Mayweather vs Ortiz, Pacman vs Marquez
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Phantom
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- Jun 6, 2005
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It sounds like an absolute shocker (I didn't see it), apparently he landed 94 more shots than the American. For an american crowd to be booing the home fighter is probably indicative of how bad the decision was. Also read that many ringside experts had the match scored with rounds in the 9-3 and 11-1 range. Sounds like it wasn't even close, in the same category as lennox and holyfield "draw".
- Jul 27, 2004
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- #105
TBF here is another quote from him.
"I've never been as ashamed of the sport of boxing as I am tonight," said Arum, who handles both fighters.
Super Tottenham
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- Aug 31, 2010
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Just watched the fight, I reckon Bradley won 4 rounds. Pacman ran out of steam, but easily had enough rounds banked.
hans
Active Member
- Aug 8, 2005
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- #109
didnt hear him say that after the marquez fight haha
Arum is a scumbag. Yes he promotes both fighters, and i wouldnt be too surprised if he was involved in a bit of funny business here. THis quite easily ties manny into some more in house fights - Rematch with bradley in November, followed by the bradley trilogy fight in March 2013 probably - then another JMM fight. before the Bradley fight Arum said they'd be looking to fight Cotto again at a catchweight for the next fight! Nicely avoiding Floyd again. Something which shocked me was manny apparently had a guarenteed purse of $6m, while Bradley had $5m. In comparison Floyd had $32m vs Cotto (who got $8m himself).
I find the modern day Boxing "fan" a tad strange. Following fighters like you would a football club doesn't really work.
I'm on Boxrec, the best boxing forum going if any of you in to the sport fancy giving it a look, and even there you have Mayweather and Pacquiao fans who are delusional. They argue over who the greatest is and who earns more, who endorses more etc. Everything one does is instantly compared to the other, pacman is avoiding Floyd, Floyd is avoiding Pacman etc etc.
It's not like football ( say Arsenal - Tottenham ). These two fighters will be ancient history within a year or two, for a large portion of fans, they ceased being relevant a while back when it became obvious neither man seemed to want it ( my personal opinion? both want it but Floyd has an ego the size of a small planet and is generally a cock, Pacman is controlled by Arum, who makes Don King look like a choirboy ) and are content on taking on fighters who often have to give away a lot ( weight demands etc ), in order to bulk their records and more importantly, their bank balances.
Boxing is corrupt, always has been and I'm afraid it always will be unless something drastic changes. Even the local amatuer shows are corrupt to an extent ( go and watch a local club put on a show, anything deemed to be relatively close will always go to the fighter representing the club who's show it is )
The worst thing about it all is it seems an accepted practice.
I'm on Boxrec, the best boxing forum going if any of you in to the sport fancy giving it a look, and even there you have Mayweather and Pacquiao fans who are delusional. They argue over who the greatest is and who earns more, who endorses more etc. Everything one does is instantly compared to the other, pacman is avoiding Floyd, Floyd is avoiding Pacman etc etc.
It's not like football ( say Arsenal - Tottenham ). These two fighters will be ancient history within a year or two, for a large portion of fans, they ceased being relevant a while back when it became obvious neither man seemed to want it ( my personal opinion? both want it but Floyd has an ego the size of a small planet and is generally a cock, Pacman is controlled by Arum, who makes Don King look like a choirboy ) and are content on taking on fighters who often have to give away a lot ( weight demands etc ), in order to bulk their records and more importantly, their bank balances.
Boxing is corrupt, always has been and I'm afraid it always will be unless something drastic changes. Even the local amatuer shows are corrupt to an extent ( go and watch a local club put on a show, anything deemed to be relatively close will always go to the fighter representing the club who's show it is )
The worst thing about it all is it seems an accepted practice.
OmarsComing
Mentally Disturbed Individual!
- Jan 2, 2011
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Some guy tweeted afterwards that in the final round bookies were offering 100-1 on Bradley winning. So I guess there's a group of people who also thought Manny had it won. Maybe the judges had iphone betting accounts...
garyhopkins
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- Jun 22, 2008
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Even if I was thinking of hedging my bets, I'd have been thinking "Nah, there's no way on earth that Bradley won that". Absolutely crazy decision. How did two judges think Bradley had won? Oh, here's one:
"You've got to put the ball in the basket and Manny didn't put the ball in the basket enough. ... This isn't American Idol. If I judge for the people, I shouldn't be a judge. I went in with a clear mind and judged each round. ... I don't look at the punch stats but I saw Manny miss a lot of punches and Bradley hit Manny and win a lot of the exchanges. ... I'm comfortable with my performance. I thought Bradley gave Pacquiao a boxing lesson."
Bradley gave Pacquiao a boxing lesson? I think he must have slept through the first half of the fight. As for missing a lot of punches, Pacquiao still connected a lot more. He landed nearly 100 punches more than Bradley during the bout, and landed more in 10 out of the 12 rounds. Crazy, crazy stuff.
- Jan 14, 2004
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- #113
It was a strange decision. I was watching it on Philippine satellite and one commentator had Bradley winning 8-4 (about the only person I've heard thinking Bradley won) and the other had Manny winning 7-5. Personally I had it 7-5 to Manny but talk of it being 11-1 or 10-2 are way off as far as I'm concerned, it was a lot closer than that.
Manny came out slow and Bradley won the first two rounds pretty clearly, I think Manny was feeling him out and didn't really throw an awful lot whilst Bradley was having some success throwing double left jabs and keeping Manny at a distance. From then on it was mostly Manny through the middle rounds but the issue I have is that Bradley was actually the one controlling the rounds for the first 2 minutes, jabbing, moving Manny about and whilst he wasn't hurting him at all he was boxing smart. Manny would then have a spell at the end of each round and usually it was only 20 or 30 seconds where he would throw some big punches and at times he really had Bradley rocked. So you'd get to the end of the round and think that is a certain Manny round because Bradley's legs had turned to jelly and I'd much rather be Manny than Bradley right now but in truth Pacquiao didn't really do himself any favours by not doing a lot for the first 2 minutes of rounds.
Bradley came back well after he had weathered some pretty heavy rounds (no idea how many punches Pacquiao was throwing in those bursts but they were coming from all angles and it was just a flurry that Bradley to his credit was strong enough to get through each time). I had him winning 3 of the last 4 rounds as Manny continued his strange strategy of starting rounds slow but now without the onslaughts. Even when Manny threw some punches in the later rounds Bradley was answering and the fact that he was boxing better through the first minutes of the round gave him the edge.
I'm not even sure the punch stats are really reflective of what was going on in the fight. Manny's punch totals in the last minute were probably double the first two minutes and if you stopped each round at 2 minutes you'd wonder what the hell was going on and Bradley would probably be up by 10 or 11 rounds. But there was only one fighter that was hurt, those flurries can't really be discounted and Pacquiao won the fight. I don't think it is anywhere near as crazy as it is being made out to be though.
garyhopkins
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- Jun 22, 2008
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That's a very interesting take. I guess you saw what the judge saw. I don't really understand the scoring system (I must go and look it up), but I couldn't believe Manny had lost from the way he showed the most aggression allied to the punch stats while Bradley had largely been jabbing to keep him at distance.
It was very much like a game at the Lane where we were easily the better team, but found it very hard to break the opposition down and then were done by a sucker punch. Only this time it was two old men who may have had an agenda (what that agenda was i'm not exactly sure) or interpreted it as you convincingly wrote above (though as you say they were still wrong!).
- Jan 14, 2004
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- #115
I still think Pacquiao won 8-4 and I struggle to see how anyone could judge it 7-5 Bradley, but I do think Pacquiao relied too much on his huge swarms of punches late in rounds. Maybe those judges had watched the JMM fights and thought the JMM judges had been a little conned by Pacquiao's flurries.
It's a shame because I think if Bradley had lost he would have got a lot of respect for a good fight but the judges have made it a mockery.
AngerManagement
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- May 15, 2004
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It was a bad decision but I suppose over all its good for the sport of boxing because the Pacman/Mayweather fight always seemed unlikely to happen so better to create a credible and high profile fight to sell pay per views by having a rematch containing one of the worlds best on the come back trail looking to avenge his loss and regain his crown than just just have many relatively meaningless fights as the best guys pad their records in non competitive fights.
Its typical of boxing now days in general in my opinion, David Haye has been selling pay per views with freak show type hype in fights with no substance for the last few years (David vs Goliath when he won his title, The whole "rivalry" with Audley and now his WWF style fued with Chosira)
I've been mostly sick of boxing for years now, the big fights don't happen as much as they should and when they do they're a disappointment more often than not and I became a bigger fan of K1 and then Pride and UFC as a result.
The super 6 tournament was great for boxing though I feel and fighters like Kessler and Froch are exactly what the sport needs. Classy fighters like Mayweather and Ward are all well and good (and the sport does need such talent) but ultimately people want to watch exciting competitive battles in the ring.
The judging in this fight was bad for the sport because as in football no one wants to feel a fighter (or a team) has been cheated out of a result but one thing it surely does is build interest in a rematch. I mean I am sure most of us (myself certainly) have more interest in seeing Pacman trying to avenge his loss and become cap again than we would have had watch him in just another mundane defence against someone he is a heavy favourite and no one thinks he can lose.
Its typical of boxing now days in general in my opinion, David Haye has been selling pay per views with freak show type hype in fights with no substance for the last few years (David vs Goliath when he won his title, The whole "rivalry" with Audley and now his WWF style fued with Chosira)
I've been mostly sick of boxing for years now, the big fights don't happen as much as they should and when they do they're a disappointment more often than not and I became a bigger fan of K1 and then Pride and UFC as a result.
The super 6 tournament was great for boxing though I feel and fighters like Kessler and Froch are exactly what the sport needs. Classy fighters like Mayweather and Ward are all well and good (and the sport does need such talent) but ultimately people want to watch exciting competitive battles in the ring.
The judging in this fight was bad for the sport because as in football no one wants to feel a fighter (or a team) has been cheated out of a result but one thing it surely does is build interest in a rematch. I mean I am sure most of us (myself certainly) have more interest in seeing Pacman trying to avenge his loss and become cap again than we would have had watch him in just another mundane defence against someone he is a heavy favourite and no one thinks he can lose.
- Jan 14, 2004
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- #117
Well no disputing it this time. I thought Roach was going to model Amir Khan on Pacquiao not the other way round. Not sure where Manny goes from here but his head will be ringing for about a week.
OmarsComing
Mentally Disturbed Individual!
- Jan 2, 2011
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OmarsComing
Mentally Disturbed Individual!
- Jan 2, 2011
- 7,255
- 7,665
- Jan 14, 2004
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- #120
Funny. But there won't be a 5 let alone a 50. This one is done.
