through his eye for a pass. Formed a great partnership with Palacios in the first half of the season and generally went from strength to strength.

Improved on his own shortcomings such as his mobility, or lack of it, and his positioning off the ball and tackling but still has a way to go yet in some of these areas.

I am not saying that Huddlestone was player of the season or anything like that, and the likes of the guys you mentioned, particularly Bale, stood out like a sore thumb in the closing months...but over the course of the season Huddlestone did well and was an integral part of the team and what it achieved. He provides the platform for so many of our attacks and I think many over look that and only see the end result, like the final ball or the goal itself.

I do agree he needs more goals though, and he should be getting more with that thunderous shot - but I think he will improve in that department.

Its no coincidence that Harry kept playing him and we have already seen that Harry does have the balls to drop players if they aint at it for long enough...Huddlestone was a main stay in the team on merit, simple as that and Harry most certainly saw his value even if others didn't.

 

[Mr Pink]

So who do you think has been the better player so far this season, Jenas or Huddlestone ?

Jenas.....

 

[roosh]

So what was our plan b against Wigan? What was our plan b against Man City, what was our plan B against Wolves?

We beat Wolves cause Hutton came on, BUT Hutton coming on was not cause Harry fancied him it was a forced change!!

I'm saying that HR aint got a clue how to win games if Plan A isnt working!!! And how many coaches do we have on the bench as well?? KB, JJ???

I know he's banned but just to reply to this.

Generally when your plan A is working, in terms of possession and domination, but the goals aren't coming, it is better to stay calm and stick with the plan. It is at times like that where strikers make all the difference.

A Plan B is only when things are going horribly wrong.

When you have a lot of possession, and are dominating a team, but just not taking your chances, then you tweak the Game Plan and bring on players who you hope will be more effective.