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It's the Euros 2020! Finals Match Thread: It’s gone to Rome…

Winner Euros 2020

  • England

    Votes: 64 21.6%

  • Belgium

    Votes: 14 4.7%

  • France

    Votes: 98 33.1%

  • Germany

    Votes: 13 4.4%

  • Italy

    Votes: 81 27.4%

  • Portugal

    Votes: 13 4.4%

  • Netherlands

    Votes: 2 0.7%

  • Other

    Votes: 11 3.7%
  • Total voters
    296
LSUY

LSUY

Well-Known Member
Jul 12, 2005
24,038
66,934
Why is France allowed to wear white shirts with blue shorts, but England can't?
 
werty

werty

Well-Known Member
Aug 8, 2005
25,121
26,418
Shadydan said:
Yeah it's not hard to understand why...because they play in systems that get the best out of them and under coaches who have half a clue in how to set their teams up. I'm not sure you really believe that if the likes of Tuchel, Pep or Klopp were managing this team that you'd be seeing the same average performances and lack of attacking intent or patterns that you're seeing now so I'm not sure why you point the fingers at the players, strange take.

Schick is the top scorer in the tournament, he's an average player player playing in a team which is setup to get the best out of him, that's 3 more than arguably the best striker in the world by the way who has look incredibly isolated and has had 0 shots on target in about 150m ins of football with the options of Sterling/Sancho/Foden/Grealish/Mount/Rashford which is criminal! you gonna tell me it's the players or the coaching/system?
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Playing at a club you play and train with the same players week-in, week-out. That's what made a huge difference. How many times have England line up with the attacking line-up yesterday? How long did it take Kane and Son to develop the relationship they had this season?

If any of those managers were in charge of England they wouldn't have them playing the same way they do at their clubs. Look how relatively poor City and Liverpool were at the start of their respective reigns. We were bad in Poch's first year too. One of the reasons why Gerrmany and France had been so successful is they've treated their team like a club team, and have played a regular team even when they weren't playing for club teams.

Please tell me the great set-up that went into Schick scoring from close to the halfway line and a penalty? Does Southgate get credit for Kane getting Golden boot at the last World Cup?
 
werty

werty

Well-Known Member
Aug 8, 2005
25,121
26,418
L.S.U.Yiddo said:
Why is France allowed to wear white shirts with blue shorts, but England can't?
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Maybe because Hungary are wearing white ones and they'd clash? I'm not keen on the single coloured kits team are asked to wear the past few tournaments
 
LSUY

LSUY

Well-Known Member
Jul 12, 2005
24,038
66,934
tiger666 said:
Where has it been said we aren't allowed to wear blue shorts?
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I'm assuming Fifa's kit rules are still in effect, as England and Germany have both worn white shorts so far.

werty said:
Maybe because Hungary are wearing white ones and they'd clash? I'm not keen on the single coloured kits team are asked to wear the past few tournaments
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That's what I thought, but then surely yesterday Scotland should have been allowed to wear their white shorts and England their usual blue.
 
A

Albertbarich

Well-Known Member
Jul 4, 2020
5,303
20,100
werty said:
It has fuck all do with "nationalism and hatred of England". Take your English bias out of it and you'll see that your team isn't that good.
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No bias on my side, can't be sure you can say the same.

Maguire isn't fit so it's irrelevant if he's the second coming of Bobby Moore, and he isn't worth 80m anyway. Stones is overrated. He had a good season, but everyone is so desperate for him to live up to the label that they gave him at Everton that any decent performance is overhyped and considered a sign of him finally reaching his "potential". Shaw is another who had a good season but isn't anything more than a slightly above average player. Chillwell i'm unsure about, and he wasn't even a automatic starter for Chelsea.
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All your opinion (anti English bias?) but all of those players you just knocked have just played in a European final. Hyperbole about Bobby Moore doesn't help your point either. Right now they're all starters at top European clubs, Scotland have two maybe three of those.

With the exception of Kane and Grealish (maybe Sancho too? I don't watch the Bundesliga), all of your attacking players are surrounded by better players that help elevate them. Mount is still inconsistent and neither him or Foden are ready to take on the burden on being the main creators of a team. People are expecting them to play to their potential now, and they are not there yet. Both are still young and at their first international tournament. You want them to play in the middle of a 433, yet neither of them do that for their club. Why do you think that is?
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Again easy to knock those players but mount and foden just played in the biggest game in the world. Mount has arguably been chelseas best player this season and if you don't think foden is a megastar waiting to happen then I cant help you.

If you think it's arrogant that a squad that has grealish, Mount, foden, Sterling, rashford and kane should be a potent attack than so be it but top teams across the world would snap any single one of them up in a heartbeat. They're top players whether they're English or not.

Foden has played that role on a 433 plenty of times btw and whilst Mount hadn't because chelsea don't play 433 he has played in a pivot and as a 10 so it wouldn't be a leap for him.

I'm no fan of Southgate, but no matter what he does he'll get stick. I think he should focus on what got you go the semis of the World cup, and that was being a set-piece team with a back five.
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Of course he will get knocked. He is in a high profile role paid a lot of money. Same way as spurs manager gets knocked. You're paid to perform.

So you want him to concentrate on being a set piece team despite having Mount, foden, grealish and sancho? OK.....
 
MassadaTom

MassadaTom

Well-Known Member
Aug 8, 2019
1,392
1,636
L.S.U.Yiddo said:
I'm assuming Fifa's kit rules are still in effect, as England and Germany have both worn white shorts so far.



That's what I thought, but then surely yesterday Scotland should have been allowed to wear their white shorts and England their usual blue.
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Is it about dark and light colours between home and away?
 
Shadydan

Shadydan

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2012
38,247
104,143
werty said:
Playing at a club you play and train with the same players week-in, week-out. That's what made a huge difference. How many times have England line up with the attacking line-up yesterday? How long did it take Kane and Son to develop the relationship they had this season?

If any of those managers were in charge of England they wouldn't have them playing the same way they do at their clubs. Look how relatively poor City and Liverpool were at the start of their respective reigns. We were bad in Poch's first year too. One of the reasons why Gerrmany and France had been so successful is they've treated their team like a club team, and have played a regular team even when they weren't playing for club teams.

Please tell me the great set-up that went into Schick scoring from close to the halfway line and a penalty? Does Southgate get credit for Kane getting Golden boot at the last World Cup?
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Well yes but that's the same for every nation, not just England - how many times do France/Germany/Holland meet up, it's the same all round. But the point is that those other nations all have a setup or system that gets the best out of their players, that's the difference.

I disagree, the vast majority of these players play under world class coaches and in systems that promote front foot football, you'd think that with all the tactical and technical ability they've picked up at club level they'd be able to make an easy transition over to international football. the high pressing, the intensity, the mentality should in theory easy to maintain at intl level so you need to play to their strengths and Southgate isn't doing that at all.

Yeah so forget about the goal against Scotland...the point about Schick which you're willfully missing is that he is more comfortable playing in a system that suits him, the evidence being that he's averaging 39 touches per game, 5 shots per game, 3 shots on target per game and 3 goals in a team who are largely crap (which is the reason why I used him as an extreme example) Compare that to Kane who is averaging 22.5 touches per game, 1.5 shots per game 0 shots on target per game (again utterley embarrassing) and 0 goals in a team who have the kind of attacking talents I already mentioned - what does that tell you?

It's not because the players aren't good enough or aren't all that or whatever, it's a lazy argument and an old one (once upon a time a lot of England players were over-rated compared to their compatriots on the world stage) - you don't even have to be world beaters to win matches, we see enough evidence in the Prem year in year out to know that. It's about the coaching and the system and the setup, if you don't have a competent coach to get the best out of the players then you're not gonna see the best of them and Southgate is clearly holding them back.
 
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